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Jack Charlton
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shedite Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jan 2017 at 10:18pm
Originally posted by valo88 valo88 wrote:

This is bad news for us, how can so many not see through this???

Its designed to give the bigger teams a second chance should they need it, and thats it.

Regular Euro qualifying is going to lose out on the 3rd place playoff spots for this.

And to be able to win one of the 4 nations league places you need to finish top 4 in league A!

Were never going to be in league A, let alone finish top 4!

Its designed so the top 12 teams in UEFA can win assure themselves qualification.

That's not true. We have to finish in the top 4 of teams already not qualified!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote edthered Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jan 2017 at 11:12pm
Originally posted by valo88 valo88 wrote:

This is bad news for us, how can so many not see through this???

Its designed to give the bigger teams a second chance should they need it, and thats it.

Regular Euro qualifying is going to lose out on the 3rd place playoff spots for this.

And to be able to win one of the 4 nations league places you need to finish top 4 in league A!

Were never going to be in league A, let alone finish top 4!

Its designed so the top 12 teams in UEFA can win assure themselves qualification.



Only 1 of the teams in League A will get a qualifying spot tho. Each League gets one. So we *only* have to win our mini group then win the play off among all the group winners in our League. Clear as mud! It does mean that a bottom 16 team will definitely qualify
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote valo88 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Jan 2017 at 12:50am
Originally posted by edthered edthered wrote:

Originally posted by valo88 valo88 wrote:

This is bad news for us, how can so many not see through this???

Its designed to give the bigger teams a second chance should they need it, and thats it.

Regular Euro qualifying is going to lose out on the 3rd place playoff spots for this.

And to be able to win one of the 4 nations league places you need to finish top 4 in league A!

Were never going to be in league A, let alone finish top 4!

Its designed so the top 12 teams in UEFA can win assure themselves qualification.



Only 1 of the teams in League A will get a qualifying spot tho. Each League gets one. So we *only* have to win our mini group then win the play off among all the group winners in our League. Clear as mud! It does mean that a bottom 16 team will definitely qualify


No, they dont. league A gets the 4 spots. As shown below. You can only get promotion/relegation from B/C/D for the following campaign.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Fly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Jan 2017 at 1:35am
That's not right, you're looking at the overall Nation League Champions, which will be in June in 2019.

The playoff happens in March 2020, with the 4 highest ranked non-qualified teams in each league getting another chance.

  • In addition, the UEFA Nations League will provide teams with another chance to qualify for the UEFA EURO final tournament, with four sides qualifying through play-off matches which take place in March 2020 (see below).
  • The four remaining UEFA EURO 2020 places will be allocated to the winners of play-off matches which will take place in March 2020:
    • 16 sides will take part in the play-offs and are grouped four by four. Each group vies for one qualification spot.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SuperDave84 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Jan 2017 at 1:42am
The "final four competition" is different from the qualifying spots for the Euros. Each League (ABCD) gets a spot in the Euros.

And there are playoffs for those who don't make it.

Say the following happens:
10 of the teams in League A qualify for Euro 2020 through their qualifying groups.
8 of the teams in League B qualify for Euro 2020 through their qualifying groups.
2 of the teams in League C qualify for Euro 2020 through their qualifying groups.
And 0 from League D.

Then the playoffs would look as follows:
League A playoffs: 2 teams from League A (the two not already qualified), 2 teams from (I think) League C (the fifth and sixth ranked team who didn't qualify)
League B playoffs: 4 teams from League B (the four not already qualified)
League C playoffs: 4 teams from League C (the teams ranked 3 to 6 in League C)
League D playoffs: the top four teams

There is one small issue, and I'm not sure if the League A playoffs would have the 2 League A teams and the top two League B teams, or the 2 League A teams and the next 2 teams not already in the playoffs, which would be a pair of League C teams. I'd guess at the latter, for a number of reasons: not to penalise the teams who have already made the playoffs, not to give the teams in League A tough games etc etc (and I think the wording of the regulations suggest this).

In terms of the ranking of teams, I don't quite know how it will work. I think the four group winners in each case will count, but say you have a situation, in League B, where in one of the groups the first two teams have qualified for Euro 2020 already but the team who finished bottom have not, and in another group, none of the three teams qualified, and there were two playoff spots to be filled: would they go to one team from each group (i.e. the team bottom of the first group and the winner of the second), or the teams with the best overall record (likely the top two teams in the second group). I don't know the answer to that one, although I think it is the latter (they would count as the next best teams in the division I suppose)

But anyway, it will not be a complete disaster for us, even if the format is horrendously, unnecessarily complex.


Edited by SuperDave84 - 27 Jan 2017 at 1:50am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shedite Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Jan 2017 at 9:07am
Originally posted by valo88 valo88 wrote:

Originally posted by edthered edthered wrote:

Originally posted by valo88 valo88 wrote:

This is bad news for us, how can so many not see through this???

Its designed to give the bigger teams a second chance should they need it, and thats it.

Regular Euro qualifying is going to lose out on the 3rd place playoff spots for this.

And to be able to win one of the 4 nations league places you need to finish top 4 in league A!

Were never going to be in league A, let alone finish top 4!

Its designed so the top 12 teams in UEFA can win assure themselves qualification.



Only 1 of the teams in League A will get a qualifying spot tho. Each League gets one. So we *only* have to win our mini group then win the play off among all the group winners in our League. Clear as mud! It does mean that a bottom 16 team will definitely qualify


No, they dont. league A gets the 4 spots. As shown below. You can only get promotion/relegation from B/C/D for the following campaign.


That image is just to win the Nations League. This image shows the qualification routes....


It's a bit confusing alright that the same competition is used for 2 purposes.
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Jack Charlton
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shedite Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Jan 2017 at 9:11am
IMO, it will make it slightly harder for the 13-24 ranked UEFA teams to qualify. Previously they had to finish 3rd in their qualifying group and win one playoff group.

Now 3rd in qualifying group won't be worth a thing.

Instead, they'll have to likely win 2 their NL group, and then 2 playoff games against similar teams. At the same time, team ranked 25 has an easier route than teams 13-24, as they have to do the same, but against teams ranked 26-36.

As an aside, I hated that third placed teams got through, so happy enough with this.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shoco Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Jan 2017 at 9:27am
Originally posted by rolo rolo wrote:

The bottom 16 teams - the lower tier countries - are guaranteed one place at the tournament.

That will upset the elitist world cup snobs who think only the best teams should be involved.

FFS bore of and leave the petty nonsense out of the Ireland section

YOUR 3 IN A ROW LEAGUE CHAMPIONS
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote valo88 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Jan 2017 at 9:29am
I stand corrected so.

So in theory it'd be better for us to rank, lose a lot of our games and qualify for a playoff via C or D no?

Seems a bit flawed in that sense.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lassassinblanc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Jan 2017 at 9:57am
Originally posted by valo88 valo88 wrote:

I stand corrected so.

So in theory it'd be better for us to rank, lose a lot of our games and qualify for a playoff via C or D no?

Seems a bit flawed in that sense.


I thought this myself.

Another random question (probably asked and answered already but) if say if we are in League A and we finish 3rd in group all the other nations in League A qualify via normal qualifiers would we then qualify as the best League A not qualified without having to play a Playoff? or would we have to say a League B, C or D team?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gspain Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Jan 2017 at 10:34am
Originally posted by lassassinblanc lassassinblanc wrote:

Originally posted by valo88 valo88 wrote:

I stand corrected so.

So in theory it'd be better for us to rank, lose a lot of our games and qualify for a playoff via C or D no?

Seems a bit flawed in that sense.


I thought this myself.

Another random question (probably asked and answered already but) if say if we are in League A and we finish 3rd in group all the other nations in League A qualify via normal qualifiers would we then qualify as the best League A not qualified without having to play a Playoff? or would we have to say a League B, C or D team?

No there will still be league A playoffs even if it involves teams moving up from Group B and even C.  

If we end up in Group A we will be almost guaranteed a playoff at worst as surely more than 7 out of the other 11 will qualify.  If we end up in Group A and finish bottom of our group we still have a 50% chance of being a top seed for the 2020 qualifiers.  Group A would be fantastic for us in so many ways.

If we end up in Group B  then finishing at worst 2nd will be important as we avoid relegation to Group C and crucially will get a 2nd seed for the 2020 qualifiers.  

It is very very unlikely we will drop to Group C for 2018.   I think it is almost certain at least 16 of the qualifiers will come from Group A and Group B.  Hence worst case we will be involved in a 4 team playoff for a place in Euro 2020 in March 2020.  Hopefully we will qualify for 2020 via the qualifiers though.  


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gspain Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Jan 2017 at 10:41am
Originally posted by valo88 valo88 wrote:

I stand corrected so.

So in theory it'd be better for us to rank, lose a lot of our games and qualify for a playoff via C or D no?

Seems a bit flawed in that sense.

There is an incentive for the lower teams in C to drop to D.  The likes of Azerbaijan and Cyprus would have little chance to qualify for Euro2020 unless they dropped to Group D.  Ditto it is in the interests of Georgia and Belarus to remain in D. No harm in reminding the Georgians of that next September.  Big smile

We will almost certainly have a first time qualifier in 2020.

Otherwise it is better to stay as high as possible as it means a better seeding for qualifiers.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bitored Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Jan 2017 at 4:50pm
I hate this. Its pandering to everyone and weakening a major tournament at the same time.
Georgia could potentially make a Euros by beating the likes of Liechtenstein and Gibraltar.
While our route could potentially be Spain and Germany.
Where is the sense in that?


Edited by Bitored - 27 Jan 2017 at 4:51pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LHurlz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Jan 2017 at 4:58pm
Originally posted by Bitored Bitored wrote:

I hate this. Its pandering to everyone and weakening a major tournament at the same time.
Georgia could potentially make a Euros by beating the likes of Liechtenstein and Gibraltar.
While our route could potentially be Spain and Germany.
Where is the sense in that?
Agree, major tournaments should be qualified for through merit not sympathy.  Although I'd much rather have this instead of the usual meaningless friendlies.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Jan 2017 at 5:00pm
Originally posted by Bitored Bitored wrote:

I hate this. Its pandering to everyone and weakening a major tournament at the same time.
Georgia could potentially make a Euros by beating the likes of Liechtenstein and Gibraltar.
While our route could potentially be Spain and Germany.
Where is the sense in that?
In theory the Nations League isn't a bad idea, anything that tries to remove the monotonous test of endurance that is watching an international friendly is to be welcomed, why they have to overcomplicate matters is beyond me, especially as it is being introduced in time for the most complicated international competition in history. If it wasn't crazy enough having quarter finals in Asia and the semis in London they have decided to open up the most bizarre qualification scenario possible, all to whittle 55 teams down to 24. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stokeirish Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Jan 2017 at 7:39pm
Surely we would be in league 2 on current ranking? 🤔
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stokeirish Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Jan 2017 at 7:39pm
Originally posted by stokeirish stokeirish wrote:

Surely we would be in league 2 on current ranking? 🤔


Or league b even
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bitored Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Jan 2017 at 7:51pm
Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

Originally posted by Bitored Bitored wrote:

I hate this. Its pandering to everyone and weakening a major tournament at the same time.
Georgia could potentially make a Euros by beating the likes of Liechtenstein and Gibraltar.
While our route could potentially be Spain and Germany.
Where is the sense in that?
In theory the Nations League isn't a bad idea, anything that tries to remove the monotonous test of endurance that is watching an international friendly is to be welcomed, why they have to overcomplicate matters is beyond me, especially as it is being introduced in time for the most complicated international competition in history. If it wasn't crazy enough having quarter finals in Asia and the semis in London they have decided to open up the most bizarre qualification scenario possible, all to whittle 55 teams down to 24. 
MichelClapClapClapClap
I originally thought it was a way to give a competitive edge to what are now friendlies and I welcomed it.
Now, every time I read up on it I find something else I don't like about it.
 
The cynic in me is thinking its a way to tier qualifying in Europe so the likes of England and Germany don't have to drag their arse to Gibraltar or San Marino.
 
 
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