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Ireland v Bulgaria - Nations League - Wed 18th Nov

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Jack Charlton
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BrendanD88 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Nov 2020 at 12:35pm
Originally posted by avfc avfc wrote:

Originally posted by Baldrick Baldrick wrote:

The level of self loathing here is unbelievable.  You are making it out that Kenny sounds like Nidge or One of the lads from Love Hate ffs.  He is more like Larry Mullen who hasn’t done too bad. 

There is a huge element amongst the support base on here that has identity issues and they think only the outside can bring us to the promised land. 
 
Understandable. We have never qualified for a major tournament with a manager born in our jurisdiction.
 
 

Jurisdiction LOL
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Four-Four-Two Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Nov 2020 at 12:47pm
Originally posted by avfc avfc wrote:

Originally posted by Baldrick Baldrick wrote:

The level of self loathing here is unbelievable.  You are making it out that Kenny sounds like Nidge or One of the lads from Love Hate ffs.  He is more like Larry Mullen who hasn’t done too bad. 

There is a huge element amongst the support base on here that has identity issues and they think only the outside can bring us to the promised land. 
 
Understandable. We have never qualified for a major tournament with a manager born in our jurisdiction.
 
 

a partitionist too, you seem a great character 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Southstandman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Nov 2020 at 12:52pm
Anyone remember the Joey Barton interview LOL . Imagine Kenny trying a caper like that . 
vinney who ??
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sid waddell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Nov 2020 at 1:36pm
Originally posted by Four-Four-Two Four-Four-Two wrote:

Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

Originally posted by Devrozex Devrozex wrote:

Just so we're clear here, are you suggesting that Kenny should alter his accent in interviews? As in, like what Steve McClaren did in Holland?
Things aren't exactly going the Mae West for him right now but I can only imagine how bad they would get if he randomly started doing his interviews in a different accent...
It's not really a fixable problem at this stage

He's clearly not going to change ih, sorry, it

What I am saying is that that sort of lack of pronunciation, especially when coupled with a slow, ponderous manner of speaking, is one factor which adds up to somebody not being taken seriously in a job

Niall Quinn is quite instructive in this 

When Quinn had just gone off to Arsenal, he had a very different accent and manner of speaking, he was pure howya, awrigh bud

Somewhere over the next few years, he changed his voice to being what we now are familiar with - Mr. Elocution

Which has led to him being always taken very seriously as a person of substance and ability in the business and media world - even though from what I can make out, he's a pure spoofer

But there is a perception of him not being a spoofer because he has a clipped accent


quinn is from terenure ffs, completely different background to kenny and there's absolute no reason any person should hide their origins to please snobs like you
Quinn is from Perrystown

Quinn changed his accent from what it was
"ONE-NIL!" - David Coleman, George Hamilton - "Finding The Words - The Art of Commentary"

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sid waddell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Nov 2020 at 1:38pm
Originally posted by Baldrick Baldrick wrote:

The level of self loathing here is unbelievable.  You are making it out that Kenny sounds like Nidge or One of the lads from Love Hate ffs.  He is more like Larry Mullen who hasn’t done too bad. 

There is a huge element amongst the support base on here that has identity issues and they think only the outside can bring us to the promised land. 
Self loathing me arse, more like hard headed realism about how people think

Kenny doesn't sound like Nidge, he sounds like the Frank Stapleton Apres Match character


Edited by sid waddell - 19 Nov 2020 at 1:39pm
"ONE-NIL!" - David Coleman, George Hamilton - "Finding The Words - The Art of Commentary"

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Four-Four-Two Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Nov 2020 at 1:46pm
Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

Originally posted by Four-Four-Two Four-Four-Two wrote:

Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

Originally posted by Devrozex Devrozex wrote:

Just so we're clear here, are you suggesting that Kenny should alter his accent in interviews? As in, like what Steve McClaren did in Holland?
Things aren't exactly going the Mae West for him right now but I can only imagine how bad they would get if he randomly started doing his interviews in a different accent...
It's not really a fixable problem at this stage

He's clearly not going to change ih, sorry, it

What I am saying is that that sort of lack of pronunciation, especially when coupled with a slow, ponderous manner of speaking, is one factor which adds up to somebody not being taken seriously in a job

Niall Quinn is quite instructive in this 

When Quinn had just gone off to Arsenal, he had a very different accent and manner of speaking, he was pure howya, awrigh bud

Somewhere over the next few years, he changed his voice to being what we now are familiar with - Mr. Elocution

Which has led to him being always taken very seriously as a person of substance and ability in the business and media world - even though from what I can make out, he's a pure spoofer

But there is a perception of him not being a spoofer because he has a clipped accent


quinn is from terenure ffs, completely different background to kenny and there's absolute no reason any person should hide their origins to please snobs like you
Quinn is from Perrystown

Quinn changed his accent from what it was

provide evidence of this, because no one so far agrees with you. also provide quinns reason for such a massive accent change, as without this your argument that he did it "to be taken seriously" is a pure stab in the dark on your part. 

for what its worth, most specialists agree its virtually impossible to successfully change your accent as an adult, particularly to the almost flawless degree quinn would have had to in order for what you are saying to be true. the reality is that quinn sounds pure middle class south dublin, there is never any hint or anything other than this is the way he speaks, ever. achieving such a transformation would be, as i said, virtually impossible
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sid waddell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Nov 2020 at 2:26pm
Originally posted by Four-Four-Two Four-Four-Two wrote:

Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

Originally posted by Four-Four-Two Four-Four-Two wrote:

Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

Originally posted by Devrozex Devrozex wrote:

Just so we're clear here, are you suggesting that Kenny should alter his accent in interviews? As in, like what Steve McClaren did in Holland?
Things aren't exactly going the Mae West for him right now but I can only imagine how bad they would get if he randomly started doing his interviews in a different accent...
It's not really a fixable problem at this stage

He's clearly not going to change ih, sorry, it

What I am saying is that that sort of lack of pronunciation, especially when coupled with a slow, ponderous manner of speaking, is one factor which adds up to somebody not being taken seriously in a job

Niall Quinn is quite instructive in this 

When Quinn had just gone off to Arsenal, he had a very different accent and manner of speaking, he was pure howya, awrigh bud

Somewhere over the next few years, he changed his voice to being what we now are familiar with - Mr. Elocution

Which has led to him being always taken very seriously as a person of substance and ability in the business and media world - even though from what I can make out, he's a pure spoofer

But there is a perception of him not being a spoofer because he has a clipped accent


quinn is from terenure ffs, completely different background to kenny and there's absolute no reason any person should hide their origins to please snobs like you
Quinn is from Perrystown

Quinn changed his accent from what it was

provide evidence of this, because no one so far agrees with you. also provide quinns reason for such a massive accent change, as without this your argument that he did it "to be taken seriously" is a pure stab in the dark on your part. 

for what its worth, most specialists agree its virtually impossible to successfully change your accent as an adult, particularly to the almost flawless degree quinn would have had to in order for what you are saying to be true. the reality is that quinn sounds pure middle class south dublin, there is never any hint or anything other than this is the way he speaks, ever. achieving such a transformation would be, as i said, virtually impossible
Quinn sounds pure middle class Dublin now and has done since the late 1980s, duh

The point is he did not used to speak this way, I've seen clips of him as a young lad speaking pure Dub, he changed his accent in the mid to late 80s

Quinn clearly had his eye on life after football from an early stage and decided to "get rid of the rough edges", as it were

Name me a few self styled corporate high flyer types of the sort Quinn is now who speak like he did in 1984 or 1985 and you might have a point

There's a reason Fred Rickwood was created as a character, Trevor Welch is a real life one, an on screen accent and an off screen one

People are judged on accents all the time and they regularly have been on this forum

The Terry Venables Apres Match character is basically a ridiculing of his accent, the way people talk about Harry Redknapp is inherently based on his accent, nobody addressed the points I made about how Staunton speaks or Michael Healy Rae or Kevin O'Keeffe or Peter Fitzpatrick



"ONE-NIL!" - David Coleman, George Hamilton - "Finding The Words - The Art of Commentary"

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Zinedine Kilbane 110 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Nov 2020 at 2:58pm
Originally posted by Four-Four-Two Four-Four-Two wrote:

Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

Originally posted by Four-Four-Two Four-Four-Two wrote:

Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

Originally posted by Devrozex Devrozex wrote:

Just so we're clear here, are you suggesting that Kenny should alter his accent in interviews? As in, like what Steve McClaren did in Holland?
Things aren't exactly going the Mae West for him right now but I can only imagine how bad they would get if he randomly started doing his interviews in a different accent...
It's not really a fixable problem at this stage

He's clearly not going to change ih, sorry, it

What I am saying is that that sort of lack of pronunciation, especially when coupled with a slow, ponderous manner of speaking, is one factor which adds up to somebody not being taken seriously in a job

Niall Quinn is quite instructive in this 

When Quinn had just gone off to Arsenal, he had a very different accent and manner of speaking, he was pure howya, awrigh bud

Somewhere over the next few years, he changed his voice to being what we now are familiar with - Mr. Elocution

Which has led to him being always taken very seriously as a person of substance and ability in the business and media world - even though from what I can make out, he's a pure spoofer

But there is a perception of him not being a spoofer because he has a clipped accent


quinn is from terenure ffs, completely different background to kenny and there's absolute no reason any person should hide their origins to please snobs like you
Quinn is from Perrystown

Quinn changed his accent from what it was

provide evidence of this, because no one so far agrees with you. also provide quinns reason for such a massive accent change, as without this your argument that he did it "to be taken seriously" is a pure stab in the dark on your part. 

for what its worth, most specialists agree its virtually impossible to successfully change your accent as an adult, particularly to the almost flawless degree quinn would have had to in order for what you are saying to be true. the reality is that quinn sounds pure middle class south dublin, there is never any hint or anything other than this is the way he speaks, ever. achieving such a transformation would be, as i said, virtually impossible

A young Niall Quinn speaking very well. He is no howya- 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Four-Four-Two Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Nov 2020 at 3:06pm
Originally posted by Zinedine Kilbane 110 Zinedine Kilbane 110 wrote:

Originally posted by Four-Four-Two Four-Four-Two wrote:

Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

Originally posted by Four-Four-Two Four-Four-Two wrote:

Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

Originally posted by Devrozex Devrozex wrote:

Just so we're clear here, are you suggesting that Kenny should alter his accent in interviews? As in, like what Steve McClaren did in Holland?
Things aren't exactly going the Mae West for him right now but I can only imagine how bad they would get if he randomly started doing his interviews in a different accent...
It's not really a fixable problem at this stage

He's clearly not going to change ih, sorry, it

What I am saying is that that sort of lack of pronunciation, especially when coupled with a slow, ponderous manner of speaking, is one factor which adds up to somebody not being taken seriously in a job

Niall Quinn is quite instructive in this 

When Quinn had just gone off to Arsenal, he had a very different accent and manner of speaking, he was pure howya, awrigh bud

Somewhere over the next few years, he changed his voice to being what we now are familiar with - Mr. Elocution

Which has led to him being always taken very seriously as a person of substance and ability in the business and media world - even though from what I can make out, he's a pure spoofer

But there is a perception of him not being a spoofer because he has a clipped accent


quinn is from terenure ffs, completely different background to kenny and there's absolute no reason any person should hide their origins to please snobs like you
Quinn is from Perrystown

Quinn changed his accent from what it was

provide evidence of this, because no one so far agrees with you. also provide quinns reason for such a massive accent change, as without this your argument that he did it "to be taken seriously" is a pure stab in the dark on your part. 

for what its worth, most specialists agree its virtually impossible to successfully change your accent as an adult, particularly to the almost flawless degree quinn would have had to in order for what you are saying to be true. the reality is that quinn sounds pure middle class south dublin, there is never any hint or anything other than this is the way he speaks, ever. achieving such a transformation would be, as i said, virtually impossible

A young Niall Quinn speaking very well. He is no howya- 


so as expected, sid talking nonsense in order to try and shroud his despicable classist opinions as reasonable. reminds me of the old chestnut "im not racist, sure i have a black friend!"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sid waddell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Nov 2020 at 3:12pm
Originally posted by Zinedine Kilbane 110 Zinedine Kilbane 110 wrote:

Originally posted by Four-Four-Two Four-Four-Two wrote:

Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

Originally posted by Four-Four-Two Four-Four-Two wrote:

Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

Originally posted by Devrozex Devrozex wrote:

Just so we're clear here, are you suggesting that Kenny should alter his accent in interviews? As in, like what Steve McClaren did in Holland?
Things aren't exactly going the Mae West for him right now but I can only imagine how bad they would get if he randomly started doing his interviews in a different accent...
It's not really a fixable problem at this stage

He's clearly not going to change ih, sorry, it

What I am saying is that that sort of lack of pronunciation, especially when coupled with a slow, ponderous manner of speaking, is one factor which adds up to somebody not being taken seriously in a job

Niall Quinn is quite instructive in this 

When Quinn had just gone off to Arsenal, he had a very different accent and manner of speaking, he was pure howya, awrigh bud

Somewhere over the next few years, he changed his voice to being what we now are familiar with - Mr. Elocution

Which has led to him being always taken very seriously as a person of substance and ability in the business and media world - even though from what I can make out, he's a pure spoofer

But there is a perception of him not being a spoofer because he has a clipped accent


quinn is from terenure ffs, completely different background to kenny and there's absolute no reason any person should hide their origins to please snobs like you
Quinn is from Perrystown

Quinn changed his accent from what it was

provide evidence of this, because no one so far agrees with you. also provide quinns reason for such a massive accent change, as without this your argument that he did it "to be taken seriously" is a pure stab in the dark on your part. 

for what its worth, most specialists agree its virtually impossible to successfully change your accent as an adult, particularly to the almost flawless degree quinn would have had to in order for what you are saying to be true. the reality is that quinn sounds pure middle class south dublin, there is never any hint or anything other than this is the way he speaks, ever. achieving such a transformation would be, as i said, virtually impossible

A young Niall Quinn speaking very well. He is no howya- 

Quinn's accent, pronunciation and projection there is much different to what it was in later years, there's a much more noticeable Dublinese to it, he's way more hesitant and nervous in the way he talks and his pronunciation of words is different - "trainin'", not "training", "behher", not "better", "shouh" not "shout"
"ONE-NIL!" - David Coleman, George Hamilton - "Finding The Words - The Art of Commentary"

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote orourkeda Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Nov 2020 at 3:16pm
Anyway, the match was shyte.

(In my northside Dublin accent)


Edited by orourkeda - 19 Nov 2020 at 3:17pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sid waddell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Nov 2020 at 3:16pm
Originally posted by Four-Four-Two Four-Four-Two wrote:


so as expected, sid talking nonsense in order to try and shroud his despicable classist opinions as reasonable. reminds me of the old chestnut "im not racist, sure i have a black friend!"
You clearly didn't watch the video

You're going nuts now

Apparently the Apres Match parody of Frank Stapleton was racist now, or something like that

While the same people making these arguments are totally silent on real racism

When people reach for these sort of arguments because they can't rebut them, it really does betray a default fake victimhood which is veiled by desperate mud flinging

Ironically this is exactly what Trump supporters do
"ONE-NIL!" - David Coleman, George Hamilton - "Finding The Words - The Art of Commentary"

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bohsbrother Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Nov 2020 at 3:18pm
Jaysus, some absolute tripe in here!

I actually thought before last night that someone in the FAI media team had clearly been on to Kenny as his pre-game press conference he was pausing instead of sounding confused by saying ehhhh while thinking of a response to each question, the post game one was back to his natural sounding a little unsure of himself and stumbling/stuttering but that really doesn't change his ability as a manager.

He got a chance to take the 21s to the Toulon tournament and it gave him the chance to work on shape, style, bonding the group etc...  
I don't think that's possible at senior level as the clubs won't want to release players for a friendly tournament but it's they type of thing that could pay dividends. Using so many players over 2 international breaks is great that it ups the experience level but it means very few have had a chance to work over a period with the current setup and take on board what they want, especially with the disruption during the windows of Covid cases.

I expected us to be better than we were last night but realistically from the squad selection we were without 3 of our first choice back 4, 2 (possibly 3) of our first choice 3 centre mids, at least 1 of our 2 wingers and our first choice striker.

It was as close to a second string 11 as we will probably ever see Ireland play.

Before the game I still expected us to win but most of the players had only a few days to work with the management team and it was probably an ask too much. Thankfully we have a decent break until the next games, hopefully we have a full squad and we can then start to judge Kenny properly.

The last 2 windows have sown the doubts now so it's time to see if Kenny can change it.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Terzino Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Nov 2020 at 3:26pm
A thread about the game has descended into one about accents! In a game dominated by the working classes of the world, Kenny needs elocution lessons?

That'll make Ireland pass the ball better!

All the nil alls have clearly driven Sid Waddell crazy.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sid waddell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Nov 2020 at 3:44pm
Originally posted by Terzino Terzino wrote:

A thread about the game has descended into one about accents! In a game dominated by the working classes of the world, Kenny needs elocution lessons?

That'll make Ireland pass the ball better!

All the nil alls have clearly driven Sid Waddell crazy.
The two matches against Finland, and the England and Wales games in the last week sadly did not finish nil all

However one thing that has been a constant over the last seven matches is the words "Ireland nil"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Four-Four-Two Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Nov 2020 at 3:51pm
Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

Originally posted by Four-Four-Two Four-Four-Two wrote:


so as expected, sid talking nonsense in order to try and shroud his despicable classist opinions as reasonable. reminds me of the old chestnut "im not racist, sure i have a black friend!"
You clearly didn't watch the video

You're going nuts now

Apparently the Apres Match parody of Frank Stapleton was racist now, or something like that

While the same people making these arguments are totally silent on real racism

When people reach for these sort of arguments because they can't rebut them, it really does betray a default fake victimhood which is veiled by desperate mud flinging

Ironically this is exactly what Trump supporters do

there is only one person going nuts here, and it is the one hearing what they want to hear despite no one else agreeing with them. you say quinn spoke different as a young lad, and you have been provided with clear proof he did not (save being a little more high pitched) yet you persist in a delusion he has ran the accent gauntlet from the slums up to the boardrooms


Edited by Four-Four-Two - 19 Nov 2020 at 3:51pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote amccarten313 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Nov 2020 at 4:00pm
positives- O'Shea has been good across a few positions. knight was good, encouraging given he is just 19. i thought cullen was good again. horgan wasnt great on the night but across these games proved hes worth a place in the squad and offers something.

negatives:

- for whatever reason, no matter the opposition or our back 4, we just look so fragile/likely to concede. Duffy is struggling for form. K long proven to be reliable backup but i hate to say it, at this point i think you have to consider, given that o'shea has looked good and that we have the recurring coleman/doherty debate at right back, this duffy's place is under threat. i think our best back line could be coleman/doherty, o'shea, egan, stevens, or if we go wing backs- doherty, o'shea/duffy/coleman (pick 2 of 3), egan, stevens.

- again not sure why but for whatever reason hourihane has struggled reasonably badly for us. invisible for the most part. it was frustrating when he was doing well at villa and couldnt replicate it but now he isnt in the team there at all, doesnt look like hell get back in either considering theyre doing well. brady for me is also underwhelming for some time now, and while hendrick has improved recently, brady is just not worth his place. i think our best midfield is some combo of cullen, molumby, browne, hendrick, knight

- maybe the biggest and most obvious; with mcgoldrick retired we just don't really have many great options up front. parrott been hurt, long out of the team at southampton, obafemi even further in the cold there, idah struggling for game time at norwich, robinson and connolly not no9s. collins works hard but is limited. maguire isnt the answer either. i just dont know how we can best set upthe team in light of this huge shortcoming. i think a front 3 with robinson and connolly either side is probably best, but there are really limited options. to the extent that i understand trying to give idah time as he is 19 but can improve, but i think shane long is probably the best option right now.

long post but i think injuries/corona aside our best team is something like

Randolph; Coleman/Doherty, oshea, Egan, Stevens; Molumby, Cullen, Hendrick; Robinson, ___, Connolly
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sid waddell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Nov 2020 at 4:29pm
Originally posted by Four-Four-Two Four-Four-Two wrote:

Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

Originally posted by Four-Four-Two Four-Four-Two wrote:


so as expected, sid talking nonsense in order to try and shroud his despicable classist opinions as reasonable. reminds me of the old chestnut "im not racist, sure i have a black friend!"
You clearly didn't watch the video

You're going nuts now

Apparently the Apres Match parody of Frank Stapleton was racist now, or something like that

While the same people making these arguments are totally silent on real racism

When people reach for these sort of arguments because they can't rebut them, it really does betray a default fake victimhood which is veiled by desperate mud flinging

Ironically this is exactly what Trump supporters do

there is only one person going nuts here, and it is the one hearing what they want to hear despite no one else agreeing with them. you say quinn spoke different as a young lad, and you have been provided with clear proof he did not (save being a little more high pitched) yet you persist in a delusion he has ran the accent gauntlet from the slums up to the boardrooms
He did speak differently, in accent, pronunciation and projection - listen to the video

You're literally believing only what you want to believe now

It's mad how so many people who still believe Kenny is the answer have descended into this rabbit hole now where they don't believe their eyes and they don't believe their ears

They've retreated into a world of fake victimhood, projection and denial of reality

It's pure Trump

Remarkable stuff





Edited by sid waddell - 19 Nov 2020 at 4:29pm
"ONE-NIL!" - David Coleman, George Hamilton - "Finding The Words - The Art of Commentary"

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