Cor&#111;navirus - Remain Calm. Do Not Panic

Quote TRV

Thanks(0)

Quote

Posted: 17 Nov 2021 at 8:25am

We need to make sure the soon to be triple jabbed are not turning on the double jabbed

2 more weeks and we can flatten the curve Clap

Shedite

Jack Charlton

Joined: 09 Dec 2011
Status: Offline
Points: 9828

Post Options

Thanks(0)

Quote

Posted: 17 Nov 2021 at 8:51am

For those saying we need a bigger health service, how much more would you spend on it? How much bigger would you want it after Covid, happy then to be overpaying for a larger health service when it's no longer needed?

And then secondly, what are ya cutting from the budget to pay for it?

9fingers

Paul McGrath

Ballymun Resident #MONKEANO

Joined: 30 Jan 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 16149

Post Options

Quote 9fingers

Thanks(0)

Quote

Posted: 17 Nov 2021 at 9:02am

Shedite wrote:

For those saying we need a bigger health service, how much more would you spend on it? How much bigger would you want it after Covid, happy then to be overpaying for a larger health service when it's no longer needed?

And then secondly, what are ya cutting from the budget to pay for it?

Probably the nonsense €5 “we put back in everyone’s pocket” would be the first thing.

gufct

Jack Charlton

Trapattoni could manage me any day!

Joined: 15 Feb 2009
Location: Ireland
Status: Offline
Points: 6518

Post Options

Quote gufct

Thanks(0)

Quote

Posted: 17 Nov 2021 at 9:18am

selfishness and greed are the biggest problem. Everywhere we went in Luxembourg all our covid id’s were checked and mask wearing was obligatory. I haven’t been checked once in my hometown and the pubs are wedged.

One City,One County,One Club GUFC will be back.

BigStrongMan View Drop Down

Robbie Keane

Just Modding Like

Joined: 22 May 2009
Location: Ireland
Status: Offline
Points: 107645

Post Options

Quote BigStrongMan

Thanks(0)

Quote

Posted: 17 Nov 2021 at 10:13am

gufct wrote:

selfishness and greed are the biggest problem. Everywhere we went in Luxembourg all our covid id’s were checked and mask wearing was obligatory. I haven’t been checked once in my hometown and the pubs are wedged.

The certs were checked everywhere in Lux but there was zero rules once in the pub. Boozers were like zoos, with little or no rules applying

PM me for all forum moderation queries.

t_rAndy

Robbie Keane

Joined: 06 Feb 2008
Location: Ireland
Status: Offline
Points: 26266

Post Options

Quote t_rAndy

Thanks(0)

Quote

Posted: 17 Nov 2021 at 10:34am

Hospital beds are always the biggest problem this time of the year with the regular Flu season. Now Covid has exacerbated our annual failings in this area by a multiple of 2 or more. Now we are walking into another christmas lockdown because the hospitals can't cope.

Vaccines were supposed to be our way out of this but our numbers are more or less what they were when there was no vaccination. We are not going to be able to wipe out this disease similar to how we can't wipe out the flu or common cold. We need to therefore prepare for these spikes in hospitalizations. The fact that we haven't and are once again going to have to react with a lockdown is so frustrating.

Amount of money they spend on PUP during lockdowns they could build multiple dedicated hospitals for Covid. They don't need to be anything too fancy, the care for a covid patient would be pretty similar and equipment same. Take that population out of hospitals. Ok, you might get outbreaks but if you send people with worsening symptoms needing hospital admission directly to the covid hospital then these outbreaks will be less likely. Let the regular hospitals get on as normal. Let's face it, if hospitals were not under pressure then we wouldn't be talking about restrictions, it's only caused by the pressure on the hospitals.

Shedite

Jack Charlton

Joined: 09 Dec 2011
Status: Offline
Points: 9828

Post Options

Thanks(0)

Quote

Posted: 17 Nov 2021 at 10:51am

t_rAndy wrote:

Vaccines were supposed to be our way out of this but our numbers are more or less what they were when there was no vaccination. We are not going to be able to wipe out this disease similar to how we can't wipe out the flu or common cold. We need to therefore prepare for these spikes in hospitalizations. The fact that we haven't and are once again going to have to react with a lockdown is so frustrating.

I think you've a very short memory on this on Andy. Last November we had no vaccines, but we also couldn't go to Ireland matches home or away. We've far more freedoms this year because of the vaccine. Until all the anti-vaxxers cop on we're still going to have cases.

t_rAndy wrote:

Building more hospital beds to handle covid cases is like handling obesity by making clothes and seats bigger.

gufct

Jack Charlton

Trapattoni could manage me any day!

Joined: 15 Feb 2009
Location: Ireland
Status: Offline
Points: 6518

Post Options

Quote gufct

Thanks(0)

Quote

Posted: 17 Nov 2021 at 11:06am

the pup I’m Portugal was €350 a month and there was no support payments fir hospitality.

One City,One County,One Club GUFC will be back.

t_rAndy

Robbie Keane

Joined: 06 Feb 2008
Location: Ireland
Status: Offline
Points: 26266

Post Options

Quote t_rAndy

Thanks(0)

Quote

Posted: 17 Nov 2021 at 11:09am

Shedite wrote:

t_rAndy wrote:

Building more hospital beds to handle covid cases is like handling obesity by making clothes and seats bigger.

I don't have a short memory. I am not against the vaccine or anything and no doubt they have helped prevent more people getting more sick than they would have without it and they have allowed us to open up society. But they were not the silver bullet that we promised they were and it's not because of the 7% vaccinated. The virus is relentless and we won't be able to wipe it out any time soon and the cold reality is we are likely going to be in a situation that on Christmas Day we will be again told not to visit other households....exactly the same place we were last year despite vaccine. Time will tell if it goes that far but it looks bleak to me.

Obviously, the science will get better and hopefully we get better vaccines and more importantly better treatment for those infected but I do think if we really want to get on and avoid annual lockdowns then we need to think of something more concentrated like dedicated hospitals to take patients out of the general hospotial population.

Edited by t_rAndy - 17 Nov 2021 at 11:10am

notpropaganda73 View Drop Down

Liam Brady

Joined: 17 Feb 2016
Location: Donegal
Status: Online
Points: 1067

Post Options

Quote notpropaganda73

Thanks(0)

Quote

Posted: 17 Nov 2021 at 11:17am

And then secondly, what are ya cutting from the budget to pay for it?

A more well run and bigger health service is like insurance, so just because I don't need it right now, I'd like it to be in great shape on the off chance I do need it - whether that's COVID related or not. In terms of the budget, the hand wringing over that is laughable. There is always money for health - though I agree that for the money we spend on health, the returns are pathetic. But there is no proper accountability for a good health service in this country, so that's what needs to change first.

Even the idea that you "overpay" for a health service that's "no longer needed" is just strange to me. Why talk about a hypothetical expensive service that's no longer needed when we are so far behind what is needed right now? Why jump ahead to this mythical future where somehow, the money is spent well and we have a top tier health service that is free for citizens, but 1000s of empty beds and doctors and nurses twiddling their thumbs and suddenly we're all angry about funding them?

It's nonsense and as a point it only serves as a distraction to the fact the HSE is a shambles. It's the same sh*te that comes out when you suggest there should be better public transport in the country.

Cabra Hoop View Drop Down

Roy Keane

Joined: 06 Feb 2012
Location: Royal County
Status: Offline
Points: 10854

Post Options

Quote Cabra Hoop

Thanks(0)

Quote

Posted: 17 Nov 2021 at 12:03pm

gufct wrote:

the pup I’m Portugal was €350 a month and there was no support payments fir hospitality.

House prices and general cost of living in Portugal lower than here, so not comparable. And let's be honest one of the main reasons for the generous financial supports here has been to ensure people could pay their mortgages/rents to protect the banks

" BFC always gives me a laugh........ "

GoneToShowgies View Drop Down

Ray Houghton

Joined: 28 Jul 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 3991

Post Options

Quote GoneToShowgies

Thanks(0)

Quote

Posted: 17 Nov 2021 at 12:17pm

PUP is not gonna be free money, no such thing as a free lunch. Im sure revenue will come knocking sooner or later.

counterlock View Drop Down

Davey Langan

Joined: 07 Feb 2013
Status: Offline
Points: 924

Post Options

Quote counterlock

Thanks(0)

Quote

Posted: 17 Nov 2021 at 12:23pm

And then secondly, what are ya cutting from the budget to pay for it?

The money turned up very quick when they needed it for PUP. If that was ploughed into the health service in a meaningful way (ie. more beds, modernising hospitals, more doctors, more nurses, increase in payments for nurses), we'd be coming out the other side of this with the virus under much better control and with a functioning health service. Instead we are exactly where we were last November.

And we are going to see massive tax hikes to cover this bill, whatever happens. The HSE are an absolute black hole because of administrators on huge money actually doing nothing to contribute to the running of the health service. The right move was to set up a parallel service early last year, with the eventual goal of taking over the running of the HSE and get these high paid civil servants off the books.

B6 6HE

Liam Brady

Joined: 25 Aug 2021
Status: Offline
Points: 1028

Post Options

Quote B6 6HE

Thanks(0)

Quote

Posted: 17 Nov 2021 at 12:39pm

And then secondly, what are ya cutting from the budget to pay for it?

Spend it better.

We are one of the biggest spenders in Europe with much worse services generally.

We have LESS public beds than we had in 1988. With a bigger population.

Exhibit A

Children's Hospital

thebronze14 View Drop Down

Jack Charlton

Derry City Til I Die

Joined: 22 Feb 2011
Location: Dublin/Donegal
Status: Offline
Points: 7184

Post Options

Quote thebronze14

Thanks(0)

Quote

Posted: 17 Nov 2021 at 12:58pm

Were you checked once for ID with it? Pointless if not. Antigen testing the way to go as people with the vaccine are passing it on but the government were late to the party with that too...

Shedite

Jack Charlton

Joined: 09 Dec 2011
Status: Offline
Points: 9828

Post Options

Thanks(0)

Quote

Posted: 17 Nov 2021 at 1:10pm

notpropaganda73 wrote:

And then secondly, what are ya cutting from the budget to pay for it?

I suppose what I don't think we should do, is build a massive new hospital, hire loads more staff, build another 500 ICU beds and ICU doctors to cater for today's demand. Then realise in 3 years time, we only need 300 ICU beds then but have the bill for running 1000. Granted it'd give us a top tier health service, but it'd leave feck all money for transport, housing or anything else we need it for.

I'm all for a top tier health service if we're willing to pay for it.

Shedite

Jack Charlton

Joined: 09 Dec 2011
Status: Offline
Points: 9828

Post Options

Thanks(0)

Quote

Posted: 17 Nov 2021 at 1:12pm

B6 6HE wrote:

And then secondly, what are ya cutting from the budget to pay for it?

Spend it better.

We are one of the biggest spenders in Europe with much worse services generally.

We have LESS public beds than we had in 1988. With a bigger population.

Exhibit A

Children's Hospital

Children's hospital isn't even open yet, that's a procurement/construction issue.

"Spending it better" means what? Pay doctors/nurses less?

Shedite

Jack Charlton

Joined: 09 Dec 2011
Status: Offline
Points: 9828

Post Options