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Saipan - Who was right? |
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decky_eire 
Kevin Kilbane 
Joined: 14 Oct 2010 Location: Waterford Status: Offline Points: 213 |
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 Posted: 23 Nov 2022 at 11:09am |
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I often wonder if we Mick had somebody like Irwin still around the squad (granted I know he was long retired and pushing 37 and playing with Wolves) or if he had brought John O Shea could that have helped Keane with the Me v Them mentality.
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B6 6HE
Liam Brady 
Joined: 25 Aug 2021 Status: Offline Points: 1028 |
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Posted: 23 Nov 2022 at 11:12am |
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Most definitely Irwin was still playing well at the time |
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Fruice
Liam Brady
Joined: 22 Nov 2014 Location: Cork Status: Offline Points: 1260 |
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Posted: 23 Nov 2022 at 11:25am |
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The most fascinating thing I see in all of this and I never dawned on me is why Mick has never answered the question of why the setup was so crap.
Yes maybe the FAI were at fault but the buck stops with him. Looking at it now arriving out to start of the World Cup training camp with no gear and an awful pitch that’s crazy. It’s no wonder he hit the roof I’m surprised more didn’t. |
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Mr. Snrub
Liam Brady
Joined: 12 Mar 2016 Location: Co. Dublin Status: Offline Points: 2074 |
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Posted: 23 Nov 2022 at 11:30am |
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Irwin had just finished the season with United so would have been a good shoulder to cry on for Roy.
O'Shea still hadn't broken into the first team picture at United and was way down the pecking order |
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"Here's Robbie Keane...... yeeeessss! That is no more than Ireland deserve!"
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horsebox
Robbie Keane
Born n bred in darndale. Joined: 03 Feb 2010 Location: Ireland Status: Offline Points: 34863 |
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Posted: 23 Nov 2022 at 11:40am |
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AFAIK - the pitch\facilities that Keane was up in arms over was all a temporary base. They were only there for a couple of days before they moved on. And that the new place they stayed for during their stay were indeed first class. Open to correction on this. |
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ShamtheRam
Paul McGrath 
Joined: 05 Apr 2009 Location: Ireland Status: Offline Points: 18144 |
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Posted: 23 Nov 2022 at 12:07pm |
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Irwin and Mick didn't get along either thought did they? From memory, Irwin retired young not too long after Mick came in
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Trap junior
Robbie Keane
YBIG Minister of Doom & Gloom Joined: 25 Jan 2010 Location: Irish Riviera Status: Offline Points: 39834 |
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Posted: 23 Nov 2022 at 12:12pm |
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Football is non existent in Saipan apparently and baseball is the game there. The island would have had no idea who the Irish team were or why they were there. The pitch I think was put in for Holland/The EIRE and was a new surface but the people putting it in would have no idea the specs and standards required for football an so it was totally substandard. It was bone dry and then the next day they flooded it with too much water. The Saipan people probably had no idea they were dealing with professionals goign to the most important tournament int he world.
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Fruice
Liam Brady
Joined: 22 Nov 2014 Location: Cork Status: Offline Points: 1260 |
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Posted: 23 Nov 2022 at 12:47pm |
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It’s immaterial what there base in Japan was as this wasn’t the issue. The issue was Saipan and the sub standards there. This is the World Cup with one of the country’s best ever side and it was deemed acceptable. No doubt Keane was painful to manage and went to far but he wasn’t wrong about the setup they walked into. Still it is really is amazing Mick has never been questioned over the reasons for the setup being like it was in Saipan. |
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gufct
Jack Charlton
Trapattoni could manage me any day! Joined: 15 Feb 2009 Location: Ireland Status: Offline Points: 6518 |
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Posted: 23 Nov 2022 at 12:56pm |
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Saipan was picked for the players to acclimatise . The temperatures were higher than Japan and there was a further hours time difference.
The players were allowed some rnr and had a couple of nights out before moving onto Japan where they played a friendly before the Cameroon game.Their base in Chiba was world class as I saw it for myself when we arrived there. Keane was off the beer and was having trouble coming to terms with that .
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Fruice
Liam Brady
Joined: 22 Nov 2014 Location: Cork Status: Offline Points: 1260 |
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Posted: 23 Nov 2022 at 1:02pm |
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That still doesn’t answer the questions of the poor set up. |
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gufct
Jack Charlton
Trapattoni could manage me any day! Joined: 15 Feb 2009 Location: Ireland Status: Offline Points: 6518 |
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Posted: 23 Nov 2022 at 1:27pm |
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The local government in Saipan would have been responsible for the pitches . DHL we’re in charge of transportation of training kit along with the Fai.
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gufct
Jack Charlton
Trapattoni could manage me any day! Joined: 15 Feb 2009 Location: Ireland Status: Offline Points: 6518 |
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Posted: 23 Nov 2022 at 1:30pm |
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the soccer show on RTÉ covered all the bases and stadiums Ireland we’re using during the qualifying round in Japan.
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Fruice
Liam Brady
Joined: 22 Nov 2014 Location: Cork Status: Offline Points: 1260 |
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Posted: 23 Nov 2022 at 1:38pm |
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Doesn’t matter a dam who was responsible for the pitches if they weren’t of a required standard the base should not have been chosen. With regards the gear it should have been there days before them and someone sent in advance to have it ready. Yes the FAI might be responsible but the buck stops with Mick. Of course the captain of the side would blow their top if this happened. |
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1874eire
Kevin Kilbane
Joined: 06 Jun 2016 Location: Cork Status: Offline Points: 219 |
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Posted: 23 Nov 2022 at 1:39pm |
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Mick famously dropped Irwin for a game and then told him to 'go and prove himself'!
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Bukowski
500 Club la la la 
Joined: 06 Jun 2013 Status: Offline Points: 506 |
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Posted: 23 Nov 2022 at 1:58pm |
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Mick told Irwin to go prove himself? That's just dumb management, no two ways about it.
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Trap junior
Robbie Keane
YBIG Minister of Doom & Gloom Joined: 25 Jan 2010 Location: Irish Riviera Status: Offline Points: 39834 |
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Posted: 23 Nov 2022 at 2:00pm |
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Think the manager should be more pissed off than anyone else. Look, the manager does not answer to the captain. The captain answers to the manager. The manager chooses who the captain is! Keane was way above his station. The role of captain is not that big of a role and way overstated by you in terms of importance. Say Stan was captain and Keane was just one of the lads Keane still would have gone nuts imo and walked out. Of course Keane was right about the crap facilities but its not his place to go insubordinate and throw a wobbly. As Fergie said at United Keane got above his station and thought he was running the club and taking on managerial roles. Edited by Trap junior - 23 Nov 2022 at 2:53pm |
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dangere_here
Kevin Kilbane
Joined: 24 Nov 2018 Status: Offline Points: 441 |
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Posted: 23 Nov 2022 at 2:41pm |
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This. Drama aside, it is an often overlooked fact that Saipan was a pre training trip intended to play golf and have a few drinks before getting down to business at the training camp in Japan. Perhaps that was miscommunicated to the squad, but I doubt it as the rest had no problem going on the lash, including a legendary story involving Gary Kelly. Ray Tracey would have been involved there rather than Mick. If Roy had waited til Japan, he'd have nothing to complain about in terms of facilities. Edited by dangere_here - 23 Nov 2022 at 2:43pm |
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dangere_here
Kevin Kilbane
Joined: 24 Nov 2018 Status: Offline Points: 441 |
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Posted: 23 Nov 2022 at 2:54pm |
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He was about 34 when he retired after the playoff defeat, and had we qualfied for Euro 2000, he would certainly have been in the squad. Great servant for Ireland, but from what I remember Irwin would have been eclipsed by the likes of Carr, Gary Kelly and Harte and even Staunton in that position. Terry Phelan and Curtis Fleming would have been still knocking around the squad as well. Great at set pieces, but Irwin wasn't the quickest and it's no surprise Mick favoured the younger lads there.
Edited by dangere_here - 23 Nov 2022 at 3:06pm |
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decky_eire wrote: