International standard and Ireland

Het-field wrote: I always wondered if those Israel games in 2005 actually changed the course of Irish footballing history? Had we won one of the, we would have at least made the play offs, and any more we qualified. Either way, Kerr stays on as manager and tries to regroup in a post Keane/Holland/Cunningham environment, and promoted the likes of O'Brien, Ireland and Miller to the team. Perhaps the Cyprus defeat never happens and we remain in contention for Euro 2008 beyond the first two games?

Edited by Drumcondra 69er - 28 Jun 2018 at 10:32am

I still think we are overestimating the ability of our players while deliberately undermining those of any team that suits the hypothetical argument that we could have done better than them.Australia have Mooy and Rogic, Iceland Sigurdsson and Gudmundsson. These players are technically superior to what we have in midfield. We can argue about the likes of Hendrick our Brady playing for a Burnley side that are currently stronger than the teams that Mooy,Rogic or Sigurdsson play for, but it doesn't really cut it. With the possible exception of Brady, who has regressed, largely due to injury and we all hope he will come back stronger, Irish players are not bought by EPL or even Championship clubs for their technical ability. Every team in this tournament has technically superior players.What amuses me is that there are regular snide remarks on here about English arrogance and lack of grounding, while we make out the only problem in Irish football is MON and make out our players are better than everyone in pots 2,3 and 4 of the draw!

pre Madonna wrote: I still think we are overestimating the ability of our players while deliberately undermining those of any team that suits the hypothetical argument that we could have done better than them. Australia have Mooy and Rogic, Iceland Sigurdsson and Gudmundsson. These players are technically superior to what we have in midfield. We can argue about the likes of Hendrick our Brady playing for a Burnley side that are currently stronger than the teams that Mooy,Rogic or Sigurdsson play for, but it doesn't really cut it. With the possible exception of Brady, who has regressed, largely due to injury and we all hope he will come back stronger, Irish players are not bought by EPL or even Championship clubs for their technical ability. Every team in this tournament has technically superior players. What amuses me is that there are regular snide remarks on here about English arrogance and lack of grounding, while we make out the only problem in Irish football is MON and make out our players are better than everyone in pots 2,3 and 4 of the draw!

Honestly, I think we have become so over reliant on luck, mistakes, and route one, that it is clear just how rudimentary the style of football is, and just how much of a house of cards it is when put to the test.

we would be competitive and might with a bit of luck get out of the group a few spotters via VAR for wrestling Shane Duffy to the ground.

Drumcondra 69er wrote: pre Madonna wrote: I still think we are overestimating the ability of our players while deliberately undermining those of any team that suits the hypothetical argument that we could have done better than them. Australia have Mooy and Rogic, Iceland Sigurdsson and Gudmundsson. These players are technically superior to what we have in midfield. We can argue about the likes of Hendrick our Brady playing for a Burnley side that are currently stronger than the teams that Mooy,Rogic or Sigurdsson play for, but it doesn't really cut it. With the possible exception of Brady, who has regressed, largely due to injury and we all hope he will come back stronger, Irish players are not bought by EPL or even Championship clubs for their technical ability. Every team in this tournament has technically superior players. What amuses me is that there are regular snide remarks on here about English arrogance and lack of grounding, while we make out the only problem in Irish football is MON and make out our players are better than everyone in pots 2,3 and 4 of the draw! The point is we have plenty of players who are able to show a degree of technical ability on the ball for their clubs yet are either not allowed to or are incapable of doing so under MON. That's why legitimate questions are raised.

Talking about the quality of our current players is part of the problem, but it also misses the point as we've been having goalscoring difficulty for a long time, even when we had excellent players in the team.

Edited by Terzino - 28 Jun 2018 at 10:16pm

I've seen a good few of these type discussions pop up during this WC- hypothetically, how would we have done had we made it type thing. One of the things that crops up time & time again is us (our fans) noting, sometimes correctly, that Germany/Argentina/England/Sweden/whoever are no great shakes and comments like the standard of football at the WC isn't all that great. All of which may be true, but but that simply doesn't address the fact that we have been complete rubbish for a full 18 months. Maybe with a favourable draw (had we got there in the first place) we might have sneaked out of some of the weaker groups, but there is absolutely zero evidence to suggest that would have been the case other than ''Ah we usually up it for tournaments'' . 

We have no plan. End of. As we enter our 3rd qualifying term under O'Neill, maybe something coherent will finally surface under his tenure. Until then it's a moot point discussing personnel and what we would or could have done.