GAA Football 2017

sid waddell wrote: I can't call Dublin v Tyrone but I will anyway. I think Tyrone will win by one point. My feeling is that Dublin are being overrated going into this one.  For me, Dublin are an easier team to read in terms of form than Mayo, Kerry and Tyrone because they can sustain a much longer peak due to having far greater squad depth than anybody else and also due to geographical advantages - ie. none of their players live outside Dublin, which is a small county anyway.  I believe Dublin have not been at the level of previous years and struggled through much of the league, ending up losing the final to Kerry, whereas last year they drove a coach and horses through a much stronger Kerry team in the final.  The championship has taught us nothing about Dublin yet. People might argue that it has taught us nothing about Tyrone, but it has - they are putting away teams with absolute ease, whereas they weren't in previous years.  There is no championship form guide to go on.  But when two full strength or near full strength teams really go at each other in the league, it is a guide. Mayo and Kerry proves that. Mayo and Dublin proves that. Dublin and Kerry proves that. Dublin and Tyrone have gone at each other full throttle on five occasions since Jim Gavin took over. One point separates them on aggregate. These games weren't played in the muck on a provincial pitch - four were in Croke Park, with the other one on a perfect pitch in Omagh in glorious April sunshine. And at least three were with considerably inferior Tyrone teams than will line out tomorrow. Only a fool would disregard those results.  Tyrone to win.

The point I would make is that Dublin have an incredible ability to end up on the right side of one point games, and have been since 2010 when they turned the corner. And even if it is not one point games, it is tight margins, and Dublin appears to thrive in these situations. I would agree that Dublin's starting team looks weaker, but that can be mitigated for with the bench which would undoubtedly have a major impact in the final outcome. I will also agree that Dublin cannot afford to play in their usual way in All Ireland Semi Finals, which even pre-dates 2010, when Dublin gave Mayo a head start in 2006, and didn't participate for the first 15 of the second half in 2007.

Haven't seen a mention anywhere of O sheas stamp on donaghy at the end( the reason donaghy hit him). If it was connolly there would be uproar!

sid waddell wrote: They do, but you tend to run out of luck eventually.

Het-field wrote: sid waddell wrote: They do, but you tend to run out of luck eventually.  True, and that trend was bucked in the league final by a Kerry team who are a pale shadow of some of their predecessors. I also notice the large number of former half-backs dotted around the starting team. I suspect that has to do with high fitness and speed, but I think it is a risky strategy.

Edited by sid waddell - 27 Aug 2017 at 1:18am

Tyrone by 2, Declan McClure to start

BigStrongMan wrote: Can see us beating Antrim by 6-8 pts today

Correct BSM

sid waddell wrote: [QUOTE=Het-field] Lowndes is there to track Tiernan McCann. Dublin are haunted by the memory of Ryan McHugh running riot in 2014.  Tyrone have plan A and plan A. The thing is that that plan A is very, very difficult to negate, as those teams who fell victim to peak Donegal found out, and Tyrone end up playing Plan A the way they like while their opponent plays in a way they aren't used to. Tactics in Gaelic football are still rudimentary enough in world sporting terms and teams often don't have a great ability to adapt if taken out of their tactical comfort zone. Mayo too Kerry out of theirs today and Kerry had no answer. Dublin played a much more defensive structure in 2011 against Donegal, basically keeping six defenders back at all times.  That formation stopped Donegal from scoring goals (though McFadden should have got one), but Dublin found it terribly difficult to break down and thus we got a dirge.  I expect Dublin's approach tomorrow will be a sort of half way house between the cautious approach of 2011 and the gung ho approach of 2014.  The jury is out on whether Tyrone are better than Donegal 2012 who had the system down to a ridiculously fine art, but they are better than Donegal 2011.  The first 15 minutes will set the tone. If one team gets significantly ahead, ie. 4 to 5 points, the expected pattern could go out the window. But remember Donegal were 5 behind Dublin in 2014 and stuck firm to their plan and prevailed. If neither does, as I expect, it will probably turn into a dogfight with maybe somewhere in the region of 12-14 points being a winning total. Basically, Tyrone will try to unsettle Dublin so much that Dublin's normal attacking game, their support play and angles of running break down.  Getting through such a defence is a desperate mental grind. I'd be very doubtful if Con O'Callaghan and Dean Rock have the experience in the case of the former and the ability in the case of the latter to do it.  The other alternative is to kick points from distance as Flynn and Connolly did in 2014. But Flynn won't be starting tomorrow, and even if Connolly does, there are questions about his readiness.  I don't think anybody else on the Dublin team has the ability to kick those sort of points from long distance. And even if they do, the radar can only last for so long. Those Flynn and Connolly points dried up beyond 30 minutes in 2014. So Dublin will be relying on Andrews and Mannion close to goal, Kilkenny and Fenton to create and McCarthy and McCaffrey to try and make runs which lose defenders. Peak Bernard Brogan was brilliant at sticking to his task against that kind of defence. But he's no longer peak Bernard Brogan. McManamon will have a big role off the bench. O'Gara will I expect be a disaster if he sees game time. I just can't see him making any headway at all. At the back I have a hunch that Cian O'Sullivan is playing at a level below his best. Possibly Philly McMahon too. That isn't to say there aren't doubts surrounding some Tyrone players. Aidan McCrory and Conall McCann are two. And I'd have doubts whether Sean Cavanagh is till up to it and how Mark Bradley's lack of height and physical strength could be exposed. If I was Jim Gavin. I'd stick Philly McMahon on Tiernan McCann.

You're certainly onto something. I recall seeing Dublin play Cork in 2013 in the NFL and the reliance on speed and fitness was breathtaking. I recall it is what allowed Dublin take the All Ireland final that year by the scruff of the neck, even though the game finished tightly. The strategy of switching the ball and relying on pace was heavily utilised until it came unstuck against Donegal in 2014 and since then I have seen more of a traditional hybrid game, with a deference to defence. I think this has made Dublin more vulnerable, as it is more conventional rather than the blanket defence or the genius way we played in Gavin's first season.

Green Devil wrote: Tommy Carr the most boring man on the planet tipped Dublin to win handy by 6 or 7 points