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The Decline of the EPL
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Robbie Keane
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Points: 44659 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Jul 2017 at 6:41pm
Originally posted by coyne coyne wrote:

Yeah the area it's in was the joke but should of said St. Andrews really LOL Now that's a different story..
Birmingham have always had a huge support from the West Indian community there, even reflected in their hooligan group the Zulus. Wolves, with the Punjabi Wolves, and Bradford are two other clubs who have done huge work in this area in recent years.
I know what ya meant though!

I am staying out of this debate in general though, other than to say modern football is incredibly boring!
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Originally posted by coyne coyne wrote:

Originally posted by Gashley Grimes Gashley Grimes wrote:


 The atmosphere nowadays is so poor compared to then and you'd be lucky to meet an English person at certain grounds today.

Now we're going a bit too far.. Not even Kenilworth Road is that bad! 

Quote
Even in Lansdowne Rd. there's people off for a hot dog after ten mins...think there at a baseball game.

What is it with the modern day attitude of fans thinking they can tell other fans what to do when they're at the game?
Unless the ticket is paid for me I may think twice about it but I want to go eat after 10 mins I will, if I want to then go crack one off in the bogs after 65 mins, I will! Cos I paid for it!
 
I'm talking about OOT's - lads in London for the weekend who spend the game taking selfies and pictures of lads taking corners.
They might come again in five years.
 
This is one of the whole issues some football clubs have lost touch with local community & the local fan.
Football has become a tourist attraction to some.  
 
Tend to go to Non League nowadays where you get to meet the grounds man/chairman and the star striker all in the clubhouse over a jar.Big smile
 
 
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Originally posted by Gashley Grimes Gashley Grimes wrote:

Originally posted by coyne coyne wrote:

Originally posted by Gashley Grimes Gashley Grimes wrote:


 The atmosphere nowadays is so poor compared to then and you'd be lucky to meet an English person at certain grounds today.

Now we're going a bit too far.. Not even Kenilworth Road is that bad! 

Quote
Even in Lansdowne Rd. there's people off for a hot dog after ten mins...think there at a baseball game.

What is it with the modern day attitude of fans thinking they can tell other fans what to do when they're at the game?
Unless the ticket is paid for me I may think twice about it but I want to go eat after 10 mins I will, if I want to then go crack one off in the bogs after 65 mins, I will! Cos I paid for it!
 
I'm talking about OOT's - lads in London for the weekend who spend the game taking selfies and pictures of lads taking corners.
They might come again in five years.
 
This is one of the whole issues some football clubs have lost touch with local community & the local fan.
Football has become a tourist attraction to some.  
 
Tend to go to Non League nowadays where you get to meet the grounds man/chairman and the star striker all in the clubhouse over a jar.Big smile
 
 
This put this song in my head.
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Unless you were also out buying a hot dog after ten minutes of a match, how would you know somebody if else is?
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Robbie Keane
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Originally posted by FrankosHereNow FrankosHereNow wrote:

Unless you were also out buying a hot dog after ten minutes of a match, how would you know somebody if else is?
I assume the clue would be when they turn up 5 minutes later eating  a hotdog?
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They might have gone for a piss and been given a free hotdog on the way back in.

Your evidence is all circumstantial.
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Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

Originally posted by FrankosHereNow FrankosHereNow wrote:

Unless you were also out buying a hot dog after ten minutes of a match, how would you know somebody if else is?
I assume the clue would be when they turn up 5 minutes later eating  a hotdog?

It would be a big giveaway indeed LOL

It's beyond me why someone else would be bothered about what someone else is doing. As said before if the ticket was paid by someone else I can understand.
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Originally posted by coyne coyne wrote:

Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

Originally posted by FrankosHereNow FrankosHereNow wrote:

Unless you were also out buying a hot dog after ten minutes of a match, how would you know somebody if else is?
I assume the clue would be when they turn up 5 minutes later eating  a hotdog?

It would be a big giveaway indeed LOL

It's beyond me why someone else would be bothered about what someone else is doing. As said before if the ticket was paid by someone else I can understand.
It is when it impinges on you is the problem, so in an all-seater stadium when people are pushing in and out and you just want to see the game you paid for. It is why terracing suits football.
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Originally posted by SuperDave84 SuperDave84 wrote:

They might have gone for a piss and been given a free hotdog on the way back in.

Your evidence is all circumstantial.
I hope they washed their hands.LOL
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Originally posted by Territorial Territorial wrote:

Originally posted by Gashley Grimes Gashley Grimes wrote:


I'm not talking about the 60's & 70's even early 80's started watching Ireland and going across to England and Scotland as a young teenager with older lads in the late 80's early 90's.
 
The atmosphere nowadays is so poor compared to then and you'd be lucky to meet an English person at certain grounds today.
Even in Lansdowne Rd. there's people off for a hot dog after ten mins...think there at a baseball game.
 
Can you really relate with the modern footballer today?  Brought Jim McCalliog to a function recently in Coatbridge and he was telling me the new owners at Southampton had took down all the photos of the '76 cup final victory to begin a new era!!
 
I'm not saying this era was better than that - but the way things are going you must see football is losing a little bit of its soul.
 
 
 
Some things are better, some things are worse (imo).

And as someone who has attended football regularly since the 1980's*, I'd say that on balance, it's as least as good as previously.


* - The 1980's, when part of "football's soul" included hooliganism, deathtrap stadia and people pissing down the back of your legs on the terraces. Still, it never rained on Cup Final Day, so at least the weather was better back then...
 
Indeed and Ian Snodin,Tony Dorigo and Bobby Robson football cards fought crime on Merseyside.
Halcyon days!!
 
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Originally posted by FrankosHereNow FrankosHereNow wrote:

I do get a good laugh out of people who just constantly give out about modern football. 

Footballers in the 60's & 70's and even a lot in the 80's ended up penniless with f**k all job prospects. English football stadiums were absolute sh*tholes, the pitches looked like something from the National Ploughing championships and there was about 5 matches a season on TV. Not to mention club chairmen making an absolute fortune while the players were on crap wages. 
 
Not quite through footballers in the 80's earned 300% above the national average in the UK in the 1980's.They were all quite well off with plenty of investment opportunities.
One of the big questions is how footballers survive when the lights go out? - how you fill your days afterwards at the end of the day these are mainly working class lads with a talent - I believe it's 3 out of every five get divorced and have addiction problems - it's the X factor syndrome. 
 
Somebody mentioned moving with the times - From 1992 - 2001 footballer's wages had risen to 1,700% above the national average and by season 2009/10 they stood at around 3,500% above.Whereas the national average wage between 1992-2010 rose by 186%.
 
The question is in 2017 - are clubs business or sporting institutions? Globalised commodity or community asset? If it is cheaper and more profitable to produce a product in China then the UK why not move the raw materials and labour to China?
 
This is the battle line of the 21st century - No?
 
 
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Originally posted by Gashley Grimes Gashley Grimes wrote:

Originally posted by FrankosHereNow FrankosHereNow wrote:

I do get a good laugh out of people who just constantly give out about modern football. 

Footballers in the 60's & 70's and even a lot in the 80's ended up penniless with f**k all job prospects. English football stadiums were absolute sh*tholes, the pitches looked like something from the National Ploughing championships and there was about 5 matches a season on TV. Not to mention club chairmen making an absolute fortune while the players were on crap wages. 
 
Not quite through footballers in the 80's earned 300% above the national average in the UK in the 1980's.They were all quite well off with plenty of investment opportunities.
One of the big questions is how footballers survive when the lights go out? - how you fill your days afterwards at the end of the day these are mainly working class lads with a talent - I believe it's 3 out of every five get divorced and have addiction problems - it's the X factor syndrome. 
 
Somebody mentioned moving with the times - From 1992 - 2001 footballer's wages had risen to 1,700% above the national average and by season 2009/10 they stood at around 3,500% above.Whereas the national average wage between 1992-2010 rose by 186%.
 
The question is in 2017 - are clubs business or sporting institutions? Globalised commodity or community asset? If it is cheaper and more profitable to produce a product in China then the UK why not move the raw materials and labour to China?
 
This is the battle line of the 21st century - No?
 
 
Kenny Sansom is homeless now I believe. Thought I heard that Neil Webb is also struggling. Earning 300% of the national average was fine while they were playing but the vast majority of footballers had/have f**k all qualifications and struggled to get anything worthwhile after they retired. 
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Each footballer should be made to employ a good financial advisor or even their agent should help them to map their finances for their whole life not just while they are in the game ..

Most of these lads have hardly been schooled and p1ss away fortunes during their careers .

It should be the case that these guys should not really need to have to find a job....if they put away the right amount when they were earning it 
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Originally posted by Barna Bee Barna Bee wrote:

Each footballer should be made to employ a good financial advisor or even their agent should help them to map their finances for their whole life not just while they are in the game ..

Most of these lads have hardly been schooled and p1ss away fortunes during their careers .

It should be the case that these guys should not really need to have to find a job....if they put away the right amount when they were earning it 

Many a rich man has gone broke with the help of a financial advisor...... 

But agreed, the clubs could have done more to help them out. Moe education would have helped a lot of them out.
 



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Originally posted by Barna Bee Barna Bee wrote:

Each footballer should be made to employ a good financial advisor or even their agent should helop them to map their finances for their whole life not just while they are in the game ..

Most of these lads have hardly been schooled and p1ss away fortunes during their careers .

It should be the case that these guys should not really need to have to find a job....if they put away the right amount when they were earning it 


Agreed......but a footballer (or anyone else) who has a large chunk of money to put away every month will have some of their money invested in shares/property etc by any financial advisor. I'd imagine a tonne of footballers lost fortunes in Bank shares and property in the last 10 years.
They are not going to just stick it in a bank savings a/c earning 1%.
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Originally posted by Gashley Grimes Gashley Grimes wrote:

The question is in 2017 - are clubs business or sporting institutions? Globalised commodity or community asset? If it is cheaper and more profitable to produce a product in China then the UK why not move the raw materials and labour to China?
 
This is the battle line of the 21st century - No?
The answer is they're both.

But surely your proposal to move whole clubs to China is not practical, since these whilst the "business" (capital, management & players effectively) can move, the "institution" (history, support, stadia, rivalries, atmosphere, tradition etc) cannot.

So let China build up its own sporting institutions to match, even outdo, those of Europe. Then if they can do so, the "business" side (capital, management & players) of European clubs can move there to become part of their set-up.

Personally, I can't see it happening in less than two or three decades, if at all, since when the USA tried it back on the days of the NASL (Pele, Best, Beckenbauer etc), it died on its arse. Hence their present attempt to grow organically with the MLS. And well though they're doing with that, it's still light years behind Europe.


Edited by Territorial - 12 Jul 2017 at 12:08pm
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"The Decline of the EPL?"

To paraphrase Mark Twain, it would appear reports have been greatly exagerrated...

Premier League kicks on to record revenues of £3.6bn

Buoyant Uefa TV income helped Premier League clubs' revenues rise 9% to a record £3.6bn in the 2015-16 season, according to analysis from Deloitte.

For a third straight season, clubs' combined operating profits exceeded £500m, but wages rose 12% to £2.3bn.

"Even in the final year of its old broadcast contracts, Premier League revenues continued to set new records," said Dan Jones, partner in Deloitte's sports business group, which has unveiled its latest Annual Review of Football Finance.

Mr Jones said Premier League clubs were now reaping the benefit of a new broadcast rights cycle which started in 2016-17, plus new commercial agreements, and match day revenue growth from new and expanded stadia.

Deloitte says it now expects total Premier League clubs' revenues to be more than £4.5bn in 2017-18.

Meanwhile, Premier League net debt fell for the third consecutive season, by £125m (5%) to £2.2bn at the end of the 2015-16 season.

(More at: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-40555593 )
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Originally posted by Territorial Territorial wrote:

Originally posted by Gashley Grimes Gashley Grimes wrote:

The question is in 2017 - are clubs business or sporting institutions? Globalised commodity or community asset? If it is cheaper and more profitable to produce a product in China then the UK why not move the raw materials and labour to China?
 
This is the battle line of the 21st century - No?
The answer is they're both.

But surely your proposal to move whole clubs to China is not practical, since these whilst the "business" (capital, management & players effectively) can move, the "institution" (history, support, stadia, rivalries, atmosphere, tradition etc) cannot.

So let China build up its own sporting institutions to match, even outdo, those of Europe. Then if they can do so, the "business" side (capital, management & players) of European clubs can move there to become part of their set-up.

Personally, I can't see it happening in less than two or three decades, if at all, since when the USA tried it back on the days of the NASL (Pele, Best, Beckenbauer etc), it died on its arse. Hence their present attempt to grow organically with the MLS. And well though they're doing with that, it's still light years behind Europe.
Game 39 they were willing to move anywhere for that until Andy Burnham and co. kicked up.
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