UK Politics Thread

 

 

 

A British citizen is being treated differently because of her heritage. That is racist.They can dress it up how they want, but that is how it will feel to a lot of British Muslims, regardless of her actions. It is certainly the view of my neighbour who shares her background. (I am not sure why I mentioned it, other than I just asked him about it).

You can't embrace the good aspects of immigration in the 'big society' and simply ignore the bad aspects, aspects that could well be as a result of the massive failures of the 'big society'.

If she is a security risk, then Britain has to bring her home to face justice, not wash their hands of her. If this was merely an act against ISIS/Daesh, their citizenship would have been revoked when they left the UK, although I would have disagreed with this too, it would at least have shown a consistent policy. Here it is the worst kind of politicking, it isn't even  for Javid to decide! He is doing it to get support from sections of the media to whom everything is black or white, British or liberal. No in between. It seems like that because he is from an ethnic minority, he feels he has to show he is extra-British or something equally as nonsensical.

It should be irrelevant as to whether she is left stateless or not, it is colonialism in its worst form to just expect Bangladesh to pick up Britain's mess. All the crimes she may or may not have committed, would have been committed by a British citizen. 

Nobody knows much about her, apart from she left London to join IS and a television interview that was both unfair to the girl(regardless of whether she deserves fairness, or whether she initiated the interview, she  certainly deserves  a fair trial) and made for a bizarre trial by television that felt like a scene from Black Mirror. 

The sensible thing to have done would be to bring home to face trial under British law and make sure her son, another British citizen who is entirely innocent, gets looked after safely.

Like I said, I believe the best outcome would be for her to be brought home and identify the background behind her journey and hold those individuals to account. She undoubtedly possesses very important information which could be very useful in the fight against terrorism. Equally,I see it as the best chance of deradicalisation and potentially will incentivise her to live a “quiet life” as she will certainly be under significant watch considering her past

I’m not sure how the interview was “unfair”. She can say what she likes, or choose to say nothing. The interview could have assisted her path home, instead, she said what she said, and is rightly being held to account. This isn’t fake news, the footage is available for all to see and has been condemned in all or at least part by almost all commentators on the matter.

However, the dual nationality aspect is important in circumstances that the law permits the removal of citizenship where duel nationality exists, to avoid statelessness. This is specific to all with duel nationality and isn’t random impressed upon people.It is invokable when security risks exist. Hence, if you don’t raise security concerns, you won’t be subjected to the sanction. This is very different to windrush, and does not focus on any specific nationality or group. It is activated as a result of behaviour, rather than personal characteristics. That is secondary, and is there to avoid state’s less ness, which is undesirable.

I agree, she should be brought home and I don’t agree with the decision. But this isn’t racism, or any ism. Without her involvement with ISIS, she wouldn’t be facing the sanction. This is why Windrush was so appalling as it was entirely random and based on nothing.

It would appear not. You would think Javid would have checked this first...

Thank f**k for that!

WOW!

Here's a thought experiment. 

Let's make up a hypothetical case which hypothetically happened in 2015.

15 year old Lorna Kelly was born and brought up in Manchester. She's the daughter of a white Irishman, Seamus Kelly, born in Tipperary, who moved to Manchester when he was 22, and a white English woman, Louise (nee Prescott), from Didsbury, Manchester. 

The Kelly family live happily in Didsbury. Lorna is one of three siblings, the others being 18 year old Brian, who is taking his A levels this year and hopes to study engineering at the University of Manchester, and 13 year old Catherine, who has just started secondary school. 48 year old Seamus runs a successful plumbing business while his wife, 46 year old Louise, is a nurse in the NHS. Seamus and Louise's long hours at work mean that they often aren't around at home, and if they are, they're invariably tired or asleep.

As she progresses through Didsbury Comprehensive School, Lorna is suffering from what appears to be a reasonably normal case of teenage angst. She thinks she's depressed and doesn't have very high self esteem. Through school she meets Safiyah, a Muslim girl of Pakistani parentage who lives in nearby Longsight, and starts hanging around with her and her friends. 

Lorna meets Safiyah's brother Faisal, who is 18. Faisal has a controlling but charismatic personality. Lorna finds herself deeply attracted to him, the feeling is mutual on Faisal's part, and the two begin a relationship, which progresses quickly. Lorna feels that Faisal has given her something to live for.

But another part of Faisal's personality is that he has been seduced by the ideas of the Islamic State. He comes from a family who are peaceful, but are devout Muslims. He rails against the racism he has experienced in his own life, but also what he sees as the colonial exploitation by the UK, the US and others, of Muslim majority countries, not just the Iraq War but Lybia, Syria, and Palestine. He becomes radicalised by online propaganda. He's extremely angry about what is happening in Syria and feels he has to do something. He sees the 2005 London bombs, the Lee Rigby murder and other attacks like Madrid and the Charlie Hebdo massacre and the Tunisian beach massacre as justified blowback for Western colonialism against Muslims.

During the course of their developing relationship, Faisal has influenced Lorna heavily with these ideas. Lorna has never been in love before now, implicitly trusts Faisal, and what Faisal says to her about the situation in Syria resonates massively with her. Within six months, she's almost as fervent in her beliefs about what is happening in Syria as Faisal is. 

Then Faisal decides the time has come to do something. He tells Lorna he's going to Syria to fight for the Islamic State. Lorna begs him not to, but Faisal is insistent that he is going. Lorna realises she can't stop him, so the next best thing is that she can join him. 

The two go to Syria. 

Faisal believes he is fighting in a just cause. But he is ruthless, and is not afraid to kill people in a brutal fashion. 

For a while, Lorna is happy there, but gradually she becomes more and more homesick, and on the rare occasions she sees Faisal, he becomes more and more controlling and manpulative. Nevertheless, by 2017, the two have got married. Lorna is now the archetypal "Jihadi Bride".

In 2018, Lorna gives birth to her and Faisal's baby. But by now, Islamic State are losing the war, Faisal has been captured by Assad's forces, and Lorna and her new baby are living in a refugee camp in Idlib, alone and desperate. She does not speak Arabic. Lorna wants to go home to her family in Manchester. And yet, she's still not sorry she came to Syria, and still believes in the ideas that Faisal has taught her. She thinks she still loves him.

Word gets out in the UK media about her situation. Despite being entitled to an Irish passport through parentage, Lorna only holds British citizenship. It's now 2019 and Lorna is now 19. 

Back in Britain, Lorna's desperate family, who have been bereft and going through agonies since she suddenly left in 2015, make representations to their local Labour MP, to the Home Secretary Sajid Javid, and in the media, to "please bring our daughter and her baby home". 

Because the family are "respectable" and "relatable" to Middle England, their plight receives a good deal of sympathy in politics, the media and in society in general, even in traditionally Tory areas and in the Tory press.

What happens?

Does Javid say "sorry, we're revoking Lorna's British citizenship, leaving her stateless, and let her stew on her own out in Syria"? 

Does he say "oh, she's entitled to Irish citizenship, let the Irish deal with her", especially with the backdrop of the Brexit crisis?

Does he f**k.

A white girl from a nice middle class family in Manchester does not have their citizenship revoked. 

And that's how it's impossible to deny that race is a major factor in Shamima Begum having her British citizenship revoked.