UK Politics Thread

Gordon Brown wasn't at fault for his mess though. He was given the David Moyes at Utd treatment of piloting a very fast sinking ship

Edited by coyne - 09 Jun 2017 at 5:06pm

It's a mark of May that she hasn't stepped aside. She failed in her intended outcome and is now trying to cobble together a lame excuse to remain. Only the most blinded Tories, with a blinkered view of loyalty to any leader could agree with her remaining on.

Het-field wrote: coyne wrote: Gordon Brown wasn't at fault for his mess though. He was given the David Moyes at Utd treatment of piloting a very fast sinking ship Theresa's mess is her fault, there's a difference. Not to be churlish, but whose fault was it? He was Chancellor after all.

Het-field wrote: coyne wrote: Tony Blair's. He was more interested in how many civilian deaths he could of get on his hands rather than focusing on what's going back home in the middle of a global recession. But Brown was right by his side. He was as much responsible for the failures and outcomes of that Government as Blair.

Edited by coyne - 09 Jun 2017 at 5:18pm

coyne wrote: He was but Brown has nothing to do with what happens overseas.  Tony Blair was told by a chap named Jeremy Corbyn back in 2003 "If you goto the Iraq, you will unleash hate that will affect future generations" and look how right he is! And the financial consequences was the icing on the cake.

Brown and Corbyn were totally at odds on the issue. Sure, Brown has been relatively upfront about his regret, but he still voted for it, and was in charge of the purse strings when it was being paid for. Corbyn was right about Iraq, but his views in 2003 were not shared by Brown. It would be factually incorrect to claim otherwise. Brown was responsible on a number of levels, not least on a collective cabinet basis.
. This was the type of view that was proffered in 2010 when Labour were trying to spread collective amnesia about the fact that they had been in charge for 13 years.

BigStrongMan wrote: Didn't know we had so many UK political experts on here. Clever oul bunch

i know crazy isn't it!

coyne wrote: Be interesting to hear from our SNP friend EratzThistle. Very passionate SNP supporter who's probably at a loss as much as we are what happened last night. Losses were expected but it's more to do with the manner of it, like losing the safe seats. Angus' seat of Moray was always touted to be close, but he's Scotland's voice of Westminster and then it gets worse, Mr. SNP himself gets booted out also, which was considered a very safe SNP seat. It could of gotten much worse also, Mhahri Black having a very close scare. To me Sturgeon's position untenable, she's served her purpose now she's passed her sell by date. The soooner the SNP get back those Tory seats, the better for both England and Scotland.

It's something I spoke about before, but I think it is two pronged.

The SNP in Scotland are different to Westminster. In Westminster they focus more on ethereal social justice while being more pragmatic up North. Given Labour's manifesto, this meant that the SNP were not the only party in Scotland occupying this space, and Labour may have been seen as offering more. The difference between Mhairi Black's speeches in Parliament and what Labour were proposing could be interchangeable only Labour have a record in Government in Westminster behind them.

Second, Sturgeon has staked the last 12 months on Indy 2, as a means of combatting the purported downsides of Brexit, and perhaps lead Scotland into the EU. But this is at odds with the consensus in Scotland which is not overwhelmingly in favour of holding another referendum in the near future. South of the border, Sturgeon has become a one issue politician, and it's an issue that the people have spoken on, and continue to do through the polls. The New Statesman has an interesting article three weeks back about the need for her to diversify in a political way to satisfy voters. She hasn't been doing that, and the Tories looked like they were listening more clearly on the issue.

Effectively, it was the loss of its Social Justice clothes to Labour's manifesto, and having their finger off the pulse on what is relevant to Scottish voters, while hoping that Brexit would rally them to their side.

coyne wrote: I'd rather have Lord Buckethead in charge. I'll never forget that guy from last night 😂

coyne wrote: @Coleman. Not being biased but I think the Labour defeat is being blown out of proportion here. They're not going to win but I think they're capable of preventing a Tory majority.