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Underage squads: Best Prospects

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GreenDodger93 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GreenDodger93 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Feb 2015 at 9:51pm
Originally posted by Sham157 Sham157 wrote:

Compare it to local football so, plenty of examples recently. Even though GAA is played globally as you well know, test not to the scale of what you probably mean by Flobal, but the U.S., Australia, Asia etc etc all have their own GAA associations and they are global
Oh cmon, GAA isn't global, a few paddies playing agasint another group of paddies down under dosent make it global
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The O'Shea Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Feb 2015 at 12:02am
Originally posted by roverstillidie roverstillidie wrote:

Sham, didn't one of them take sectarian abuse and the bigot get a token ban? And a couple of other incidents of racial and sectarian abuse fudged recently?

Football is light years ahead of the Gah on this front.

Long and short of it, not one PUL on any of the 12 county sides north of the border. It's a problem.


What is your obsession with taking random digs at GAA? GAA is no more or less bigoted than soccer is in Ireland, in many cases it's played by the very same people. Why you would suggest it is other than to satisfy your puerile hatred of it is beyond me.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sham157 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Feb 2015 at 6:21am
Originally posted by GreenDodger93 GreenDodger93 wrote:

Originally posted by Sham157 Sham157 wrote:

Compare it to local football so, plenty of examples recently. Even though GAA is played globally as you well know, test not to the scale of what you probably mean by Flobal, but the U.S., Australia, Asia etc etc all have their own GAA associations and they are global
Oh cmon, GAA isn't global, a few paddies playing agasint another group of paddies down under dosent make it global
bit more than a few paddies down under on bondi kicking seven shades out of each other...


I've already stated its not to the scale that RTID, as I was responding to him at the time, and most people would consider global, ie World Cup style etc etc, but its played by huge numbers all over. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tony grealish Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Feb 2015 at 8:28am
Originally posted by Sham157 Sham157 wrote:

Originally posted by GreenDodger93 GreenDodger93 wrote:

Originally posted by Sham157 Sham157 wrote:

Compare it to local football so, plenty of examples recently. Even though GAA is played globally as you well know, test not to the scale of what you probably mean by Flobal, but the U.S., Australia, Asia etc etc all have their own GAA associations and they are global
Oh cmon, GAA isn't global, a few paddies playing agasint another group of paddies down under dosent make it global
bit more than a few paddies down under on bondi kicking seven shades out of each other...


I've already stated its not to the scale that RTID, as I was responding to him at the time, and most people would consider global, ie World Cup style etc etc, but its played by huge numbers all over. 


Ah c'mon Sham would ya stop! I know that there are GAA associations founded by ex-pats in a number of countries where there are large Irish communities but to suggest that Gaelic games are played globally and by ''huge numbers all over'' is just delusional.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sham157 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Feb 2015 at 9:32am
What is huge numbers? everybody will differ, but my point is that its not a few lads on bondi beach. There are competitions and leagues worldwide. These all attract sponsorship and boast membership in huge numbers. Of course in Australia for example, Aussie rules, RU, RL, Cricket etc are bigger, thats a given. I would consider it huge if say 5000 people were playing organised GAA in Australia. Its huge because its an amatuer sport from these shores that now has an excellent participation the world over. I'm not for one minute arguing that theres similar numbers playing GAA as football worldwide.

The overall point remains that no sport can claim a moral high ground in Ireland, which was the subject when this sort of kicked off a page or two ago, when it comes to incidents of racism/sectarianism or whatever other ism you want to mention.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote roverstillidie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Feb 2015 at 9:56am
It's not about higher moral ground. It's about reacting when some goolie abuses an opposing player. The Gah fudged a number of recent incidents that football would not have tolerated. Back to the original point, it's unfair to state football in the south is sectarian. Football in the 6 is undoubtably improving and the Gah play both sides of the fence.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The O'Shea Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Feb 2015 at 11:08am
Originally posted by roverstillidie roverstillidie wrote:

It's not about higher moral ground. It's about reacting when some goolie abuses an opposing player. The Gah fudged a number of recent incidents that football would not have tolerated. Back to the original point, it's unfair to state football in the south is sectarian. Football in the 6 is undoubtably improving and the Gah play both sides of the fence.


You're completely full of guff.... Have the soccer authorities never been arguably too lenient with punishment?? The GAA may have been too soft-handed in certain incidents (in your opinion) but thats no different to any other sporting authorities. To attempt to argue that soccer (or any sport for that matter) is somehow the morally pious sport on this island is nothing short of ludicrous. Sport generally follows society, as a society Ireland's issues with racism etc. are relatively mild, and because of this our sport's issues with it tend to be quite small too.
We're decent enough..
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Feb 2015 at 11:26am
So, is Drew Wylie good enough for the Poland game or will it bee too soon?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Danny Invincible Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Feb 2015 at 11:51am
Territorial; to suggest the FAI have a sectarian selection policy is simply ridiculous, not to mention scandalous. It should be pretty obvious to anyone without an anti-FAI agenda or anyone not trying to twist things through logical gymnastics; the FAI can't select or facilitate any player who doesn't want to play for them. It is also important for guys like Territorial (assuming he's not on a wind-up) to realise that an individual's religion is not a matter of public note south of the border in the same way it is north of the border.

Here is the section I wrote on that particular suggestion back in 2011:

Quote An accusation often levelled at the FAI is that it is engaged in a sectarian policy of targeting and poaching players from Catholic or nationalist backgrounds in Northern Ireland. It is claimed that this has the result of driving a wedge between the two communities. Again, there is no evidence for this whatsoever, nor is there any indication that the FAI would be unwilling to accept Northern Ireland-born Protestants into their teams. The FAI calling up Northern Ireland-born Irish nationals is neither deliberately sectarian nor sectarian in effect in that the FAI are simply accommodating the wish of Northern Ireland-born players good enough to play for the Republic of Ireland to realise their ambition. For all the FAI cares, they might as well be Catholic, Protestant or dissenter. The religious make-up of FAI teams just isn’t an issue. Nobody knows what the religious make-up of the Irish international team is because, frankly, nobody cares.

In fact, one could prove such an insulting inference wrong by pointing to the example of Alan Kernaghan. Kernaghan, who was born in England to English-born parents, but of Ulster Protestant descent, received 26 caps for the Republic of Ireland between 1993 and 1996. Kernaghan declared for the FAI after the IFA snubbed his advances due to an agreement they had in place with the other British associations at the time whereby Kernaghan or one of his parents would have had to have been born in Northern Ireland for him to qualify to play for Northern Ireland. As it was, Kernaghan only had Northern Ireland-born grand-parents. Alex Bruce and Adam Barton, who also qualified to play for the Republic of Ireland through Northern Ireland-born grand-parents, are similarly reported by Northern Ireland fans to be of Ulster Protestant heritage, but it never gave the FAI any cause for concern when selecting them. Furthermore, if one is to look through the various FAI teams, past and present, they will see players to have featured with heritages as diverse as NigerianMaghrebi and Turkish accompanying their Irish nationality.

It is true that those born in Northern Ireland who have declared for the FAI have almost exclusively been from a nationalist or Catholic background, but this is not indicative of any sectarianism on the part of the FAI; rather, it is indicative of the socio-cultural reality in Northern Ireland that distinguishes these individuals as the types who will, in contrast to those from a unionist background, naturally and primarily identify as Irish rather than as British or Northern Irish, feel an affiliation to the Republic of Ireland team and, therefore, dream to play for it one day. The FAI are merely enabling them to fulfil their wish so long as they are deemed good enough to compete in its teams. The fact that most players from NI who declare for the FAI are from nationalist backgrounds does not necessarily mean that the FAI must have targeted them either. It is entirely plausible that they will have made the moves themselves; moves that one naturally would not expect by a player from a unionist background for obvious reasons. In the unusual event that Northern Ireland-born Ulster Protestants, who generally tend to be of a unionist political persuasion, wished to declare for the Republic of Ireland, there is nothing whatsoever to indicate that the FAI would reject their advances. The FAI are not to blame for social division. The phenomenon of Northern Ireland-born players declaring for the Republic of Ireland might be a symptom or manifestation of a disjointed bi-communal society in the jurisdiction, but the FAI cannot be held accountable for this. If a community of people happen to be born in Northern Ireland, but are lukewarm to the notion of partaking in the cultural escapades of the dominant society, that is not the fault of the FAI.

Perhaps it would be considered impertinent to pose such a question, but if we are to carry an idea to its logical conclusion, it begs asking; why not, if Northern Ireland fans are so genuinely opposed to this alleged and so-called “footballing apartheid in Ireland”, advocate an all-island Ireland team? Of course, as is entirely understandable and to be expected, Northern Ireland fans will not advocate such a development. The reasons given, however - most likely, somewhere along the lines of apprehension over a possible loss or dilution of identity - will draw parallels with the reasons given by Northern Ireland-born Irish nationals as to why they would prefer to play for the Republic of Ireland over Northern Ireland. Surely then, to be at least consistent, such observers could empathise with the decisions of these players.


Edited by Danny Invincible - 26 Feb 2015 at 11:56am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BrendanD88 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Feb 2015 at 12:36pm

Spot on Danny Thumbs Up

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BrendanD88 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Feb 2015 at 12:37pm

Spot on Danny Thumbs Up

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote savo01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Feb 2015 at 1:02pm
 [/QUOTE] I am no supporter of the playing of GSTQ, but consider this.
How "comfortable" would an NI Prod feel supporting or playing for the ROI when you play The Soldier's Song?
 
The Soldiers Song is the national anthem of Ireland and used by the rugby team, at Olympic Games and most all island teams.  gstq is the GB & NI anthem and is not used by Scotland or Wales as you well know or by NI at the Commonwealth Games.  The NI pradisent would have to chose to play for ROI and would know what he was going to have to do.  Many NI kafflicks have openly stated they hated having to stand for gstq and had no option back in the day.   

As for your "hostile" part of Belfast comment, that is derisory and can only come from a state of complete ignorance. Perhaps you got it from Roy Keane's (first) Autobiography, when he described Windsor Park as being "in East Belfast"?
My "hostile" statement came from living in Belfast for 2 years and going to Windsor Park 7 times.  When you go off the Lisburn Road the atmosphere changes and as a kafflick form the Republic I had to "alter" my accent.  Hearing the ROI score boo'd when announced, the Billy Boys being sung in the kop, number of Union Flag's compared to green NI flag and players being called taig c**ts made me feel uncomfortable.  I remember 2 guys debating whether or not Switzerland was a kafflick country behind me.  One was convinced because they provided the guards for the Pope! 

And as the likes of Neil Lennon have seen you'd best not play for Celtic! 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Deane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Feb 2015 at 2:17pm
Good post Danny.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Danny Invincible Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Feb 2015 at 3:03pm
Amhrán na bhFiann is our national anthem, so it is only right nad natural that we would play it before games. If a northern unionist would not feel comfortable with that, there is no obligation upon him to effect his birthright to Irish nationality and declare for us. Likewise, if a northern nationalist would feel more culturally comfortable with us than he might with the IFA and its British nature/symbolism, he is entitled to declare for us or decide not to represent the IFA at all. That is the beauty of freedom and choice. The IFA can present themselves or identify however they wish (just like the FAI can too), be that with ‘Ulster Banners’, ‘GSTQ’ or whatever. That’s their right, but it’s simply irrelevant to me and is none of my business to be saying they should be doing this or that when I don’t have a stake in the association. So I’m not sure what your problem is here with the FAI, Territorial. Nobody is being compelled to do anything against their wishes.

And, savo, Irish nationals born north of the border have been, in principle, eligible to play for the FAI for so long as the entitlement to Irish nationality has been island-wide. Or since 1956, more precisely, with the passing of the Irish Nationality Act 1956.

As far back as 1946, the rule governing eligibility, Art. 21 al. 2 of the Regulations of the FIFA stated: 

“The players (NB. of International Matches) must be selected by the National Associations concerned and be subjects of the country they represent”.

Simple citizenship (including naturalisation) without conditions was enough to render a subject player eligible to play for a country up until 2004, when FIFA introduced further criteria (birth, birth of a parent or birth of a grandparent, or a number of years residence, in the territory of the association concerned) for those deemed to be acquiring a new nationality. It was to clamp down on potential abuse through naturalisations simply for footballing purpose. Specifically, Qatar were trying to naturalise Brazlian footballers. This change had no effect on northern-born Irish nationals, however, as they are Irish nationals from birth and, like all other Irish nationals from birth, qualify under what is now article 5.1 alone, which states:

“Any person holding a permanent nationality that is not dependent on residence in a certain country is eligible to play for the representative teams of the Association of that country.”

Thankfully, there is a greater awareness of the rules and rights of players nowadays, but, sadly, this was not always the case. In fact, it is known that Harry Cavan of the IFA prevented northern-born players, including Jimmy McGeough, from representing Ireland in the 1970s. It would appear that Cavan used his position in FIFA to wield undue influence and instruct northern-born players that they were ineligible for the FAI, which would have been in complete contravention of the rule in place at the time that rendered a player eligible for a national team if he possessed the nationality of that team, as McGeough did. Further info here:http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Football%3A+SHATTERED+dreams%3B+Derry+City+v+Waterford+-+FAI+League+Cup%E2%80%A6-a082207745

As to why I think northern-born players playing for the FAI is a relatively recent phenomenon, I’ve written some more on that here: http://backpagefootball.com/so-what-did-prompt-northerners-declarations-for-fai/34570/

It’s not as a result of the GFA at all; in my opinion, it’s mainly down to the introduction of a right to switch association once by FIFA combined with greater awareness of the rules. Players like Belfast-born Ger Crossley and Derry-born Mark McKeever played for the FAI before the GFA without impediment.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MayoMark Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Feb 2015 at 3:21pm
Lads, the last 2 pages have been totally irrelevant scutter.

Well done to the 19s yesterday, 6-0 win over Azbj.

Noe played full 90 as captain Ryan Manning came on as a sub and scored 2. The guy is absolute quality. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote savo01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Feb 2015 at 3:41pm
Danny, under old FIFA/UEFA rules if you played for a country at underage you were locked in.  many lads played for NI under 16's and that was that.  At 15 playing international football could get you scouted so turning it down was a brave move I suppose. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote savo01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Feb 2015 at 3:42pm
MayoMark,
If we stuck to topic's and talked sense this I'd be a very boring and dead forum LOLLOLLOLLOL
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Danny Invincible Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Feb 2015 at 3:52pm
Originally posted by savo01 savo01 wrote:

Danny, under old FIFA/UEFA rules if you played for a country at underage you were locked in.  many lads played for NI under 16's and that was that.  At 15 playing international football could get you scouted so turning it down was a brave move I suppose. 


That's true. Until late 2003/2004, there was no right to switch once capped competitively by an association at any level, so young players growing up in northern system who may otherwise have entertained notions of playing for the FAI might not have been on FAI's radar until after they were already tied to IFA.
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