Dan Crowley

I'd agree it isn't enough time, but at the same time, I don't think we've ever had a manager who tried it. They tend to look at what they have, assess it and arrive at the conclusion ''this is the way we'll play''. Oddly enough, one of the managers (JC) who had a choice of some of our finest footballers ever, assessed what he had, then deliberately set out to play in a more ''non-footballing'' direct manner after coming to the conclusion that most other teams weren't playing like that, wouldn't be able to deal with it, and it could get him results. 

He was right with that theory as well, and it did get results. Egil Olsen did similar with Norway for a few years too. All that was around 25-30 years ago though. The thing there is that Jack (and Egil) reverting to a basic game was actually somewhat innovative in itself at the time, most other teams were trying to play football. 

Mick did opt for a better style the first time around, but it took him a while to get there too, there was much (necessary) rebuilding & experimentation across the 2 campaigns we didn't qualify for under him. No manager today would get that time. The style we have been playing since he left in 2002 has been player driven and not manager driven, and when I say player driven, it is really the manager's assessment of players abilities. Stan, Trap & MON regularly commented they ''didn't have the players'', Kerr didn't say things like that in public, but the playing style was similarly conservative, as were his tactical decisions (Kavanagh for Robbie Keane V Israel when we were 2-0 up and cruising will always haunt me)

I mentioned Daniel Farke earlier on, and like probably everyone else, I never heard of him before he went to Norwich. The England U21 squad was named today and has 3 of his players in it, all debutants. If he took the ''I don't have the players'' approach, would those 3 lads have got games for Norwich or been selected for England U21 ? Would Rodgers have his current career if he took the ''I don't have the players'' approach at Swansea ?? 

I'd be the very first to agree our players have limitations, some of them fairly large ones, but the game has evolved to the point where coaches who bring those credentials are the ones being sought after. Generally not sought after by us though.  If the manager basically makes little difference to the way we play, and you could certainly argue the last few haven't, bar generally being defensively organised, why don't we give Noel King the job ? We did actually give him an important job for most of a decade, and it wasn't exactly a success. 

I suppose to sum all that up, we have a manager who looks at players, assesses their limitations and decides to play in a certain way. I think a more modern manager such as those mentioned in above post, would firstly identify a style of play, then identify the players he needs to fit that and work from there. That isn't as simple as deciding we are going to play like Man City either, we certainly don't have the players to do that, but when you look at yer attacking style Norwich and Sheff U (complete with overlapping centre backs) doing innovative things with players of roughly similar ability to ours (we even share 4 of them with Sheff U), I don't see why Ireland shouldn't attempt to come up with some innovation of our own, like Jack once did. 

In reality, what was originally an innovation by Jack got mistaken for a template by most of his successors, and we haven't really evolved from it in 3 decades, save for an intermission around 2002. Hopefully Kenny might change that with the aid of some exciting prospects, but if it doesn't change, we will likely never see another WC (unless they expand it....which they probably will) and as for the Euros, we will probably make 1 in 3 and not trouble anything further than the QFs unless we get lucky or play for pens. 

Improving the players is one thing but making them worse is another. We have all watched games with so called lesser opposition in which ireland were disorganised and struggled to move the ball. Also remember than other nations have the same amount of time with their players.

Sometimes it looked like there was no direction for the players at all 

That being said I think mccarthy is a vast improvement on what we've had for the last 10 years 

Then you have the well organised, difficult to beat lads like Hodgson & Dyche. Our managers have always been cut from this cloth rather than the other type. The top coaches success and style of play has affected everyone from chairmen to fans, most now want to play some kind of football that imitates the top teams, and chairmen are acting accordingly, going out actively seeking fellas who they think might be able to do this that were previously unheard of in the UK- Hassenhutil, Farke, or simply getting in a manager who changes the conservative style of play, like Brighton have done replacing Hughton with Potter. 

Irish fans are no different, but when it comes to selecting managers, we are top of the lack of imagination league, and have been for a long time. Delaney appointing Kenny could turn out to be an accidental stroke of genius, much the same as appointing Charlton was accidental. But accidental it is, there was certainly no thoughts coming down from the FAI about progressive football, if Kenny's appointment happens & works, its merely a coincidence. 

If it doesn't work, there will be a clamour on here to install Chris Hughton, another manager in the mould of Dyche, Roy H, Mick, MON who sets out with the aim of firstly not losing rather than winning. Sometimes ya get what ya deserve......

 

O'Shea is correct on that, but this is what I'm getting at the whole time- for a Crowley, or Byrne, or Wes type to actually make a difference, our whole philosophy has to change. We need CB's who can bring the ball out of defence and be able to hit an odd long pass or draw an opposition forward out of position to make an angle for a pass that might actually take an opposition player out of play- we currently have none of those. 

We need other the other midfielders to be able to get the ball with their back to the opposition goal, turn and pass forward or run forward with the ball to draw/commit lads into tackles- we don't have those either, we have Hendrick & Whelan. 

We need wingers who, when they get the ball, don't just tip it ahead of themselves and head for the corner in a race with the fullback, hoping to get a corner off a deflection from an attempt at a cross. We have McClean, who mostly does exactly those things, probably pragmatically realising a corner is our best chance of scoring. 

If the wingers can't beat their men with pace or skill, we need the CM's to support them and try play 1-2's/pass through the opposition midfield & defence and be able to switch play from one side to the other rapidly to stretch defences. We have Hendrick & Whelan etc. 

Putting Crowley, or Byrne, or whoever is designated ''the next Wes'' is into the team, isn't in itself going to make a huge difference when Duffy reverts to type under pressure and hits a long diagonal over that players head in the vague direction of whoever is standing out on the right wing. 

If we are ever going to evolve into a possession based team, we need more than one Crowley or Bryne or whoever lads that are comfortable with the ball at their feet to be playing as well. That isn't going to happen under this manager, same as it never happened under the last one or the last one before that. 

It did happen under Mick the first time, but the likes of Royston, Kinsella, Holland, Duff, McAteer, Finnan, Robbie, even Breen & Stan, were far better with the ball at their feet than the crew we have now. Mick being a pragmatist sees this so has gone the pragmatic route with this squad. 

Yes struggling their ambition is to be in the premier league they are closer to league one than the premiership.

Got a points deduction last season and sold their best player this summer.

That’s struggling to me.