'New York style' Zero Tolerence.Wouldit work here? |
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irishmufc
Robbie Keane I love Vulvas Joined: 09 Aug 2011 Location: Dublin Status: Offline Points: 25088 |
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That sounds like hocus pocus tbh.Im only going by what my cousins said who lived there but it was certainly a policy of hands on policing in all areas to combat it.I could be wrong though.The abortion thing may have helped but I doubt it was a substantial factor tbh |
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Wings? They're only the band The Beatles could have been.
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SuperDave84
Robbie Keane ooh Thomas, how could you do this to me! Joined: 26 Aug 2011 Location: Far Fungannon Status: Offline Points: 21384 |
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There's another theory that the elimination of lead piping in the water supply meant there was less stunted development and brain problems in people, resulting in less crime. There's definite correlation, but the causation argument is sketchy enough.
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irishmufc
Robbie Keane I love Vulvas Joined: 09 Aug 2011 Location: Dublin Status: Offline Points: 25088 |
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Good post SD.Ireland imo is still a pretty conservative country.Id imagine you may have trouble implementing these logical changes in terms of de-criminalising/legalising drugs for personal use as to be passed as a law.Definitely agree with ya on reducing sentences on non-violent crimes. Overall the need for more of a police presence in personnel terms and on the beat is the main point. |
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Wings? They're only the band The Beatles could have been.
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Baldrick
Robbie Keane Peyton-tly Pedantic Joined: 18 Sep 2008 Location: Ireland Status: Offline Points: 32784 |
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Yeah I read somewhere that this was a by product of what happened in Manhattan. Not sure how true it is. Kinda like cleaning up Dublin at the expense of Meath.
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AKA pedantic kunt
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irishmufc
Robbie Keane I love Vulvas Joined: 09 Aug 2011 Location: Dublin Status: Offline Points: 25088 |
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Again there's alot to be said for the psychology behind criminal actions but on ground level terms,the fact there was a change in philosophy in dealing with crime from whatever lenient system there was preceeding it to zero tolerence.It literally was an overnight war on crime headed by people like Bratton and Giuliani and it cost alot of money but New York is seeing the benefits of it for the last 20 years or so |
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Wings? They're only the band The Beatles could have been.
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Baldrick
Robbie Keane Peyton-tly Pedantic Joined: 18 Sep 2008 Location: Ireland Status: Offline Points: 32784 |
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ahem
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AKA pedantic kunt
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irishmufc
Robbie Keane I love Vulvas Joined: 09 Aug 2011 Location: Dublin Status: Offline Points: 25088 |
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I actually studied English Literature for 3 years in college. nice spot ya cxxt |
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Wings? They're only the band The Beatles could have been.
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eire77
Ray Houghton Joined: 08 May 2012 Location: Ireland Status: Offline Points: 2993 |
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Are ye sure that zero tolerance is tougher punishment for first time offenders? I was under the impression that it was more to do with prosecuting ALL offences no matter how minor or trivial.
I'm a massive fan of the "3 strikes and you're out" policy. I think courts can, and often should, be lenient on first time offenders. Anyone can make a mistake or be in a difficult situation and make the incorrect decision. Once you use your first chance and move into two or three offences the book should be thrown at you. This crap of lads with 60 or 70 convictions is absolute lunacy. Edited by eire77 - 01 Oct 2013 at 5:26pm |
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Just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get me...
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Baldrick
Robbie Keane Peyton-tly Pedantic Joined: 18 Sep 2008 Location: Ireland Status: Offline Points: 32784 |
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You use the term "alot" (sic) a lot on here, did not take much to spot it, its in many of your posts.
Edited by Baldrick - 01 Oct 2013 at 5:25pm |
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AKA pedantic kunt
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SuperDave84
Robbie Keane ooh Thomas, how could you do this to me! Joined: 26 Aug 2011 Location: Far Fungannon Status: Offline Points: 21384 |
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There's actually two "alot"s in that post. The other is three words in.
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Baldrick
Robbie Keane Peyton-tly Pedantic Joined: 18 Sep 2008 Location: Ireland Status: Offline Points: 32784 |
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I am glad muf is not a friend on facebook
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AKA pedantic kunt
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eire77
Ray Houghton Joined: 08 May 2012 Location: Ireland Status: Offline Points: 2993 |
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Just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get me...
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Baldrick
Robbie Keane Peyton-tly Pedantic Joined: 18 Sep 2008 Location: Ireland Status: Offline Points: 32784 |
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Said it earlier there will be many posts I make which have mistakes both in the context of spelling and grammar. That is why I used the words consistent. Everybody makes typos especially on forums.
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AKA pedantic kunt
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irishmufc
Robbie Keane I love Vulvas Joined: 09 Aug 2011 Location: Dublin Status: Offline Points: 25088 |
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As long as we're friends on ybig |
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Wings? They're only the band The Beatles could have been.
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Hoosay
Ray Houghton Joined: 18 Mar 2009 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 3933 |
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Yes it's a policy of prosecuting all offences no matter how trivial and applying the punishment consistently, not necessarily harsher punishments just no letting people off smaller things. There's no absolute proof that it works, crime did drop in NY during the zero tolerance period, but crime had been dropping before that, and crime dropped across the US over the same period including in cities that didn't have a similar policy. As someone mentioned there is a theory, I think it comes from superfreakonomics, that the drop in crime in NY also corresponds 20 or so year anniversary of abortion legalisation. Ultimately though I reckon SuperDave is right, it doesn't matter what your prosecution policy is, if you have more police on the streets doing actual police work, crime will drop. NY hired more police, crime rates fell, arguably they would have fallen without the zero tolerance policy with the police numbers they had.
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irishmufc
Robbie Keane I love Vulvas Joined: 09 Aug 2011 Location: Dublin Status: Offline Points: 25088 |
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Good post Hoosay.I do think people can fall into the trap of revisionism when it comes to zero tolerence.In football terms we've a revisionist mindset that if Jack Charlton played a passing game we'd have won the world cup.It wasn't zero tolerence there was a drop in crime anyway.When people like ourselves look at things retrospectively, there's always going to be a chance of inaccuracies.My cousins lived there at this time and seen it first hand, but then when they were relaying their experiences to me there's always the risk of exaggeration. What I do think is definite is there was a change in philosophy in New York which was supposed to have been a very dangerous city before Bratton implemented his changes.There was certainly not the police presence back then as there is now |
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Wings? They're only the band The Beatles could have been.
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