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What is generation woke?

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sid waddell View Drop Down
Roy Keane
Roy Keane

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sid waddell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Oct 2020 at 6:46pm
Originally posted by NewtNewbie NewtNewbie wrote:

Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

Originally posted by NewtNewbie NewtNewbie wrote:

Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

Originally posted by NewtNewbie NewtNewbie wrote:

Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

Originally posted by NewtNewbie NewtNewbie wrote:

Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

Originally posted by NewtNewbie NewtNewbie wrote:

Few people will actually wear the term with pride.

It probably has very negative connotations as far as most people are concerned. It was originally a term used amongst black people in the States, but is now is heavily associated with smug, white, privileged, middle-class bourgeois twats who only pay lip-service to social issues for appearances' sake without in any way actually properly understanding them, trying to understand them, nor really giving a genuine f**k about anyone or anything but themselves.
A lot of projection there

Its almost like you're not what you claim to be, and are in fact a troll LOL

You remind me of this

https://twitter.com/whysimonewhy/status/1143280089133699072


Eh? You're the queen of logical fallacies, extravagantly indulging in them in almost every response to anyone with whom you disagree, and yet regularly enjoy accusing others of the self-same thing.

Try constructing a thought-out, reasoned, cogent argument for once.

He did it

He said "logical fallacy" LOL

And he called me "the queen" LOL

Oh mercy


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8Tt-dxwLWmU


"YouTube"

Thanks for that LOL

It's quite a popular medium. Maybe you should try it out.

Do the quotation marks suggest you doubt its existence? I'm not quite sure.
I'm very familiar with YouTube, thanks

Strange that you think I wouldn't be

I've no idea why you'd post a YouTube link with no context as some sort of imagined rebuttal though 

Maybe you forgot to write "Do ur own reserch" and "lern to tink 4 urself"

What's clear about you from your posts is that you are a very strange individual who has very little to say yet is also unhealthily angry, and at me for some reason, a forum poster who until recently had never even interacted with you

Great to know I'm not being ignored, at least

Given what you posted last night I think you'd be best off taking a break from the internet and doing some reading instead, because it's clearly not healthy for you

There's a great deal to be angry about. And it's very healthy to kick against the pricks who think the sh*tty status quo is just dandy.

And evidently I'm one of the very few people on here who does actually read.
There is a great deal to be angry about, and you're angry about precisely none of it, given your pro-Trump, pro-Russia, pro-fascism trolling

But hey, shout "bourgeois", or something

The very definition of useful idiot

When I said do some reading, I meant read something that's actually worth reading - not Sputnik or Murdoch media






Edited by sid waddell - 17 Oct 2020 at 6:48pm
"ONE-NIL!" - David Coleman, George Hamilton - "Finding The Words - The Art of Commentary"

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NewtNewbie View Drop Down
Liam Brady
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NewtNewbie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Oct 2020 at 7:13pm
Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

Originally posted by NewtNewbie NewtNewbie wrote:

Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

Do the "anti-woke" loonies complain about the vicious abuse dished out to prominent women of colour such as Diane Abbott, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez and Ilhan Omar?

Did they complain about the constant vile misogynist threats against Hillary Clinton in 2016?

Did they fook

They lapped it up and they lap it up

Clinton was totally right with her "basket of deplorables" comment

The whole of right-wing politics is deplorable

Was this murderer right with her 'totally obliterate Iran', 'we came, we saw, he died' or her misspoken (lying) 'we landed under sniper fire' comments, as well?

What a sh*tty set of views you hold. Your perspective on the world, like those you hold dear like Clinton, et al, are completely vile.

As if you give a sh*t about racism and misogyny.

Utterly laughable.
You're nuts mate LOL



Another pitiful non-response. You'e ducked out of it again

Try debating the substantive issues.
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sid waddell View Drop Down
Roy Keane
Roy Keane

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sid waddell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Oct 2020 at 7:23pm
Originally posted by NewtNewbie NewtNewbie wrote:

Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

Originally posted by NewtNewbie NewtNewbie wrote:

Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

Do the "anti-woke" loonies complain about the vicious abuse dished out to prominent women of colour such as Diane Abbott, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez and Ilhan Omar?

Did they complain about the constant vile misogynist threats against Hillary Clinton in 2016?

Did they fook

They lapped it up and they lap it up

Clinton was totally right with her "basket of deplorables" comment

The whole of right-wing politics is deplorable

Was this murderer right with her 'totally obliterate Iran', 'we came, we saw, he died' or her misspoken (lying) 'we landed under sniper fire' comments, as well?

What a sh*tty set of views you hold. Your perspective on the world, like those you hold dear like Clinton, et al, are completely vile.

As if you give a sh*t about racism and misogyny.

Utterly laughable.
You're nuts mate LOL



Another pitiful non-response. You'e ducked out of it again

Try debating the substantive issues.
You are nuts though, that's the inescapable conclusion that one comes to from your posts

Nobody debates the issues more on this forum than I do

I have a very long record of very long posts which discuss the issues in detail

I also have the ability to understand context and nuance, while it's clear you don't

What you do have is a record of short, monosyllabic posts which contain a lot of shouting, buzzwords and personal abuse

Very little of substance

We don't even know your views beyond you shouting "bourgeois"and "racist" 

I thought I had the patent on being straw manned as accusing people of racism but here we have the real deal who actually does it in every post, and baselessly

Comedy stuff

It's almost like you're playing a character and there seems to be almost no attempt to debate in good faith there

I've seen these characters like you all over the internet, and I can smell a rat a mile away


"ONE-NIL!" - David Coleman, George Hamilton - "Finding The Words - The Art of Commentary"

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irishmufc View Drop Down
Robbie Keane
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote irishmufc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Oct 2020 at 7:35pm
@Newtnewbie 

I don't defend Hilary Clinton's previous foreign policy decisions or ideology in general but it's misleading to put up her 'obliterate Iran' comments without adding to the context that she was stating this as a retaliation to an Iranian attack on their ally Israel. 

She also supported the Iran Deal so without excusing her culpability in the Iraq War as someone that voted for it, your criticism of her when it comes to Iran is outdated. 
"I'm Louis Theroux. I'm Louis Theroux and his wry smile at the orgy"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Het-field Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Oct 2020 at 9:36pm
I actually think the OP raised two questions that have been totally lost over the past three pages.

Originally posted by seanyshuffler seanyshuffler wrote:

 
What kind of topics are up for debate and what aren't? 
What topics are up debate and what aren't due to liberal online consenus?

I will admit that there was a time I would have had somewhat of a  "question everything" mindset. But that was at a time when the hot button issues of the day were the Iraq War, and the Financial Crisis. These hot button issues were not exclusively a question of human rights, science, or empirical concerns. They were political, and as such most of that era was "ordinary time" where the normal issues of Government were out front and centre (sure Ireland didn't go to the polls on any issue (apart from two by-elections) between 2004-2007). You could hold that position rather comfortably, without impacting people too much. As the world has changed, and issues refocussed, many of the hot button issues of the day, are very much capable of being answered by deferring to science (coronavirus combatting, vaccines, climate change, sexual orientation) or indeed reference to human rights (reproductive, marriage, recognition of orientation). Essentially key debates are now on other issues, as social democracy breaks down borders and opens up new avenues.

Questions which have answers like this don't necessarily need debate, simply because one side come to it with facts, and science and social justice on their minds, while the other come to it with rhetoric, and an agenda, often laden with false claims and bogus answers. In that case debate is entirely dangerous as it minimises the importance of facts based on some flawed view of democracy, and then it becomes an auction about who can shout loudest, and in the pig-headed world of rhetoric, it tends to be the person who has less to offer, apart from their bluster.

Questions which serve to minimise or lessen, or weaken the human rights of others are dangerous. Debate in these areas has the implicit effect of legitimising or equalising positions which would serve to hurt other human beings, and weaken their ability to participate freely, and without impediment within society. Ireland has gradually opened up its once highly restrictive laws, and it has not led to the unravelling of society, nor does it negatively impact it. Progressive, and evolving social democracy is something that we should strive for, and the side of the debate in Divorce '95, Equal Marriage '15 and Repeal '18 that were against change lost, and across the board failed to make a coherent, and compassionate case that could in any way suggest that the had a valid point.

After that, everything else is on the table, and should be viewed through the prism of open and free debate. But those issues tend not evoke the same style of response, simply because they are issues that are correct for open and frank political debate. These issues tend not to come with the tag of "bigot", or "SJW" but terms like "Neo-liberal" (which has finally evolved into just "liberal"), and "communist". When in fact most people will come at the debate from what would be (on the political spectrum) the centre-left and the centre right. 

Originally posted by seanyshuffler seanyshuffler wrote:

So can people have a different view without coming across as right wing/bigot/woke/etc?

Yes, but there should be acceptance that there will be some issues, like the above that will prima facie identify as "right wing" or a "bigot", and in some cases no matter what somebody say, won't convince anybody of the point, but less so, change their mind as to the position one comes from. And, that is the person's own fault, not that of the people who believe them to be bigoted. And that is something that people with these positions should be aware of and accept as a hazard of taking these positions, especially after they have been resolved through legislative action or public vote. Equally, if somebody comes from an anti-science perspective, they will, fairly in my eyes, be judged that way. As an example, opposition to gay marriage is very difficult to comprehend, and it will be seen through the perspective of bigotry, and there is little available to convince people that it is a position that isn't motivated by bigotry.

As an aside, the term "woke" has not traditionally been pejorative. It has been used about people who have an awareness of social democracy, social justice, human rights, and science and fact. In fact, its not a term I have encountered int he pejorative sense until fairly recently, and I encountered the term some time ago. Equally, the term liberal (mentioned in the OP) doesn't deserve the opprobrium it gets. And because of its success, it gets harshly criticised by both "sides" who seem to be obsessed with it.




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jamo1 View Drop Down
Liam Brady
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jamo1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Oct 2020 at 9:45pm
Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

Do the "anti-woke" loonies complain about the vicious abuse dished out to prominent women of colour such as Diane Abbott, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez and Ilhan Omar?

Did they complain about the constant vile misogynist threats against Hillary Clinton in 2016?

Did they fook

They lapped it up and they lap it up

Clinton was totally right with her "basket of deplorables" comment

The whole of right-wing politics is deplorable
You mean people who are absolutely useless at their job? Look up Marilyn Mosby in Baltimore and see what a s*it show that city is at the moment because of her but we can't say anything bad about her because it would be racism. 
Del Boy: You do know what a pyscopath is dont you Grandad

Grandad: Of course i know what a Pyscopath is, its a fella who dresses up in womens clothes.

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sid waddell View Drop Down
Roy Keane
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sid waddell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Oct 2020 at 9:50pm
Originally posted by jamo1 jamo1 wrote:

Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

Do the "anti-woke" loonies complain about the vicious abuse dished out to prominent women of colour such as Diane Abbott, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez and Ilhan Omar?

Did they complain about the constant vile misogynist threats against Hillary Clinton in 2016?

Did they fook

They lapped it up and they lap it up

Clinton was totally right with her "basket of deplorables" comment

The whole of right-wing politics is deplorable
You mean people who are absolutely useless at their job? Look up Marilyn Mosby in Baltimore and see what a s*it show that city is at the moment because of her but we can't say anything bad about her because it would be racism. 
How are they useless at their job?

Because they're women of colour?

Apparently all Baltimore's problems are because of one woman of colour now, at least according to you

You didn't address any points in my post, you just engaged in a rant at women of colour

But hey, you're Not A Racist


"ONE-NIL!" - David Coleman, George Hamilton - "Finding The Words - The Art of Commentary"

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sid waddell View Drop Down
Roy Keane
Roy Keane

On a dark desert highway

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sid waddell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Oct 2020 at 12:52am
Very good Twitter thread here about the vile tactics of the right-wing "freeze peach" mob

They are anything but pro-free speech, they bully, intimidate, harass and try to destroy good people

It's a concerted strategy of silencing


Edited by sid waddell - 19 Oct 2020 at 12:53am
"ONE-NIL!" - David Coleman, George Hamilton - "Finding The Words - The Art of Commentary"

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