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Underage squads: Best Prospects

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DeclanDaly View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DeclanDaly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Feb 2015 at 2:33pm

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CJ Hamilton is going very well for Sheff Utd u21's at the moment mother is irish was reared in Ireland for a few years moved back to live with his father a few years back to concentrate on his football.
[/QUOTE]

I had not heard of him before, actually. Good spot. Conor Dimaio is another one of ours at Sheffield Utd, although he's not Irish born (if those are the rules we are playing by). Same age group, and already has a few first team games under his belt.

Agree on O'Hanlon. Been especially interesting to see how Liverpool have been using him in a midfield two. If he lacks pace, that might be his best position. Certainly seems to have a cultured left foot.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote savo01 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Feb 2015 at 1:38pm
Until NI stop playing gstq then the majority of Catholic's will not feel comfortable supporting and playing for them. That the stadium is based in a hostile part of Belfast will never help either.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote John W Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Feb 2015 at 8:16am
Originally posted by DeclanDaly DeclanDaly wrote:

Although the FAI certainly depends too much on 2nd/3rd genners or British clubs to develop Irish talent, I think the best of our under 21/19 age groups are definitely Irish-born or reared. A very decent side off the top of my head - 

Ian Lawlor (Man City)

Brian Lenihan (Hull City)
Pierce Sweeney (Reading)
Eoghan O'Connell (Celtic)
Sean Kavanagh (Fulham)

Jack Byrne (Man City)
Alan Browne (Preston)

Ryan Manning (QPR)
Joel Coustrain (Sheffield United)
Dylan Connolly (Ipswich)

Eoghan Stokes (Leeds)

Now, they may not be the best in the world, but they are pretty much the best that we have. Only Grealish, Hoban, Grego-Cox, maybe Garmston would be better of the English-born lads.



CJ Hamilton is going very well for Sheff Utd u21's at the moment mother is irish was reared in Ireland for a few years moved back to live with his father a few years back to concentrate on his football.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The O'Shea Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Feb 2015 at 1:17am
Originally posted by Territorial Territorial wrote:

Originally posted by The O'Shea The O'Shea wrote:

Originally posted by Territorial Territorial wrote:

Originally posted by The O'Shea The O'Shea wrote:


No one is saying that being a Catholic means he'll definitely consider
himself Irish or vice versa for a Protestant, but that fact combined
with his first name being Ruairi at least means there's an above average
chance that he does.
That wasn't my point.

Rather it is that the implication was that if a player is Catholic, then the FAI should approach him.

Which implies that if a player is a Prod (or has a Prod name), then the FAI shouldn't.

How discriminatory is that? I daresay if you asked the FAI, they would bleat that they're "open to all", yet the record shows that they only ever approach Catholic players.

Worse still, it's no thanks to the FAI that many Catholic players stick with NI, but if that were not the case, it would ultimately lead to there being two international teams in Ireland, the Prod one (IFA) and the Taig one (FAI).

Then again, maybe you lot don't care about that...

Meanwhile, we're the ones who get called "bigots".   

P.S. People from NI are "Irish", too - even the Prods, shock horror - so you have no monopoly on that description.


Thats not the FAI's policy though.... They couldn't give a cr*p what a persons religious background is, if they're good enough and want to play for us then the FAI will be happy to have them. I don't care either for matter.... Come on now, are you really gonna try and paint the FAI out to be the bigots, that's quite preposterous, the IFA have improved a lot on that front in recent years, but they're still miles ahead in the "bigot league".
"That's not the FAI's policy though".

It is a fact that every single player who has been approached has been Catholic.

Seems a pretty clear policy to me.

Originally posted by The O'Shea The O'Shea wrote:

The fact that [the IFA are] constantly harping on about "Catholic" and "Protestant" players shows that, no one has the slightest clue about the religious background of Ireland's players on the other hand...
Since when has anyone in the IFA ever been "constantly harping on" about "Catholic" and "Protestant" players?

Maybe you mean eg Michael O'Neill, or his big buddy Jim Magilton, or Gerry Armstrong, the man charged with identifying the barriers which may be deterring some young players form opting for NI?

Or half the team?

Originally posted by The O'Shea The O'Shea wrote:

Btw, if you're going to try and accuse someone else of being a bigot, you might want to omit terms such as "Taig" in future....
Er, you don't do Irony, do you?

But maybe you're right, perhaps I should have used the terms "Hun" and "Taig", to reflect the implications which flow from the FAI's clearly discriminatory recruitment policy. That way, no-one would be left in any doubt...

Originally posted by The O'Shea The O'Shea wrote:

And I never said you weren't Irish, you can be Irish if you so choose to be, but I'd wager a bet that you identify more closely as British or "Northern" Irish.
I am British - it says so on my Passport. I am also Irish, it's obvious the moment I open my mouth. I am equally proud of both.

But if you were to ask me how I most closely define myself, I would simply say I'm Northern Irish (no need for " "s round the Northern, btw)

As such, I object to the FAI's apparent belief that theirs is the "true" or "real" Ireland football team of that name, something which FIFA explicitly told them was not the case, indeed reserving that privilege for the IFA (when not playing in competition where they might encounter the FAI representative team).

Then again, why should we be surprised at the FAI wishing to steal that, too?


The FAI's official approach is not to approach any northern-born players at all, an approach that I completely disagree with. Any guys they have talked to is only because these guys signalled interest first. As it so happens nearly all of the guys who signal interest are "catholics", at least nominally. This is purely coincidental, it has nothing to do with any discriminatory policy within the FAI, Alan Kernaghan is living proof of this. You my friend are making the great mistake of arguing correlation without causation, but then again you already knew that, but it doesn't suit your ridiculous argument so you're willing to overlook it.....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RKeane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb 2015 at 11:06pm
The granny rule is disgraceful, Only players who are fully committed to Ireland should be allowed represent us. It's a shame when a English reject get a cap ahead of a irishman who would love nothing more than to represent his country, it does not matter who is more talented. Irish should play for Ireland, English play for England. Some players have never even step foot in the country including Christie.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Doyler1993 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb 2015 at 11:00pm
I think the best chances of new players are through hoban, murray, carruthers, williams, grealish, duffy  and browne with 6/7 of these being born outside the country.   Byrne lawlor mcevoy o hanlon and cleary could all make but haven't proved it above youth team level yet. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dubstep Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb 2015 at 10:59pm
O'Hanlon has a sweet left foot and passing range I havent seen by an Irish 18 year old in a long time, lacking a bit of pace but if he keeps developing he will be a top top player imo.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GreenDodger93 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb 2015 at 10:55pm
I'd have reservations about Pierce Sweeney and O'Hanlon
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SimonCox Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb 2015 at 10:40pm
"This is why the encouraging soundings about a collection of starlets born in 1998 have to be treated cautiously."

Who are these players??
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dubstep Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb 2015 at 9:35pm
Add Sam Byrne (Everton) and Kenny McEvoy (Spurs), Alex O'Hanlon and Daniel Cleary (Liverpool) to that list .Hopefully a few can make the breakthrough, I have high hopes for Byrne and O'Hanlon 2 very good technically assured players
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DeclanDaly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb 2015 at 9:26pm
Although the FAI certainly depends too much on 2nd/3rd genners or British clubs to develop Irish talent, I think the best of our under 21/19 age groups are definitely Irish-born or reared. A very decent side off the top of my head - 

Ian Lawlor (Man City)

Brian Lenihan (Hull City)
Pierce Sweeney (Reading)
Eoghan O'Connell (Celtic)
Sean Kavanagh (Fulham)

Jack Byrne (Man City)
Alan Browne (Preston)

Ryan Manning (QPR)
Joel Coustrain (Sheffield United)
Dylan Connolly (Ipswich)

Eoghan Stokes (Leeds)

Now, they may not be the best in the world, but they are pretty much the best that we have. Only Grealish, Hoban, Grego-Cox, maybe Garmston would be better of the English-born lads.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Doyler1993 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb 2015 at 5:21pm
Jack Charlton's ground-breaking exploits were supposed to serve as the catalyst for a home-grown breed to follow in the footsteps of a side that was heavily influenced by shrewd use of eligibility rules.

This narrative accompanied Brian Kerr's historic European U-16 and U-18 Championship wins in 1998, teams dominated by lads who were in primary school during the glory days.

Subsequently, the emergence of senior internationals from Waterford, Wexford, Tipperary and Donegal was cited as evidence of a regional spread arising from the major tournament buzz. We had Duff, Dunne and Robbie Keane too.

The tantalising hope was that the generation born after Italia '90 would come along and carry the torch with distinction. We could be waiting for a while.

As the first crop of '90s kids move steadily towards the prime of their career, just three established members of Martin O'Neill's squad are from that category. James McCarthy, who came into the world in November 1990, is the only guaranteed starter. Robbie Brady and Jeff Hendrick, both of whom turned 23 last month, are steadily making their presence felt.

Who else is there? Cyrus Christie (1992) made a good impression on his debut in November and looks like becoming a fixture around the group while Shane Duffy (1992) is on the fringes. Brian Lenihan (1994) and Ian Lawlor (1994) were called into the seniors to have a look but they've a long way to go.

Damning

This is a worryingly small group, and what's particularly damning is that McCarthy, Christie and Duffy grew up in a different jurisdiction.

Brady and Hendrick are flying the flag for the home-grown brigade and they are a good distance ahead of their peers with O'Neill short of options from a sluggish production line. He inherited this problem.

Unfortunately, there's no evidence of a flood of emerging talent waiting to bring the average age down. If Jack Grealish (of 1995 fame) committed he'd be in with a chance - let's not go there today - and Watford's Tommie Hoban (1994) is a contender. Again, it's telling that this duo were raised across the water.

QPR's recent purchase from Galway, Ryan Manning (1996), has a fan base that rates him highly yet it seems unfair to heap expectation on the handful tipped for the leap simply because the absence of alternatives sharpens the focus. Former great white hope Conor Clifford, now on loan at Conference dwellers Barnet from League Two Southend, might relate to that sentiment.

This is why the encouraging soundings about a collection of starlets born in 1998 have to be treated cautiously. There needs to be more than one or two making headlines; strength in numbers is what constitutes a well-prepared generation.

World champions Germany had 11 '90s babies in their squad for the November friendly with Spain although their extraordinary resources mean Irish eyes must look elsewhere for a fair comparison.

Up the road, there's Northern Ireland who have defied all expectations by flying out of the blocks in their Euros race with a youthful dressing room; ten of Michael O'Neill's original selection for their last outing in Romania were born in the Britpop era.

Granted, a dearth of options has led to the ex-Shamrock Rovers manager looking at inexperienced performers that wouldn't get anywhere near the other O'Neill's panel but the simple fact is they are gaining knowledge that will stand to this group. South of the border, the emergence of a Paddy McNair type at a leading Premier League force would be very welcome.

Poland, who come to Dublin next month as group leaders, named ten products of the '90s in their party for the November trip to Georgia.

Iceland, a modest football nation with a league of similar standard to ours, have capped 19 youngsters from that age bracket in the last 12 months. They're second in their qualifying group and almost made the World Cup.

The list goes on. Everywhere you look, national teams are benefiting from an injection of fresh blood. Ireland, on the other hand, are becoming a very old side reliant on the late bloomers that are a feature of the current environment.

Seamus Coleman is a typical example, winning his first cap at U-21 level after growing up on the bruising League of Ireland stage.

It is seven years since the FAI went Dutch and appointed Wim Koevermans to oversee technical direction.

He was replaced by Ruud Dokter in 2013 and the latter's upcoming Technical Development Plan will outline his vision although he's learned about the idiosyncrasies of the football family in his attempts to complete the blueprint.

Dokter said after his arrival that it may take 10 or 15 years for some of his ideas to bear fruit, an observation which didn't exactly paint the previous decade in a flattering light. History will be unkind to the manner in which the Irish game reacted to its first taste of international success.

Competition from other sports doesn't cut it as an acceptable excuse when strong participation levels - which do hint at good grass-roots work - are considered.

Elite development is key and the transition to the 21st century has been painfully slow. If we're relying on the millennium cubs to raise the bar then a challenging period lies over the horizon.

 


Not a good sign at all and as I have pointed out on one of the threads already over half of our u19/21 squads are made up of english born players with the best players from u19/21 usually english born as well. 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Territorial Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb 2015 at 3:54pm
Originally posted by The O'Shea The O'Shea wrote:

Originally posted by Territorial Territorial wrote:

Originally posted by The O'Shea The O'Shea wrote:


No one is saying that being a Catholic means he'll definitely consider
himself Irish or vice versa for a Protestant, but that fact combined
with his first name being Ruairi at least means there's an above average
chance that he does.
That wasn't my point.

Rather it is that the implication was that if a player is Catholic, then the FAI should approach him.

Which implies that if a player is a Prod (or has a Prod name), then the FAI shouldn't.

How discriminatory is that? I daresay if you asked the FAI, they would bleat that they're "open to all", yet the record shows that they only ever approach Catholic players.

Worse still, it's no thanks to the FAI that many Catholic players stick with NI, but if that were not the case, it would ultimately lead to there being two international teams in Ireland, the Prod one (IFA) and the Taig one (FAI).

Then again, maybe you lot don't care about that...

Meanwhile, we're the ones who get called "bigots".   

P.S. People from NI are "Irish", too - even the Prods, shock horror - so you have no monopoly on that description.


Thats not the FAI's policy though.... They couldn't give a cr*p what a persons religious background is, if they're good enough and want to play for us then the FAI will be happy to have them. I don't care either for matter.... Come on now, are you really gonna try and paint the FAI out to be the bigots, that's quite preposterous, the IFA have improved a lot on that front in recent years, but they're still miles ahead in the "bigot league".
"That's not the FAI's policy though".

It is a fact that every single player who has been approached has been Catholic.

Seems a pretty clear policy to me.

Originally posted by The O'Shea The O'Shea wrote:

The fact that [the IFA are] constantly harping on about "Catholic" and "Protestant" players shows that, no one has the slightest clue about the religious background of Ireland's players on the other hand...
Since when has anyone in the IFA ever been "constantly harping on" about "Catholic" and "Protestant" players?

Maybe you mean eg Michael O'Neill, or his big buddy Jim Magilton, or Gerry Armstrong, the man charged with identifying the barriers which may be deterring some young players form opting for NI?

Or half the team?

Originally posted by The O'Shea The O'Shea wrote:

Btw, if you're going to try and accuse someone else of being a bigot, you might want to omit terms such as "Taig" in future....
Er, you don't do Irony, do you?

But maybe you're right, perhaps I should have used the terms "Hun" and "Taig", to reflect the implications which flow from the FAI's clearly discriminatory recruitment policy. That way, no-one would be left in any doubt...

Originally posted by The O'Shea The O'Shea wrote:

And I never said you weren't Irish, you can be Irish if you so choose to be, but I'd wager a bet that you identify more closely as British or "Northern" Irish.
I am British - it says so on my Passport. I am also Irish, it's obvious the moment I open my mouth. I am equally proud of both.

But if you were to ask me how I most closely define myself, I would simply say I'm Northern Irish (no need for " "s round the Northern, btw)

As such, I object to the FAI's apparent belief that theirs is the "true" or "real" Ireland football team of that name, something which FIFA explicitly told them was not the case, indeed reserving that privilege for the IFA (when not playing in competition where they might encounter the FAI representative team).

Then again, why should we be surprised at the FAI wishing to steal that, too?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DeclanDaly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb 2015 at 2:11pm
Harry Charlsley scored one for Everton U18 as they beat Liverpool 5-0 at Finch Farm. He's having a good season in that age group and has turned out for the U21 side also. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_kufa2Km1DQ

Sam Allardyce has mentioned midfielder Josh Cullen (acaemy player of the year) as a player that could step-up to the first team this season. http://www.london24.com/sport/football/clubs/west-ham/west_ham_boss_looks_for_youngsters_to_step_up_1_3727733

Cullen is in the Ireland U19 squad this week.
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Looking forward to seeing how Jason Hunt gets on with the U18 home squad in Wales. An absolutely beautiful footballer with bags of potential. Have worked with him at U17/U18 level for nearly 3 years. He played 90 mins for us in the FAI Youth Cup Final in 2013, he was only 15 at the time, and he was well within his element then. Here's hoping
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dubstep Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Feb 2015 at 7:53pm
Seen a few goals he scored for Ireland's u 15s . He looks 2 footed and his goals were top draw looks very good.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RKeane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Feb 2015 at 6:58pm
Originally posted by Croftman Croftman wrote:

There's a young lad on the Under 15's, Glen McAuley, who's over with Liverpool I think. Saw him a few of Under 15 games this season and looks very good technically and is a good finisher. The captain, an O'Connor chap from Waterford, looks to have potential too.


I heard he scored 70+ goals in one season for Kilnamanagh
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dubstep Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Feb 2015 at 6:43pm
Catholic players usually identify as Irish that's the only reason I said that. I would love Prod players to play in fact an all Ireland team similar to the rugby one would be great imagine the likes of Steve Davis and Johnny Evans in the team we would have a much better side. Unfortunately I can't see it happening any time soon and I can't see any prod players playing for us as they have no desire I'd imagine . Can't blame Catholic players for wanting to play for us look what happened Neil Lennon.
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