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Robbie Keane
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Mar 2021 at 6:06pm
Originally posted by NewtNewbie NewtNewbie wrote:

Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

Originally posted by NewtNewbie NewtNewbie wrote:

Originally posted by Dalymount79 Dalymount79 wrote:

Originally posted by NewtNewbie NewtNewbie wrote:

Originally posted by Dalymount79 Dalymount79 wrote:

Originally posted by NewtNewbie NewtNewbie wrote:

I see Salmond wants to set up a separate anti-UK political vehicle, the Alba party.

I've never really understood why the SNP receives such widespread popularity in Ireland. Quite apart from the Nats' repugnant political philosophy and fascistic history, Scotland are and have always been an imperialist force, as they were even prior to joining the UK, with their Darien Scheme project in the 17th century in Panama. And that's even before we consider Scotland's attempt to invade Ireland in the 14th century.

They then went on to play a leading role at the vanguard of British imperialism. Weren't at least half a dozen of Britain's viceroys to India Scottish?

And they then went on to colonise the 6 counties, committing the most appalling atrocities, as anyone who's read books on the subject knows. Nearly every high-profile Unionist has a Scottish name.

But yeah, Scotland are the *victims* of colonialism rather than the perpetrators of it according to the Nats and many Irish people. 

I find this attitude vastly more repugnant than when you see English c**ts' chauvinistic revelling in their imperialist past. At least they aren't posing as the victims.

Scotland's history is not Ireland's history.

But just why do so many Irish people buy into the Scottish 'victim' narrative? Is it just sheer stupidity and ignorance, or are more sinister forces at work?

I take a reasonable interest in the Scottish referendum discussions but am no anorak on the subject. I’ve not heard  much of the victim card - more a discussion on what path a modern Scotland (whose devolved parliament is peppered with Irish names) should take with a bit of the usual jingoism thrown in.

I think reasonable people in countries with recent cultural shifts (financial independence at a young age relative to previous generations, rejecting religious doctrine, abortion access, same sex marriage etc..)like our own would listen with a sympathetic ear.

I see no evidence of this. Quite the reverse, in fact.

Young people are regularly living at home and financially dependent on their parents well into their thirties these days, from what I've seen. 
no idea what age you are - my parents went from leaving at home married like all their peers and generations before them - obvious exception are those who left for work-study away feom their home town within Ireland or emigration. Most in bigger towns all over where the same.

I bet lots of those 30+s you refer to have been on many a sub holiday / backpacked in Aus and so on. Something very few born before mid-60s would have experienced until they were will into their 20s. You also ignored my response to your nonsense post about victimhood.

It's not not 'nonsense'. I've given you my subjective take on the matter. The SNP have fomented an Anglophobic grievance culture. If you disagree, well that's fine. 

Scotland are the much-smaller junior partners in Britain's imperialist enterprises after their own colonialist ambitions failed, and resent England as a result.

For what it's worth I have strong familial links to Scotland and am very fond of the country.

I don't care one way or another if Scotland succeed from the Union, though from a personal point of view, it would be interesting to be eligible to be entitled to three passports rather than just two.

It's just that for the above reasons I find the Scottish victim narrative rather galling given their history.
*secede

Sorry, I just found it irritating.

Sorry, an autocorrected typo. In gratitude I will point out every inadvertent spelling and grammatical mistake you make from now on.
I genuinely appreciate it. Thanks.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NewtNewbie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Mar 2021 at 6:06pm
Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

Originally posted by NewtNewbie NewtNewbie wrote:

Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

Originally posted by NewtNewbie NewtNewbie wrote:

Originally posted by Dalymount79 Dalymount79 wrote:

Originally posted by NewtNewbie NewtNewbie wrote:

Originally posted by Dalymount79 Dalymount79 wrote:

Originally posted by NewtNewbie NewtNewbie wrote:

I see Salmond wants to set up a separate anti-UK political vehicle, the Alba party.

I've never really understood why the SNP receives such widespread popularity in Ireland. Quite apart from the Nats' repugnant political philosophy and fascistic history, Scotland are and have always been an imperialist force, as they were even prior to joining the UK, with their Darien Scheme project in the 17th century in Panama. And that's even before we consider Scotland's attempt to invade Ireland in the 14th century.

They then went on to play a leading role at the vanguard of British imperialism. Weren't at least half a dozen of Britain's viceroys to India Scottish?

And they then went on to colonise the 6 counties, committing the most appalling atrocities, as anyone who's read books on the subject knows. Nearly every high-profile Unionist has a Scottish name.

But yeah, Scotland are the *victims* of colonialism rather than the perpetrators of it according to the Nats and many Irish people. 

I find this attitude vastly more repugnant than when you see English c**ts' chauvinistic revelling in their imperialist past. At least they aren't posing as the victims.

Scotland's history is not Ireland's history.

But just why do so many Irish people buy into the Scottish 'victim' narrative? Is it just sheer stupidity and ignorance, or are more sinister forces at work?

I take a reasonable interest in the Scottish referendum discussions but am no anorak on the subject. I’ve not heard  much of the victim card - more a discussion on what path a modern Scotland (whose devolved parliament is peppered with Irish names) should take with a bit of the usual jingoism thrown in.

I think reasonable people in countries with recent cultural shifts (financial independence at a young age relative to previous generations, rejecting religious doctrine, abortion access, same sex marriage etc..)like our own would listen with a sympathetic ear.

I see no evidence of this. Quite the reverse, in fact.

Young people are regularly living at home and financially dependent on their parents well into their thirties these days, from what I've seen. 
no idea what age you are - my parents went from leaving at home married like all their peers and generations before them - obvious exception are those who left for work-study away feom their home town within Ireland or emigration. Most in bigger towns all over where the same.

I bet lots of those 30+s you refer to have been on many a sub holiday / backpacked in Aus and so on. Something very few born before mid-60s would have experienced until they were will into their 20s. You also ignored my response to your nonsense post about victimhood.

It's not not 'nonsense'. I've given you my subjective take on the matter. The SNP have fomented an Anglophobic grievance culture. If you disagree, well that's fine. 

Scotland are the much-smaller junior partners in Britain's imperialist enterprises after their own colonialist ambitions failed, and resent England as a result.

For what it's worth I have strong familial links to Scotland and am very fond of the country.

I don't care one way or another if Scotland succeed from the Union, though from a personal point of view, it would be interesting to be eligible to be entitled to three passports rather than just two.

It's just that for the above reasons I find the Scottish victim narrative rather galling given their history.
*secede

Sorry, I just found it irritating.

Sorry, an autocorrected typo. In gratitude I will point out every inadvertent spelling and grammatical mistake you make from now on.
I genuinely appreciate it. Thanks.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NewtNewbie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Mar 2021 at 7:01pm
The brutal and quite disgraceful behaviour of the police at the Sarah Everard vigil was all just dandy, according to the official police watchdog

The rise in misogyny and generalised undermining of women's rights, and pushback against gains achieved hereof, of a vulnerable class of people, really troubles me, with vile terms of male chauvinistic abuse such as 'feminazi' and 'terf' becoming evermore commonplace and acceptable. 

And, yes, the filth really are just that. Pathetic cowards. If it were another group of people they would of stood by and just 'observed'.

The militarisation of the police in England was precipitated by the Thatcher, regime, of course. 



Edited by NewtNewbie - 30 Mar 2021 at 7:01pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Mar 2021 at 7:50pm
As much as I agree with a lot of that, I cannot understand, or have yet to find, a reason to denied trans people proper rights. Perhaps you can enlighten me, because nobody else has.

Also, ACAB.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Green Cockade Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Mar 2021 at 8:38pm
Apparently it says in the Bilble that they don't exist, or something. So that's all right, then.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Mar 2021 at 9:17pm
Originally posted by Green Cockade Green Cockade wrote:

Apparently it says in the Bilble that they don't exist, or something. So that's all right, then.
That's all I can get, or other equally inadequate excuses. I just want to understand the logic behind it, but it appears there isn't any. It is just a complete lack of empathy because the majority of us have no understanding of what it is like and an opportunity to jump on  bandwagon of arrogance and superiority. 
Greed has won, big finance has won. Whatever small role elite clubs still play in the local communities from which they grew is dwarfed now by their position as global brands.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NewtNewbie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Mar 2021 at 9:30pm
An innocent young woman was kidnapped and murdered by a police officer, and then, in appalling scenes, women, at a vigil held in her memory, there only to show solidarity and to assert that, yes, actually women do have the right to be able to walk home at night without being faced with a violent end, were manhandled and physically abused by members of the selfsame group that caused this event.

And your only reaction to this to go on a complete non sequitur referencing entirely separate issues such as 'trans rights' and 'the Bible' ? 

I honestly don't know how to react.

If I were a liberal I'd be evoking the phrase 'male privilege'. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NewtNewbie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Mar 2021 at 9:32pm
Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

Originally posted by Green Cockade Green Cockade wrote:

Apparently it says in the Bilble that they don't exist, or something. So that's all right, then.
That's all I can get, or other equally inadequate excuses. I just want to understand the logic behind it, but it appears there isn't any. It is just a complete lack of empathy because the majority of us have no understanding of what it is like and an opportunity to jump on  bandwagon of arrogance and superiority. 

Nothing to say about the safety and murder of women and girls, then.

You both sound like a pair of MRAs.

Complete ignorance can be your only mitigation, I'll put it no stronger than that.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Green Cockade Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Mar 2021 at 9:42pm
There are times when satire can be smothered by the cacophony of barking dogmatism.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NewtNewbie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Mar 2021 at 9:45pm
Originally posted by Green Cockade Green Cockade wrote:

There are times when satire can be smothered by the cacophony of barking dogmatism.

Err, yeah.

Even more relevant than your previous contribution.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Newryrep Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Mar 2021 at 9:50pm
Originally posted by NewtNewbie NewtNewbie wrote:

The brutal and quite disgraceful behaviour of the police at the Sarah Everard vigil was all just dandy, according to the official police watchdog

The rise in misogyny and generalised undermining of women's rights, and pushback against gains achieved hereof, of a vulnerable class of people, really troubles me, with vile terms of male chauvinistic abuse such as 'feminazi' and 'terf' becoming evermore commonplace and acceptable. 

And, yes, the filth really are just that. Pathetic cowards. If it were another group of people they would of stood by and just 'observed'.

The militarisation of the police in England was precipitated by the Thatcher, regime, of course. 

 
How is the Tooting Popular Front these days ?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Mar 2021 at 9:54pm
Originally posted by NewtNewbie NewtNewbie wrote:

An innocent young woman was kidnapped and murdered by a police officer, and then, in appalling scenes, women, at a vigil held in her memory, there only to show solidarity and to assert that, yes, actually women do have the right to be able to walk home at night without being faced with a violent end, were manhandled and physically abused by members of the selfsame group that caused this event.

And your only reaction to this to go on a complete non sequitur referencing entirely separate issues such as 'trans rights' and 'the Bible' ? 

I honestly don't know how to react.

If I were a liberal I'd be evoking the phrase 'male privilege'. 
I would have assumed my views on what happened to Sarah Everard were obvious. The police are a disgrace in this country, particularly in London, but also in Bristol and Manchester, who have been given free-reign by a government that slides further to the right. Last year it emerged the police took selfies with the bodies of murdered girls. A police officer convicted of rape was allowed return to the force and when a young woman was brutally murdered by a police officer they felt the need to violently attack the crowd at a vigil for her death. I think we are all agreed there

Now that we have that cleared up, what wasn't obvious was what 'Terfs' had to do with it, which is why I asked the question.

Like every single person I have asked anywhere, or who has tried to bring it up anywhere,  you just get angry and shout and blame because you have nothing. I thought that may be the case.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NewtNewbie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Mar 2021 at 10:09pm
Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

Originally posted by NewtNewbie NewtNewbie wrote:

An innocent young woman was kidnapped and murdered by a police officer, and then, in appalling scenes, women, at a vigil held in her memory, there only to show solidarity and to assert that, yes, actually women do have the right to be able to walk home at night without being faced with a violent end, were manhandled and physically abused by members of the selfsame group that caused this event.

And your only reaction to this to go on a complete non sequitur referencing entirely separate issues such as 'trans rights' and 'the Bible' ? 

I honestly don't know how to react.

If I were a liberal I'd be evoking the phrase 'male privilege'. 
I would have assumed my views on what happened to Sarah Everard were obvious. The police are a disgrace in this country, particularly in London, but also in Bristol and Manchester, who have been given free-reign by a government that slides further to the right. Last year it emerged the police took selfies with the bodies of murdered girls. A police officer convicted of rape was allowed return to the force and when a young woman was brutally murdered by a police officer they felt the need to violently attack the crowd at a vigil for her death. I think we are all agreed there

Now that we have that cleared up, what wasn't obvious was what 'Terfs' had to do with it, which is why I asked the question.

Like every single person I have asked anywhere, or who has tried to bring it up anywhere,  you just get angry and shout and blame because you have nothing. I thought that may be the case.

Horrible slurs such as 'femanazi' and 'terf' are pejorative and degrading patriarchal terms of abuse, especially targeted at feminists and those that care about the rights of women, and make many females feel extremely disparaged and threatened.

If you don't realise this, and really have an interest in the issue, then investigate the matter further. 

And quite frankly as a man, I don't believe you have any kind of right to suggest otherwise.


Edited by NewtNewbie - 30 Mar 2021 at 10:13pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NewtNewbie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Mar 2021 at 10:11pm
Originally posted by Newryrep Newryrep wrote:

Originally posted by NewtNewbie NewtNewbie wrote:

The brutal and quite disgraceful behaviour of the police at the Sarah Everard vigil was all just dandy, according to the official police watchdog

The rise in misogyny and generalised undermining of women's rights, and pushback against gains achieved hereof, of a vulnerable class of people, really troubles me, with vile terms of male chauvinistic abuse such as 'feminazi' and 'terf' becoming evermore commonplace and acceptable. 

And, yes, the filth really are just that. Pathetic cowards. If it were another group of people they would of stood by and just 'observed'.

The militarisation of the police in England was precipitated by the Thatcher, regime, of course. 

 
How is the Tooting Popular Front these days ?

A pretty desperate response, but by the looks of things, you haveat least several allies on here.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Mar 2021 at 10:16pm
Originally posted by NewtNewbie NewtNewbie wrote:

Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

Originally posted by NewtNewbie NewtNewbie wrote:

An innocent young woman was kidnapped and murdered by a police officer, and then, in appalling scenes, women, at a vigil held in her memory, there only to show solidarity and to assert that, yes, actually women do have the right to be able to walk home at night without being faced with a violent end, were manhandled and physically abused by members of the selfsame group that caused this event.

And your only reaction to this to go on a complete non sequitur referencing entirely separate issues such as 'trans rights' and 'the Bible' ? 

I honestly don't know how to react.

If I were a liberal I'd be evoking the phrase 'male privilege'. 
I would have assumed my views on what happened to Sarah Everard were obvious. The police are a disgrace in this country, particularly in London, but also in Bristol and Manchester, who have been given free-reign by a government that slides further to the right. Last year it emerged the police took selfies with the bodies of murdered girls. A police officer convicted of rape was allowed return to the force and when a young woman was brutally murdered by a police officer they felt the need to violently attack the crowd at a vigil for her death. I think we are all agreed there

Now that we have that cleared up, what wasn't obvious was what 'Terfs' had to do with it, which is why I asked the question.

Like every single person I have asked anywhere, or who has tried to bring it up anywhere,  you just get angry and shout and blame because you have nothing. I thought that may be the case.

Horrible slurs such as 'femanazi' and 'terf' are pejorative and degrading patriarchal terms of abuse, especially targeted at feminists and those that care about the rights of women, and make many females feel extremely disparaged and threatened.

If you don't realise this, and really have an interest in the issue, then investigate the matter further. 

And quite frankly as a man, I don't believe you have any kind of right to suggest otherwise.
That's not even related to what I asked, but in its own way it answered it. Thanks for assuming my gender too.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NewtNewbie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Mar 2021 at 10:26pm
Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

Originally posted by NewtNewbie NewtNewbie wrote:

Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

Originally posted by NewtNewbie NewtNewbie wrote:

An innocent young woman was kidnapped and murdered by a police officer, and then, in appalling scenes, women, at a vigil held in her memory, there only to show solidarity and to assert that, yes, actually women do have the right to be able to walk home at night without being faced with a violent end, were manhandled and physically abused by members of the selfsame group that caused this event.

And your only reaction to this to go on a complete non sequitur referencing entirely separate issues such as 'trans rights' and 'the Bible' ? 

I honestly don't know how to react.

If I were a liberal I'd be evoking the phrase 'male privilege'. 
I would have assumed my views on what happened to Sarah Everard were obvious. The police are a disgrace in this country, particularly in London, but also in Bristol and Manchester, who have been given free-reign by a government that slides further to the right. Last year it emerged the police took selfies with the bodies of murdered girls. A police officer convicted of rape was allowed return to the force and when a young woman was brutally murdered by a police officer they felt the need to violently attack the crowd at a vigil for her death. I think we are all agreed there

Now that we have that cleared up, what wasn't obvious was what 'Terfs' had to do with it, which is why I asked the question.

Like every single person I have asked anywhere, or who has tried to bring it up anywhere,  you just get angry and shout and blame because you have nothing. I thought that may be the case.

Horrible slurs such as 'femanazi' and 'terf' are pejorative and degrading patriarchal terms of abuse, especially targeted at feminists and those that care about the rights of women, and make many females feel extremely disparaged and threatened.

If you don't realise this, and really have an interest in the issue, then investigate the matter further. 

And quite frankly as a man, I don't believe you have any kind of right to suggest otherwise.
That's not even related to what I asked, but in its own way it answered it. Thanks for assuming my gender too.

To further this discussion, are you a female? 

Feel absolutely free not to answer this, if you so choose. But your attitude to this whole subject would, to most reasonable people, very probably suggest otherwise.

For clarity's sake, I am not.


Edited by NewtNewbie - 30 Mar 2021 at 10:31pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Mar 2021 at 10:31pm
No, I am not and I do understand that argument, but you brought the subject up with your use of the term 'Terf' and I asked a genuine question that I have yet to get a satisfactory answer to regarding trans rights. I do not understand why any human being with an ounce of compassion would deny another their basic rights. I do not understand what you meant by the rest of it, but I can't understand how trying to be compassionate towards one of society's most vulnerable groups could be deemed wrong by anyone reasonable; if it is I would like to question their understanding of the word!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NewtNewbie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Mar 2021 at 10:51pm
Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

No, I am not and I do understand that argument, but you brought the subject up with your use of the term 'Terf' and I asked a genuine question that I have yet to get a satisfactory answer to regarding trans rights. I do not understand why any human being with an ounce of compassion would deny another their basic rights. I do not understand what you meant by the rest of it, but I can't understand how trying to be compassionate towards one of society's most vulnerable groups could be deemed wrong by anyone reasonable; if it is I would like to question their understanding of the word!

To be absolutely clear, I have transgender friends (I know, I know!). And feel absolutely no anathema towards the trans community. Why would I? 

But I brought up the issue of feminism, and state-backed violence against women and the feminist cause, and your knee-jerk reaction, as a self-admitted male, was hostility towards the feminist cause and evocation of the trans issue, and another poster. 'the bible'. A typically male response.

I mean, a woman was murdered.

And perhaps you, as a man, should reflect upon that. 

I refuse to accept the deeply offensive anti-feminist term of abuse 'terf' as acceptable, and so do many, many women.

And you, as a self-proclaimed male, have absolutely no right to dictate otherwise.


Edited by NewtNewbie - 30 Mar 2021 at 10:57pm
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