You Boys in Green Homepage YBIG Shop
Forum Home Forum Home : Other Forums : Whatever!
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - UK Politics Thread
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

UK Politics Thread

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 360361362363364 532>
Author
Message
Bob Hoskins View Drop Down
Moderator Group
Moderator Group
Avatar

Joined: 29 Jul 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 20175
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bob Hoskins Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Feb 2019 at 5:21pm
Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

Windrush was the product of a baying right wing racist Twitter and online comment sections mob (which the members of the now so called Independent Group were just fine with). 

So is this. 

And Javid, as somebody of Pakistani heritage, should be fooking ashamed of himself.

It's racism, misogynism and colonial arrogance all rolled into one. Pass the buck onto a country where the woman in question has likely never even been to, and which she may be eligible for citizenship of.

But sure what would you expect from a government whose buffoon of a previous foreign secretary made comments which backed up Iran's "reasoning" for imprisoning the British citizen Nazanin Zaghari-Ratcliffe.

I'll say this for our government - they used their influence to get Ibrahim Halawa back to Ireland when if they'd listened to online racist gobsh*tes Halawa would still be being tortured in an Egyptian prison, if not dead.


It would appear not. You would think Javid would have checked this first...


I have only followed the headlines and not read anything past it. I presume there are lots of male fighters been refused entry back into the UK? 
Romario 2016: And the ticket mafia gets caught! Well, four years ago I had already told the government.
Back to Top
sid waddell View Drop Down
Roy Keane
Roy Keane

On a dark desert highway

Joined: 20 Nov 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 12173
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sid waddell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Feb 2019 at 5:45pm
The colonial arrogance of the Brits over this is f**king astounding. 

"Hey, Bangladesh, listen up! We're stripping this brown girl of her citizenship - against our own counter-terrorism strategy - and we expect you, our former colony, to pick up the tab and take her in. We don't care that she's never even been to Bangladesh. This is on your heads now. Know your place, piccaninnies, and do what your rightful master Britain tells you to do."

"Oh, and any chance of a favourable trade deal, while you're at it?"


Edited by sid waddell - 21 Feb 2019 at 5:46pm
Back to Top
Martiponti View Drop Down
Kevin Kilbane
Kevin Kilbane
Avatar

Joined: 23 Dec 2018
Location: Montreal
Status: Offline
Points: 364
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Martiponti Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Feb 2019 at 10:18pm
hey, that's pretty heartless.Those guys have family too
Back to Top
pre Madonna View Drop Down
Robbie Keane
Robbie Keane
Avatar
I am MALDING

Joined: 30 Nov 2014
Location: Trumpton
Status: Offline
Points: 44659
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Feb 2019 at 10:24pm
Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

Originally posted by Het-field Het-field wrote:

Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

You can’t have a British society that sees Mo Farah, for example, as a hero and at the same time rejects that Begum is British.
I understand citizenship is not the same as nationality, but the way it is being done, for political point scoring leaves it open to be interpreted as racist. Legally, she has an incredibly strong case, which backs this up. 


But you’ll notice that there has been very little done to champion her case from any side of the political divide, which is why I feel there is no racial aspect to this. Again, this returns it to the involvement of ISIS in this case. Also, there remains legitimate safety concerns which will have to be dispelled.

Legally, it will all come down to whether she will or will not be left stateless. The facts of that will only come out in the fullness of time as the process trundles on, however, she is being legally represented and will have due process available.
Here's a thought experiment. 

Let's make up a hypothetical case which hypothetically happened in 2015.

15 year old Lorna Kelly was born and brought up in Manchester. She's the daughter of a white Irishman, Seamus Kelly, born in Tipperary, who moved to Manchester when he was 22, and a white English woman, Louise (nee Prescott), from Didsbury, Manchester. 

The Kelly family live happily in Didsbury. Lorna is one of three siblings, the others being 18 year old Brian, who is taking his A levels this year and hopes to study engineering at the University of Manchester, and 13 year old Catherine, who has just started secondary school. 48 year old Seamus runs a successful plumbing business while his wife, 46 year old Louise, is a nurse in the NHS. Seamus and Louise's long hours at work mean that they often aren't around at home, and if they are, they're invariably tired or asleep.

As she progresses through Didsbury Comprehensive School, Lorna is suffering from what appears to be a reasonably normal case of teenage angst. She thinks she's depressed and doesn't have very high self esteem. Through school she meets Safiyah, a Muslim girl of Pakistani parentage who lives in nearby Longsight, and starts hanging around with her and her friends. 

Lorna meets Safiyah's brother Faisal, who is 18. Faisal has a controlling but charismatic personality. Lorna finds herself deeply attracted to him, the feeling is mutual on Faisal's part, and the two begin a relationship, which progresses quickly. Lorna feels that Faisal has given her something to live for.

But another part of Faisal's personality is that he has been seduced by the ideas of the Islamic State. He comes from a family who are peaceful, but are devout Muslims. He rails against the racism he has experienced in his own life, but also what he sees as the colonial exploitation by the UK, the US and others, of Muslim majority countries, not just the Iraq War but Lybia, Syria, and Palestine. He becomes radicalised by online propaganda. He's extremely angry about what is happening in Syria and feels he has to do something. He sees the 2005 London bombs, the Lee Rigby murder and other attacks like Madrid and the Charlie Hebdo massacre and the Tunisian beach massacre as justified blowback for Western colonialism against Muslims.

During the course of their developing relationship, Faisal has influenced Lorna heavily with these ideas. Lorna has never been in love before now, implicitly trusts Faisal, and what Faisal says to her about the situation in Syria resonates massively with her. Within six months, she's almost as fervent in her beliefs about what is happening in Syria as Faisal is. 

Then Faisal decides the time has come to do something. He tells Lorna he's going to Syria to fight for the Islamic State. Lorna begs him not to, but Faisal is insistent that he is going. Lorna realises she can't stop him, so the next best thing is that she can join him. 

The two go to Syria. 

Faisal believes he is fighting in a just cause. But he is ruthless, and is not afraid to kill people in a brutal fashion. 

For a while, Lorna is happy there, but gradually she becomes more and more homesick, and on the rare occasions she sees Faisal, he becomes more and more controlling and manpulative. Nevertheless, by 2017, the two have got married. Lorna is now the archetypal "Jihadi Bride".

In 2018, Lorna gives birth to her and Faisal's baby. But by now, Islamic State are losing the war, Faisal has been captured by Assad's forces, and Lorna and her new baby are living in a refugee camp in Idlib, alone and desperate. She does not speak Arabic. Lorna wants to go home to her family in Manchester. And yet, she's still not sorry she came to Syria, and still believes in the ideas that Faisal has taught her. She thinks she still loves him.

Word gets out in the UK media about her situation. Despite being entitled to an Irish passport through parentage, Lorna only holds British citizenship. It's now 2019 and Lorna is now 19. 

Back in Britain, Lorna's desperate family, who have been bereft and going through agonies since she suddenly left in 2015, make representations to their local Labour MP, to the Home Secretary Sajid Javid, and in the media, to "please bring our daughter and her baby home". 

Because the family are "respectable" and "relatable" to Middle England, their plight receives a good deal of sympathy in politics, the media and in society in general, even in traditionally Tory areas and in the Tory press.

What happens?

Does Javid say "sorry, we're revoking Lorna's British citizenship, leaving her stateless, and let her stew on her own out in Syria"? 

Does he say "oh, she's entitled to Irish citizenship, let the Irish deal with her", especially with the backdrop of the Brexit crisis?

Does he f**k.

A white girl from a nice middle class family in Manchester does not have their citizenship revoked. 

And that's how it's impossible to deny that race is a major factor in Shamima Begum having her British citizenship revoked. 











Clap
Back to Top
irishmufc View Drop Down
Robbie Keane
Robbie Keane
Avatar
I love Vulvas

Joined: 09 Aug 2011
Location: Dublin
Status: Online
Points: 24975
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote irishmufc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Feb 2019 at 10:54pm
Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

Originally posted by irishmufc irishmufc wrote:

Screaming anti-semitism is consistently used as the ultimate smokescreen for any pro-Israel mouthpiece which is primarily designed to shut down debate about the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. They don't have any legal,moral or justifiable argument for the illegal settlements and excessive use of military force on an enclosed civilian population. 

Lets just switch the argument to anti-semitism as being the bigger issue rather than holding states like Israel to account. It doesn't have to be either or. You can be critical of Israeli foreign and domestic policy in a logical sense and still tackle anti-semitism at home. 
There is a lot of truth in that, unquestionably. I mean why would the Jewish Chronicle ignore incidents in the Tories but make a massive deal of any incidents in Labour.

The bigger problem, not just in politics or individual parties, is the muddying of the waters around what is and isn’t anti-Semitic, often by Zionists. At last years Labour Conference there were three supposed incidents, all from members of the Labour Friends of Israel, all of them made the news, all of them dismissed. Joan Ryan was involved in one. 
On the flip side of that, possibly as a result, you have people on social media who use horrific anti-Semitic racism to voice their anti-Zionism, which is not only needlessly wrong, but helps strengthen Israel’s hand here. They don’t need any help!

Speak of the devil, you've probably seen George's take on her LOL 


Wings? They're only the band The Beatles could have been.
Back to Top
LO SCIENZIATO View Drop Down
Liam Brady
Liam Brady

Fucknut Of The Year

Joined: 24 Aug 2018
Status: Offline
Points: 1520
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LO SCIENZIATO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Feb 2019 at 8:36am
Originally posted by SuperDave84 SuperDave84 wrote:

Jeremy Corbyn has just said he thinks she should be allowed to return to the UK, incidentally.

And rightly so! she is a British citizen and should be allowed return. upon her return she should be arrested at border security, sent for trial and be given a fair hearing. it is as simple as that but instead it's been blown out of all proportions. 
it's nearly as bad as all the right wing loopers who have come out to  support and back Maduro in the media and on social media. 


Edited by LO SCIENZIATO - 22 Feb 2019 at 8:36am
Back to Top
colemanY2K View Drop Down
Roy Keane
Roy Keane
Avatar
Fresh minty breath

Joined: 01 Mar 2010
Location: London
Status: Offline
Points: 14959
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote colemanY2K Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Feb 2019 at 10:21pm
Jeremy Hunt was in Slovenia yesterday. Unfortunately he got Slovenia & Slovakia mixed up calling his host country a former Soviet vassal state. Doesn't sound like the history of the Balkans or Yugoslavia is a strong point of his.

Anyway the Slovenes took it well.....not!

Franka De Mille #FBPE @FRANKADEMILLE


Milan Brglez, former president of the Slovenian parliament:
 
“The British foreign minister comes to Slovenia asking us for a favour (to discuss with the foreign minister how to avoid a no-deal Brexit) while arrogantly insulting us. We were never a 'vassal state of the Soviet Union'."


whoops LOL


Edited by colemanY2K - 22 Feb 2019 at 10:22pm
"One of the dominant facts in English life during the past three quarters of a century has been the decay of ability in the ruling class." Orwell, 1942.
Back to Top
Het-field View Drop Down
Roy Keane
Roy Keane

By Appointment to His Majesty The King

Joined: 08 Mar 2016
Status: Online
Points: 10345
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Het-field Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Feb 2019 at 9:24pm
A gutsy move by Corbyn tonight. If he follows through and either causes an election which ultimately delays Brexit, or indeed spearheads a second vote, that will have the capacity to turn some traditionally Tory strongholds Labour, particularly the second vote. If not, he has at least taken a statesmanlike approach by no pandering to the pockets of Labour vote that want Brexit. This also guarantees a legitimate alternative to May’s Deal or “No Deal”. His approach should interest the new Independent Grouping, and the LDs.

I also give him great credit for paying no heed to the opinion of the paranoid left, who will join UKIPPers in lamenting this call.
Back to Top
SuperDave84 View Drop Down
Robbie Keane
Robbie Keane
Avatar
ooh Thomas, how could you do this to me!

Joined: 26 Aug 2011
Location: Far Fungannon
Status: Offline
Points: 21384
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SuperDave84 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Feb 2019 at 9:32pm
Also, despite some rumours to the contrary, it *seems* any amendment on their part for a second referendum will include a remain option; this is from a briefing to all members of the Parliamentary Labour Party.



Of course, first of all, that is not definitive and the language makes it look like it is *not* agreed what the options would be. Secondly, this could all a ploy on Corbyn's part because he hopes it won't pass. There's every possibility of plenty of leave Labour MPs denying the whip and voting against this motion for fear of their own seats and not enough remain Tory MPs defying *their* whips.

Nonetheless, the possibility of Brexit denied has increased today.
Back to Top
pre Madonna View Drop Down
Robbie Keane
Robbie Keane
Avatar
I am MALDING

Joined: 30 Nov 2014
Location: Trumpton
Status: Offline
Points: 44659
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Feb 2019 at 10:13pm
It is the right thing to do, but it is a huge political gamble. You can talk about the 'paranoid left', but there are a lot of Labour voters who will be angry about this.
In saying that, it is the right thing to do and that is what it should be about.
Back to Top
Het-field View Drop Down
Roy Keane
Roy Keane

By Appointment to His Majesty The King

Joined: 08 Mar 2016
Status: Online
Points: 10345
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Het-field Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Feb 2019 at 10:19pm
Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

It is the right thing to do, but it is a huge political gamble. You can talk about the 'paranoid left', but there are a lot of Labour voters who will be angry about this.
In saying that, it is the right thing to do and that is what it should be about.

In fairness, I wouldn’t call all Labour Brexit voters the paranoid left. Even amongst those who would be angered by this decision. But I think it is statesmanly of Corbyn, even if the practicalities are out of reach. It really changes the dynamic of the next month.
Back to Top
pre Madonna View Drop Down
Robbie Keane
Robbie Keane
Avatar
I am MALDING

Joined: 30 Nov 2014
Location: Trumpton
Status: Offline
Points: 44659
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Feb 2019 at 10:22pm
Originally posted by Het-field Het-field wrote:

Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

It is the right thing to do, but it is a huge political gamble. You can talk about the 'paranoid left', but there are a lot of Labour voters who will be angry about this.
In saying that, it is the right thing to do and that is what it should be about.

In fairness, I wouldn’t call all Labour Brexit voters the paranoid left. Even amongst those who would be angered by this decision. But I think it is statesmanly of Corbyn, even if the practicalities are out of reach. It really changes the dynamic of the next month.
Agree with all that, but as I have said all along that if Corbyn mismanages this he could turn red areas blue, a fear the Conservatives didn't have. I hope he has got it right.
Back to Top
Het-field View Drop Down
Roy Keane
Roy Keane

By Appointment to His Majesty The King

Joined: 08 Mar 2016
Status: Online
Points: 10345
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Het-field Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Feb 2019 at 10:33pm
Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

Originally posted by Het-field Het-field wrote:

Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

It is the right thing to do, but it is a huge political gamble. You can talk about the 'paranoid left', but there are a lot of Labour voters who will be angry about this.
In saying that, it is the right thing to do and that is what it should be about.

In fairness, I wouldn’t call all Labour Brexit voters the paranoid left. Even amongst those who would be angered by this decision. But I think it is statesmanly of Corbyn, even if the practicalities are out of reach. It really changes the dynamic of the next month.
Agree with all that, but as I have said all along that if Corbyn mismanages this he could turn red areas blue, a fear the Conservatives didn't have. I hope he has got it right.

To me, I think turning Victoria Borwick seat in 2017 Was an example of how Brexit can change minds. She was out of step with the demography and with the voters in 2016, and paid the price. There are also plenty of areas that even if the vote share dropped it wouldn’t be nearly enough to swing blue. UKIP might benefit, but 2015 was almost as good as it could get, as reorganisation is beyond them 
Back to Top
pre Madonna View Drop Down
Robbie Keane
Robbie Keane
Avatar
I am MALDING

Joined: 30 Nov 2014
Location: Trumpton
Status: Offline
Points: 44659
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Feb 2019 at 10:42pm
Originally posted by Het-field Het-field wrote:

Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

Originally posted by Het-field Het-field wrote:

Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

It is the right thing to do, but it is a huge political gamble. You can talk about the 'paranoid left', but there are a lot of Labour voters who will be angry about this.
In saying that, it is the right thing to do and that is what it should be about.

In fairness, I wouldn’t call all Labour Brexit voters the paranoid left. Even amongst those who would be angered by this decision. But I think it is statesmanly of Corbyn, even if the practicalities are out of reach. It really changes the dynamic of the next month.
Agree with all that, but as I have said all along that if Corbyn mismanages this he could turn red areas blue, a fear the Conservatives didn't have. I hope he has got it right.

To me, I think turning Victoria Borwick seat in 2017 Was an example of how Brexit can change minds. She was out of step with the demography and with the voters in 2016, and paid the price. There are also plenty of areas that even if the vote share dropped it wouldn’t be nearly enough to swing blue. UKIP might benefit, but 2015 was almost as good as it could get, as reorganisation is beyond them 
There's plenty that are though. Near to me you have Peterborough, Ipswich and Bedford, just off the top of my head and there are traditionally safe Labour seats in  Wales, Yorkshire  and Northumberland that are all marginal.

Back to Top
Trap junior View Drop Down
Robbie Keane
Robbie Keane
Avatar
YBIG Minister of Doom & Gloom

Joined: 25 Jan 2010
Location: Irish Riviera
Status: Offline
Points: 39490
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Trap junior Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Feb 2019 at 10:46pm
I've been too busy pursuing my vendetta against MON to pay attention tot he Brexit news today.  Is there going to be a referendum?
Pied Piper to: Baldrick, Brendan 88, 9Fingers, Borussia and more...

97.6% chance this post will be replied to by Baldrick (source: PWC)
Back to Top
LO SCIENZIATO View Drop Down
Liam Brady
Liam Brady

Fucknut Of The Year

Joined: 24 Aug 2018
Status: Offline
Points: 1520
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LO SCIENZIATO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Feb 2019 at 8:51am
Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

It is the right thing to do, but it is a huge political gamble. You can talk about the 'paranoid left', but there are a lot of Labour voters who will be angry about this.
In saying that, it is the right thing to do and that is what it should be about.

Jezza the man! Clap
Back to Top
the_walls View Drop Down
Jack Charlton
Jack Charlton
Avatar
6 in a row, alive alive oh..

Joined: 13 Feb 2009
Location: Walkinstown
Status: Offline
Points: 5182
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote the_walls Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 2019 at 8:02am
I see the Daily Mail has a few articles now outlining the terrible consequences of no deal because they simply can't deny reality any longer. Their readers certainly can though, going by the comments under these articles. There really is a huge amount of deluded morons in Britain. 

If these idiots look for an extension simply to go round and round in the same circles the EU should tell them where to go. 
Back to Top
Het-field View Drop Down
Roy Keane
Roy Keane

By Appointment to His Majesty The King

Joined: 08 Mar 2016
Status: Online
Points: 10345
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Het-field Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 2019 at 9:42am
Originally posted by the_walls the_walls wrote:

I see the Daily Mail has a few articles now outlining the terrible consequences of no deal because they simply can't deny reality any longer. Their readers certainly can though, going by the comments under these articles. There really is a huge amount of deluded morons in Britain. 

If these idiots look for an extension simply to go round and round in the same circles the EU should tell them where to go. 

My understanding (for some reason) is that an extension will only be granted in the event of General Election, or fresh negotiations, which will undoubtedly lead to an even less desirable version of “the deal” from a UK point of view. They won’t grant it simply because the UK’s house isn’t in order.

I think the take away the UK have got from this is that any illusions of desperation on the part of the EU is far fetched.
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 360361362363364 532>
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 12.00
Copyright ©2001-2018 Web Wiz Ltd.