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Ray Houghton
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote planning Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Nov 2021 at 1:48pm
Originally posted by Mr Brick Mr Brick wrote:

As it says on the COP26-approved recyclable packaging, Artie - two wins against canon fodder after 15 competitive games. The post was in support of Murph who was bagged in McG's shambolic cheapie for the crime of expressing a different take on Pep Kenny. Enjoy the celebrations. 

What does it say on "COP26-approved recyclable packaging"? What has the COP26 tree hugger convention got anything to do with Irish football, or even football in general?

One of the wins against the so called cannon fodder, meant we finished level with them on 9 points. Cannon fodder international teams never finish with so many points.

As the results have improved, the focus has changed from we need to beat Luxembourg, to we need to wait until the NL to make a decision. It's only a few weeks since Kenny had special pullouts, full of columnists and former players queueing up to tell us why he needs to be sacked, as his win rate was what it was. Now it's 20%, it's not being written about on a daily basis, and we're not seeing the "another game with Kenny is another game wasted" tripe here anymore. 

The only winner in this campaign has been patience. Patience from Kenny to stick to his principles, and patience from the FAI to give him the time to turn the tables. And a lot more patience will be needed as time goes on, because the team and the transition itself, is still very much a work in progress. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote McG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Nov 2021 at 1:55pm
Originally posted by planning planning wrote:

Originally posted by Mr Brick Mr Brick wrote:

As it says on the COP26-approved recyclable packaging, Artie - two wins against canon fodder after 15 competitive games. The post was in support of Murph who was bagged in McG's shambolic cheapie for the crime of expressing a different take on Pep Kenny. Enjoy the celebrations. 

What does it say on "COP26-approved recyclable packaging"? What has the COP26 tree hugger convention got anything to do with Irish football, or even football in general?

One of the wins against the so called cannon fodder, meant we finished level with them on 9 points. Cannon fodder international teams never finish with so many points.

As the results have improved, the focus has changed from we need to beat Luxembourg, to we need to wait until the NL to make a decision. It's only a few weeks since Kenny had special pullouts, full of columnists and former players queueing up to tell us why he needs to be sacked, as his win rate was what it was. Now it's 20%, it's not being written about on a daily basis, and we're not seeing the "another game with Kenny is another game wasted" tripe here anymore. 

The only winner in this campaign has been patience. Patience from Kenny to stick to his principles, and patience from the FAI to give him the time to turn the tables. And a lot more patience will be needed as time goes on, because the team and the transition itself, is still very much a work in progress. 

I rarely, if ever, interact with you on here Planning but spot on Clap
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TooOldForThis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Nov 2021 at 3:00pm
A guy who refers to COP-26 as a tree hugger convention! That's the level we are dealing with. Every manager has his honeymoon period, a period of development and transition. Kenny has had the NL and WC campaigns. He can no longer rely on the work in progress excuse. There is nowhere in football where managers don't live or die by results (except maybe youth football). He has the next NL to prove he is up to it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Badgersboys9 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Nov 2021 at 3:05pm
Originally posted by TooOldForThis TooOldForThis wrote:

A guy who refers to COP-26 as a tree hugger convention! That's the level we are dealing with. Every manager has his honeymoon period, a period of development and transition. Kenny has had the NL and WC campaigns. He can no longer rely on the work in progress excuse. There is nowhere in football where managers don't live or die by results (except maybe youth football). He has the next NL to prove he is up to it.

Thanks Jonathan.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TooOldForThis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Nov 2021 at 3:06pm
Originally posted by Badgersboys9 Badgersboys9 wrote:

Originally posted by TooOldForThis TooOldForThis wrote:

A guy who refers to COP-26 as a tree hugger convention! That's the level we are dealing with. Every manager has his honeymoon period, a period of development and transition. Kenny has had the NL and WC campaigns. He can no longer rely on the work in progress excuse. There is nowhere in football where managers don't live or die by results (except maybe youth football). He has the next NL to prove he is up to it.

Thanks Jonathan.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote planning Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 2021 at 11:40pm
Originally posted by TooOldForThis TooOldForThis wrote:

Every manager has his honeymoon period, a period of development and transition. Kenny has had the NL and WC campaigns. He can no longer rely on the work in progress excuse. There is nowhere in football where managers don't live or die by results (except maybe youth football). He has the next NL to prove he is up to it.

20 games is a long honeymoon period. He never had a honeymoon period. He didn't have a crowd to play in front of, for 18 months. Some wrote him off before he boarded the flight to Sofia.

The NL doesn't matter. At least until it has more than 4 teams in it's "finals". Germany lost 6-0 in Spain a year ago, and at home to Macedonia soon afterwards. Didn't hurt them too much in getting to the WC. 

We have got 5 points in the last 2 campaigns combined. I wouldn't be judging him after it's over. It's little more than an excuse to blood more players and tweak more tactics in preparation for the serious business the following year. Then he has to be competitive, and after it people have the right to judge him. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TooOldForThis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2021 at 9:44am
Originally posted by planning planning wrote:

Originally posted by TooOldForThis TooOldForThis wrote:

Every manager has his honeymoon period, a period of development and transition. Kenny has had the NL and WC campaigns. He can no longer rely on the work in progress excuse. There is nowhere in football where managers don't live or die by results (except maybe youth football). He has the next NL to prove he is up to it.

20 games is a long honeymoon period. He never had a honeymoon period. He didn't have a crowd to play in front of, for 18 months. Some wrote him off before he boarded the flight to Sofia.

The NL doesn't matter. At least until it has more than 4 teams in it's "finals". Germany lost 6-0 in Spain a year ago, and at home to Macedonia soon afterwards. Didn't hurt them too much in getting to the WC. 

We have got 5 points in the last 2 campaigns combined. I wouldn't be judging him after it's over. It's little more than an excuse to blood more players and tweak more tactics in preparation for the serious business the following year. Then he has to be competitive, and after it people have the right to judge him. 
So essentially, judgement of SK should be suspended until the completion of about 30 matches? Yes, that is a very long honeymoon.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Left foot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2021 at 9:57am
I think the conditions of kennys appointment have been very different from most other managers. Mccarthy had a remit to get us to the euros...Trap and O'Neil had similar remits.

Kenny was tasked with completely rebuilding an aging and underperforming team, changing the style in which we played since Charlton and working with different formations. 

Before Kenny started a lot of people on here 
 discussed sacrificing a tournament such was the task at hand.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote t_rAndy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2021 at 10:15am
I have said awhile now that I am only really judging him since Serbia away. The playoffs and nations leagues were just a complete shambles with the way the situation was with Covid. Same for all teams but Kenny as a new manager stepping up to this level, trying to change the team and approach and then given those handicaps to deal with, we all wish it wouod have been better but its also understandable that we weren't firing on all cylinders.  And at the end of the day, Slovakia, Finland, Wales and even Bulgaria are no mugs and you have to be on it to beat them. We were competitive in all games, but we were really struggling to create chances which was a concern. Our defence was generally good.

This campaign started off similar, mistakes were being made and we lost to Serbia as the second best team and then had that disaster against Lux were we deserved nothing. I started having my doubts. But since the change in system and the Portgual game, things have improved enormously and even though we also had a very poor result against Az at home and mistakes were made in that game too, overall we should have won the game and they players missing chances would get more of the blame for me.

The NL will be a great test with a more settled side, crowds should be back against decent enough opposition. Like the first NL but this time with experience and knowing your best team.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TooOldForThis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2021 at 11:06am
I think there is a consensus emerging on this forum that the next NL is the time to evaluate SK's performance without further caveats. We will be playing teams of similar notional ability.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fozz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2021 at 11:18am
Originally posted by TooOldForThis TooOldForThis wrote:

I think there is a consensus emerging on this forum that the next NL is the time to evaluate SK's performance without further caveats. We will be playing teams of similar notional ability.

The fact that SK even came out to target winning the group shows he is confident the squad will be up for the challenge.
I think that's a stretch and would be a major achievement based on our squad, but at the same time, we need to be competitive in the group, get a few wins, likely lose a couple and see where we find ourselves.

I see no reason why we can't give as good as we get in this 3rd NL, unlike the previous two.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FrankosHereNow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2021 at 11:24am
Originally posted by TooOldForThis TooOldForThis wrote:

I think there is a consensus emerging on this forum that the next NL is the time to evaluate SK's performance without further caveats. We will be playing teams of similar notional ability.
No there’s not. It’s a very small number of posters repeating themselves constantly.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Claret Murph Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2021 at 11:33am
Originally posted by FrankosHereNow FrankosHereNow wrote:

Originally posted by TooOldForThis TooOldForThis wrote:

I think there is a consensus emerging on this forum that the next NL is the time to evaluate SK's performance without further caveats. We will be playing teams of similar notional ability.
No there’s not. It’s a very small number of posters repeating themselves constantly.
 
 A bit like the 86% ,  "he needs to be given more time " " Should be given a 10 year contract "
 
We can keep saying the same things on both sides Frank .
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TooOldForThis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2021 at 11:35am
Originally posted by FrankosHereNow FrankosHereNow wrote:

Originally posted by TooOldForThis TooOldForThis wrote:

I think there is a consensus emerging on this forum that the next NL is the time to evaluate SK's performance without further caveats. We will be playing teams of similar notional ability.
No there’s not. It’s a very small number of posters repeating themselves constantly.
Not sure whether that means you consider judgement on SK should continue to be suspended beyond the next NL, or that judgement should be in place as of now. Or that you are just having a go for the sake of it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 9fingers Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2021 at 11:47am
Originally posted by TooOldForThis TooOldForThis wrote:

Originally posted by FrankosHereNow FrankosHereNow wrote:

Originally posted by TooOldForThis TooOldForThis wrote:

I think there is a consensus emerging on this forum that the next NL is the time to evaluate SK's performance without further caveats. We will be playing teams of similar notional ability.
No there’s not. It’s a very small number of posters repeating themselves constantly.
Not sure whether that means you consider judgement on SK should continue to be suspended beyond the next NL, or that judgement should be in place as of now. Or that you are just having a go for the sake of it.
He’s not having a go. He’s stating fact based of numerous polls on here and elsewhere 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FrankosHereNow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2021 at 12:24pm
Originally posted by Claret Murph Claret Murph wrote:

Originally posted by FrankosHereNow FrankosHereNow wrote:

Originally posted by TooOldForThis TooOldForThis wrote:

I think there is a consensus emerging on this forum that the next NL is the time to evaluate SK's performance without further caveats. We will be playing teams of similar notional ability.
No there’s not. It’s a very small number of posters repeating themselves constantly.
 
 A bit like the 86% ,  "he needs to be given more time " " Should be given a 10 year contract "
 
We can keep saying the same things on both sides Frank .
If there’s an 86/14 split and the 14% are making up 50% of the comments, it would indicate it’s a small number of people repeating themselves.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FrankosHereNow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2021 at 12:24pm
Originally posted by 9fingers 9fingers wrote:

Originally posted by TooOldForThis TooOldForThis wrote:

Originally posted by FrankosHereNow FrankosHereNow wrote:

Originally posted by TooOldForThis TooOldForThis wrote:

I think there is a consensus emerging on this forum that the next NL is the time to evaluate SK's performance without further caveats. We will be playing teams of similar notional ability.
No there’s not. It’s a very small number of posters repeating themselves constantly.
Not sure whether that means you consider judgement on SK should continue to be suspended beyond the next NL, or that judgement should be in place as of now. Or that you are just having a go for the sake of it.
He’s not having a go. He’s stating fact based of numerous polls on here and elsewhere 
Exactly
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Left foot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2021 at 12:33pm
Personally I think its fair to measure Kenny on the nations league games now. He needs to maintain and build on progress made.

The areas of concern are visible to everyone and it won't be a surprise if I say we need to improve in the forwards area. Robinson has done well but his shooting boots won't always be on.

I'd say the final third needs to improve, January is key to the ofr us, loan moves are very much needed.


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