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It's the Stephen Kenny Thread

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Liam Brady
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote E2016 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2021 at 5:10pm
Originally posted by planning planning wrote:

Originally posted by Trap junior Trap junior wrote:

The Championship is a stronger league than most European leagues such as Belgium, Norway, possibly even Holland now. 

If Luxembourg are any good they wouldn't be ranked where they are or the results they have gotten over the last 2 years.

We should be beating them. Simple as that. 

The Championship is an awful standard of football, always has been. It's the second tier for a reason. Unfortunately that's the highest club level most of our players are these days. And it shows on the international stage. 

Of course we should not expect to beat Luxembourg away from home. These days, Luxembourg internationals are scoring goals against Real Madrid in the European Cup, while the only squad player we have up to that level, is being urged to get away from there and go on loan instead, by the fans, and the pundits, and more worryingly, by his own manager. Just to lower the standard of available resources even further. 

McCarthy was hired to get us to the Euros, simple as that. He failed. So reminding us what his win ratio was against the mighty Gibraltar and New Zealand doesn't gloss over the fact he didn't do the job he was appointed for. 

Twice. 


This is completely untrue.

Being the league below the strongest league in the world is not a bad thing.

Name me another 2nd tier league where players move around for 10-20 million.

The mighty Serbia have Mitrovic playing up front for them, but he is good, it's our players that play in the Championship that are not good. Keep acting as if a ton of the players in the Championship wouldn't walk into those 'Champions League' elite teams.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote irishmufc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2021 at 5:13pm
Originally posted by MayoMark MayoMark wrote:

Why is everything black and white these days?

Why is it that if you're happy to see Kenny continue, you're a part of some cult?

Why is it that if you liked Mick, somehow that means you don't like Kenny?

Can it be that you could have been a fan of both? Or changed your mind at some stage about one of them? 


I'm not speaking about you specifically here but if you are a poster that thinks it's acceptable to see Kenny continue after this campaign despite failing to beat Luxembourg or Azerbaijan in 4 outings resulting in no competitive wins in 15 competitive games, then you are completely blind in your support for Kenny.

No other Irish manager especially from a non LOI background would get anywhere near this cultist devotion in similar circumstances.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote B6 6HE Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2021 at 5:20pm
Originally posted by E2016 E2016 wrote:

Originally posted by planning planning wrote:

Originally posted by Trap junior Trap junior wrote:

The Championship is a stronger league than most European leagues such as Belgium, Norway, possibly even Holland now. 

If Luxembourg are any good they wouldn't be ranked where they are or the results they have gotten over the last 2 years.

We should be beating them. Simple as that. 

The Championship is an awful standard of football, always has been. It's the second tier for a reason. Unfortunately that's the highest club level most of our players are these days. And it shows on the international stage. 

Of course we should not expect to beat Luxembourg away from home. These days, Luxembourg internationals are scoring goals against Real Madrid in the European Cup, while the only squad player we have up to that level, is being urged to get away from there and go on loan instead, by the fans, and the pundits, and more worryingly, by his own manager. Just to lower the standard of available resources even further. 

McCarthy was hired to get us to the Euros, simple as that. He failed. So reminding us what his win ratio was against the mighty Gibraltar and New Zealand doesn't gloss over the fact he didn't do the job he was appointed for. 

Twice. 


This is completely untrue.

Being the league below the strongest league in the world is not a bad thing.

Name me another 2nd tier league where players move around for 10-20 million.

The mighty Serbia have Mitrovic playing up front for them, but he is good, it's our players that play in the Championship that are not good. Keep acting as if a ton of the players in the Championship wouldn't walk into those 'Champions League' elite teams.

The Championship is comfortably in the top 10 leagues in Europe. For overall standard, its probably 7th or 8th in Europe.

There's 24 decent sides. All competitive. Every game is close to call. Its a proper league. The PFA CAhampionship team of the year is very strong every year.

The top 6 in the Championship are better than at least 7 or 8 CL group sides and better than most of the EL sides.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BrendanD88 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2021 at 5:24pm
Cultist devotion LOL

If you honestly believe this you’re a weird freak.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote B6 6HE Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2021 at 5:28pm
Originally posted by BrendanD88 BrendanD88 wrote:

Cultist devotion LOL

If you honestly believe this you’re a weird freak.

There is a Kenny cult.

All form of logical reasoning is gone. It is cultist
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote planning Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2021 at 5:28pm
Originally posted by E2016 E2016 wrote:

A good strategy here is to talk up minnow leagues, ignore the fact that the Premier League is the best league in the world and that the Championship is very competitive as a result. You definitely want to ignore the fact that teams who do well in the Championship often compete very well in the Premier League after promotion (with largely the same players) - no, because the Championship is bad and our players playing there is bad. 

So yeah, do all of that and I think they'll have you.

LOLLOLLOL

Birmingham - Relegated 
Blackpool - Relegated 
Bournemouth - Relegated
Cardiff - Relegated 
Fulham - Relegated
Huddersfield - Relegated
Swansea - Relegated
Watford - Relegated
Wigan - Relegated
West Brom - Relegated 
Norwich - Relegated
Sheffield Utd - Relegated

They are clearly clubs not up to EPL level, but apparently their standard of  players are up to qualifying for Euros and World Cups with us.

LOLLOL LOL
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Trap junior Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2021 at 5:37pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote B6 6HE Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2021 at 5:37pm
Originally posted by planning planning wrote:

Originally posted by E2016 E2016 wrote:

A good strategy here is to talk up minnow leagues, ignore the fact that the Premier League is the best league in the world and that the Championship is very competitive as a result. You definitely want to ignore the fact that teams who do well in the Championship often compete very well in the Premier League after promotion (with largely the same players) - no, because the Championship is bad and our players playing there is bad. 

So yeah, do all of that and I think they'll have you.

LOLLOLLOL

Birmingham - Relegated 
Blackpool - Relegated 
Bournemouth - Relegated
Cardiff - Relegated 
Fulham - Relegated
Huddersfield - Relegated
Swansea - Relegated
Watford - Relegated
Wigan - Relegated
West Brom - Relegated 
Norwich - Relegated
Sheffield Utd - Relegated

They are clearly clubs not up to EPL level, but apparently their standard of  players are up to qualifying for Euros and World Cups with us.

LOLLOL LOL

Most if the sides listed above are stringer than all but the best of international sides.

The standard of international ball ain't that high.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote t_rAndy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2021 at 5:45pm
Originally posted by irishmufc irishmufc wrote:

Originally posted by MayoMark MayoMark wrote:

Why is everything black and white these days?

Why is it that if you're happy to see Kenny continue, you're a part of some cult?

Why is it that if you liked Mick, somehow that means you don't like Kenny?

Can it be that you could have been a fan of both? Or changed your mind at some stage about one of them? 


I'm not speaking about you specifically here but if you are a poster that thinks it's acceptable to see Kenny continue after this campaign despite failing to beat Luxembourg or Azerbaijan in 4 outings resulting in no competitive wins in 15 competitive games, then you are completely blind in your support for Kenny.

No other Irish manager especially from a non LOI background would get anywhere near this cultist devotion in similar circumstances.  

its not cultist reasoning from my perspective we are prepared to give him a chance given all the circumstances and yes some of those might look like excuses but they are hard facts, like no home fans against Lux was a major disadvantage. Nothing to do with him being LOI. I find it hard to listen to him myself so not like i love the guy. But he trying something a bit different and knee jerk reactions without any plan B I would be less in favour of. 
For me, I started to really judge him from the Serbia game as the NL was a bedding on period and it was chaotic. 
Based on what I saw so far, we probably deserved the following results:
Serbia L
Lux D
Portugal D
Azerbaijan W
Serbia L

Not good enough to qualify anyway but Serbia and Portugal are strong. 
Now for sure its one thing deserving more vs. doing it but I think you need to see more than 5 games. The return fixtures and how we do will be key


Edited by t_rAndy - 29 Sep 2021 at 5:47pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote E2016 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2021 at 5:46pm
Originally posted by planning planning wrote:

Originally posted by E2016 E2016 wrote:

A good strategy here is to talk up minnow leagues, ignore the fact that the Premier League is the best league in the world and that the Championship is very competitive as a result. You definitely want to ignore the fact that teams who do well in the Championship often compete very well in the Premier League after promotion (with largely the same players) - no, because the Championship is bad and our players playing there is bad. 

So yeah, do all of that and I think they'll have you.

LOLLOLLOL

Birmingham - Relegated 
Blackpool - Relegated 
Bournemouth - Relegated
Cardiff - Relegated 
Fulham - Relegated
Huddersfield - Relegated
Swansea - Relegated
Watford - Relegated
Wigan - Relegated
West Brom - Relegated 
Norwich - Relegated
Sheffield Utd - Relegated

They are clearly clubs not up to EPL level, but apparently their standard of  players are up to qualifying for Euros and World Cups with us.

LOLLOL LOL


How long were Wigan in the PL for? How long were Swansea? How long were Bournemouth? How long were Birmingham? What kind of argument is that - here look at all these teams that managed to compete for years and years after getting promoted? Thanks for making my argument for me.

Sheffield United - where did they finish in their first season?

How about Wolves, Southampton, Aston Villa, West Ham, Leicester who won the Premier League two seasons after promotion? Crystal Palace, Leeds, Burnley? Brighton (taken up by that average Chris bloke)?

All of those teams came up in the timeframe that you've included there.

You've had an absolute mare there. Like a catastrophic mare. My god. LOL

The fact remains, the Premier League is the strongest league in the world in terms of talent. That is absolutely undeniable. The Championship being the tier below the strongest league doesn't mean that it isn't strong. To start claiming that players playing in minnow European leagues are playing at a higher level than the Championship, just because their league is the premier league in their country, is complete dung.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gufct Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2021 at 5:46pm
ah ffs the forum being spammed by the usual suspects again.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote E2016 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2021 at 5:54pm
Originally posted by gufct gufct wrote:

ah ffs the forum being spammed by the usual suspects again.


You've posted this almost exact same message 5 times in September alone in Stephen Kenny threads.

Thats more spam than people having a back and forth on Kenny.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote B6 6HE Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2021 at 6:01pm
Originally posted by E2016 E2016 wrote:

Originally posted by gufct gufct wrote:

ah ffs the forum being spammed by the usual suspects again.


You've posted this almost exact same message 5 times in September alone in Stephen Kenny threads.

Thats more spam than people having a back and forth on Kenny.

Another Kenny cult tactic.

Any argument against his embarrassing record is either Spam or a WUM or a dinosaur 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote shakeyshamrock Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2021 at 6:05pm
Originally posted by horsebox horsebox wrote:

Originally posted by shakeyshamrock shakeyshamrock wrote:

Originally posted by horsebox horsebox wrote:


Your bigging up their players to something they clearly are not and dismissing our players completely, Matt Doherty being nothing more than an EPL reserve - he was one of the best wing backs in the EPL for a number of years.

Losing an home to Luxembourg is an unacceptable result. 


The same Doherty that was hooked at half time in that game? The same guy who didn't really play all that much last season, or this? It's fine to say he had 2 good seasons with Wolves, but we didn't play Luxembourg during that time.. 

I see the Luxembourg result very much like a cup upset - it's not nice when it happens, but they come up from time to time - and if you dig into the reasons for it, you will find that the level their players play at and the level ours play at are not wholly dissimilar - the added fact that they've been playing as a team together for a long time and we're in a rebuild and a bit callow, well, it was made for them to do what they did and they took their chance well.. 

I think if you find it "unacceptable" that's about you and your expectations.. I didn't like it as a result, and I didn't enjoy the match, but hey! it's football, you get good results, you get bad ones.. The real test for our players and management is the response to it (and the Aze result) and how they do in the return games.. it's ok to lose, that happens.. but we have to learn from it - we'll find out over the next few games how much we've learned.. 

Why is beating Luxembourg at home an unacceptable expectation?



I said that if you think it's unacceptable that's about you and your expectations.. I said nothing about whether or not your expectations are acceptable or not.. I don't really know if you can have an "unacceptable expectation".. what would that even mean? 

I think it's reasonable to expect to win a portion of our home games, but I also think it's reasonable to expect that we'll lose a bit too as we're a young inexperienced team.. we're naive, callow, raw - whatever way you want to describe us.. we're going to get done a few times, but hopefully that's how we'll learn.. for example, I don't expect us to concede two late goals to lose a game we're winning again, I would hope that lesson was well and truly learnt. 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Left foot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2021 at 6:13pm
I guess you could equally argue there's a cult for Kenny-out.

Where the obsession is that anyone but Kenny can make us "competitive". 

Which I believe is the trigger word used to demonstrate a handful of wins in ten years.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote E2016 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2021 at 6:19pm
Originally posted by Left foot Left foot wrote:

I guess you could equally argue there's a cult for Kenny-out.

Where the obsession is that anyone but Kenny can make us "competitive". 

Which I believe is the trigger word used to demonstrate a handful of wins in ten years.


Well we have been competitive under most of the managers that came before him. He is the worst manager we ever had, that's a fact.

Despite all that if Kenny gets 2 wins from the 3 remaining games then most people will accept another campaign, including me.

However you (well I for one) get the sense that others would be happy to see him get the Euros regardless of what happens in the remaining games.

At that point, there isn't much else to call it other than cult like.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote planning Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2021 at 6:21pm
Originally posted by E2016 E2016 wrote:

How long were Wigan in the PL for? How long were Swansea? How long were Bournemouth? How long were Birmingham? What kind of argument is that - here look at all these teams that managed to compete for years and years after getting promoted? Thanks for making my argument for me.

Sheffield United - where did they finish in their first season?

How about Wolves, Southampton, Aston Villa, West Ham, Leicester who won the Premier League two seasons after promotion? Crystal Palace, Leeds, Burnley? Brighton (taken up by that average Chris bloke)?

All of those teams came up in the timeframe that you've included there.

You've had an absolute mare there. Like a catastrophic mare. 

The fact remains, the Premier League is the strongest league in the world in terms of talent. That is absolutely undeniable. The Championship being the tier below the strongest league doesn't mean that it isn't strong. To start claiming that players playing in minnow European leagues are playing at a higher level than the Championship, just because their league is the premier league in their country, is complete. 

Who cares how long they were in the EPL for? The argument put out is that it's a strong league, among the 7 or 8 best in Europe. What a load of rubbish.

The Championship is a league you spend your life either trying to get out of, or try to stay out of. The quality is horrendous. The 7th place team in it can, and has been promoted in the past. The overwhelming majority of the teams who have got out of it, have spent their entire existence in the EPL battling to beat the drop. The one side who won the EPL did it after just about beating the drop. The manager who did that spent the following year fighting the drop and was of course, sacked for it, because everyone wants to avoid playing in the Championship at all costs. Plus, with no VAR available to stop offside goals given and vice versa, or stop players being assaulted to the ground as at Luton v Swansea recently, I really can't be bothered with it tbh.

It's true that every national league in Europe isn't EPL standard. But one thing those who play in it and their national team have, are meaningful trophies, medals, successful sides and European club experience. Something you're not going to get slumming it with Fulham and West Brom and Sheffield United, in the league that we pick most of our players from atm. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 9fingers Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2021 at 6:40pm
LOLLOLLOL this fookin thread 
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