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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Zinedine Kilbane 110 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 May 2017 at 9:33pm
Selby just has no weakness. He will overtake Higgins and join Hendry/Ronnie/Davies as one of the very best.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRV Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 May 2017 at 1:15am
Well deaerved ,didnt panic when 10/4 down,Higgins was winning frames with 3/4 visits Selby knew he'd get back on track, higgins side of the draw was poor , likes of allen and trump need to stop thinking about top sixteen pay cheques and try win top tournaments
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Roberto Baggio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 May 2017 at 8:57am
Always good to get a glimpse of Selby's woman in the crowd. Irish girl
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Butch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 May 2017 at 9:25am
Originally posted by Roberto Baggio Roberto Baggio wrote:


Always good to get a glimpse of Selby's woman in the crowd. Irish girl


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Devrozex Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 May 2017 at 10:44am
Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

Selby looks like he is going to cruise it from here, he is an excellent snooker player alright and I think he will win a few more world titles, he doesn't set the pulse racing though.
 
You could possibly dispute that for this tournament at least. Selby had four of the ten 'Shot of the Tournament' nominations.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 May 2017 at 11:51am
Originally posted by Devrozex Devrozex wrote:

Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

Selby looks like he is going to cruise it from here, he is an excellent snooker player alright and I think he will win a few more world titles, he doesn't set the pulse racing though.
 
You could possibly dispute that for this tournament at least. Selby had four of the ten 'Shot of the Tournament' nominations.
I don't think that is the problem though, he could have had all ten and done a 147 in every round and I would still fell the same.
I have been putting far too much thought into why I, along with many others, can't warm to the best player currently playing the game and I think it finally struck me during his break of 131 in the penultimate frame. What fascinates me most about the game of snooker is the psychology of the game and how players have to overcome obstacles, both of their own making and their opponents, to win the major tournaments. In doing this their personality shines through; Reardon's jovial nature, the Nugget's calculated cunning,Ebdon's manic determination, Ronnie and Alex Higgins' unpredictability etc. Their emotions elicit an emotional response from those watching and how we view the game.
That 131 from Selby was immediately after Jan Verhaas had ruled against him in the previous frame, handing the initiative to John Higgins who won the frame. Mark showed almost no emotion in that break whatsoever, he methodically thought his way through every shot and made the last frame an exercise in futility. Given the circumstances, it must be one of the greatest breaks made in a Crucible final and yet I felt no emotion watching it. There was considerable skill, flair and craft in it, comparable to anything done by the people's champions down the years, but it felt clinical. He clearly has the perfect temperament for the game which kind of takes the fun out of it. He will never need a Steve Peters and I doubt he will get the yips either and because of all that I struggle to warm to his achievements, which probably says far more about me than it does about Mark Selby.
I suppose the ironic nickname doesn't help, when I look at Mark Selby I see a man who eats toast with a knife and fork, not a 'jester'! John Higgins gave him a far more appropriate nickname this evening, I guess if he was from Aberdeen then 'granite Mark' would sell more t-shirts!
For all that he is a worthy champion though, I think he will win 3-4 more and I will still be trying to find a way to like him then!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 May 2017 at 12:00pm
Originally posted by Roberto Baggio Roberto Baggio wrote:

Always good to get a glimpse of Selby's woman in the crowd. Irish girl
Her eyebrows are sensational, she must draw them on with crayon.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Drumcondra 69er Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 May 2017 at 2:38pm
Originally posted by TRV TRV wrote:

Well deaerved ,didnt panic when 10/4 down,Higgins was winning frames with 3/4 visits Selby knew he'd get back on track, higgins side of the draw was poor , likes of allen and trump need to stop thinking about top sixteen pay cheques and try win top tournaments


Higgins probably lumped on Selby when it was 10-4.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote deise316 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 May 2017 at 11:49pm
Just on varous points by PM, Devro & Roberto, there are a lot of posts here in recent years, and opinions of general sports fans that go along the lines of '' I used to watch the snooker religiously, never missed a frame if I could, can barely watch the final now'' . 

I'm in that category meself, haven't really watched it much since 2003 (found Doherty's ridiculous run to the final excellent, think he still holds the record for the most amount of frames played in a single championship, even though he lost the final), I did watch Murphy win in 04 but had no interest in Graeme Dott the following year and can probably trace the losing of interest in the game in general to that. So I've been thinking about why that is as well. 

And I'm starting to wonder is it just as simple as there wasn't much else on the TV back then. Pre 2000 or so, I think you could make a case for it. But viewer habits & attention spans, including me own, have changed. Instead of watching a particular game in the early rounds of the champions league, I often find meself looking at the channel on BT where they just show the goals from all 8 games as they happen.

With the snooker, unless you are watching Ronnie on top form, which is brilliant viewing, a lot of the games do descend into safety exchanges between evenly matched players. In that sense, watching one frame is much the same as the next one, so I'm inclined to leave off the earlier ones and re-tune in when the scores are level & the end of the game is approaching. And the conclusion I've come to is that it isn't the snooker, it's me that changed. I think it could be the same for other viewers. 

I would be one of those who likes the safety stuff (not in the Terry Griffiths or Ebdon sense where 8 minutes is taken looking at a shot before the player rolls the cue ball into the pack of reds, again) but more in the sense of how an outmatched player, like Doherty (not a good long potter) often was, went about getting into games he hadn't really any right to win, and trying & sometimes succeeding to do something silly like get 4 snookers with only the colours left on the table. Selby is very much of the same mindset, only mentally even stronger than even late 90's/early '00s Ken. 

They can all pot balls, to a greater or lesser degree, and while I admire O'Sullivan's brilliance on the table, I don't find him as fascinating as PM does, and I get the vague impression Ronnie is somewhat fascinated by himself to a degree too. He may have mental health issues, but he also has a petulant, attention seeking streak which I never really took to. Not unlike Mr Taylor in the darts to that degree (but nowhere near as obnoxious, to be fair to him, as PM said earlier, he does come across a a nice fella off the table, at least when not threatening to retire).

The other thing missing is a rivalry, Davis had Higgins, then Dennis Taylor & Joe Johnston appeared from nowhere and looked like they could be threats (they weren't able to sustain it), Hendry had White, but since then, even Ronnie or John Higgins rarely played the same player twice in the final, the overall standard has gone up, which meant all sorts of lads got to finals, and with respect to all, Barry Hawkins, Ali Carter & Stuart Bingham, excellent players all of them, never really got to the level of consistency that Davis & Hendry's challengers had. I think all those factors are reasons why snooker isn't as popular with the masses any more. 

Which is a bit of a shame, as we are really the ones missing out. I said at the start of this WC that I thought Selby could have a go at Hendry's 7 titles, and after the event, every snooker player & pundit is falling over themselves to say it now, they weren't saying it 2 weeks ago though, which makes me wonder about the standard of the punditry, because I thought it was obvious enough. 

As regards Selby being interesting or not, he too has a fairly fascinating back story, that he chooses not to elaborate on too much, his mother abandoned him when he was 8 years old, his Dad who got him into snooker, died when he was 16. I'm no psychologist, but the lack of emotion he expresses playing snooker might not be unconnected to those 2 very traumatic events, or how he dealt with them. To be fair to him, other than the nickname he didn't award himself, I don't think he is trying to play up to any image or trying to be anyone other than himself, he might be no barrel of laughs, but there is surely something to be admired about that too.






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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2017 at 1:55am
I would say that the point you make about Selby winning 6 or 7 wasn't mentioned by any pundits because of people not watching it as much, on the BBC anyway. They said it at the end alright, come next April it will be anybody's title again. Ronnie can stop him on his day, otherwise he will cruise to the next three or four.
For all the talk of the standard being higher I think we are coming to an 'in between' stage.
Higgins is back to second in the world without having the same focus, Ronnie seems to be playing for enjoyment, Trump isn't intelligent or tactical enough to challenge Selby, Robertson seems to be on the wane and can't see himself or Murphy winning another one. Hawkins and Bingham will get to the quarters and semis and no more leaving the Chinese lads as his only challengers. I am not sure Ding will ever win one, I was fully convinced he would have one by now and Liang might be the one to take the baton from Selby, if he learns to steady the adrenaline. It isn't unrealistic to think he could break Hendry's record. I don't think he is the sort of fella to have a rivalry either, I can't imagine him evoking that sort of passion in anyone. He doesn't even manage to be smug looking, something Hendry is still excelling at.
As for his back story, there is no doubting it is fascinating and has certainly played a part in developing the temperament that serves him so well and you are quite right that he is just being himself, it just doesn't endear him to audiences. He seems like the sort of fella you would want your sister to go out with, which is a doubly backhanded compliment as I don't have one.

As for Ronnie.............. I find the man compelling viewing, his whole story is definitely fascinating,as is his wonderfully flawed persona. He is certainly fascinated by himself, self-obsession is the bedrock of any good melted head, but it must be even more fascinating if you are on the top of your sport. On the verge of a breakdown one minute and knocking in a 147 in the next. 
How he has matured too! When he first came on the scene he was a mouthy gangster's son who had been dragged up in the snooker halls of the old East End and Essex, then one day somebody realised he was remarkably intelligent and it took one of the chips off his shoulder, but seems to choose to keep a few. I would gladly watch him talk about sandwiches or for an hour, I am even thinking of buying his(presumably) awful novel. Tongue firmly in cheek, he called himself the 'James Blunt of snooker' in an interview recently, I would saw 'Mozza' would be a more accurate analogy.
I suppose it says a lot about modern sportsmen that he is by far the most interesting one still competing, at the top level of any sport I have half an interest in anyway. Even the darts lads are boring as f**k these days!


Edited by pre Madonna - 03 May 2017 at 1:57am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Roberto Baggio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2017 at 8:50am
Originally posted by deise316 deise316 wrote:

And I'm starting to wonder is it just as simple as there wasn't much else on the TV back then. Pre 2000 or so, I think you could make a case for it. But viewer habits & attention spans, including me own, have changed. Instead of watching a particular game in the early rounds of the champions league, I often find meself looking at the channel on BT where they just show the goals from all 8 games as they happen.
 
A friend of mine hates watching a full football match, finds football  boring, yet would barely miss match of the day or champions league highlights on ITV
 
 
Originally posted by deise316 deise316 wrote:


The other thing missing is a rivalry, Davis had Higgins, then Dennis Taylor & Joe Johnston appeared from nowhere and looked like they could be threats (they weren't able to sustain it), Hendry had White, but since then, even Ronnie or John Higgins rarely played the same player twice in the final, the overall standard has gone up, which meant all sorts of lads got to finals, and with respect to all, Barry Hawkins, Ali Carter & Stuart Bingham, excellent players all of them, never really got to the level of consistency that Davis & Hendry's challengers had. I think all those factors are reasons why snooker isn't as popular with the masses any more. 
 
Barely an ounce of personality between them. How could you watch a match involving any of them and care which one wins it. At least with the likes of Ebdon or Dott you would watch it and cheer against them, as they were blatantly unlikeable characters (IMO anyway).
White was loveable, Doherty we would always support for obvious reasons etc.
Too many bland characterless players.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Zinedine Kilbane 110 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2017 at 8:56am
Originally posted by deise316 deise316 wrote:


I said at the start of this WC that I thought Selby could have a go at Hendry's 7 titles, and after the event, every snooker player & pundit is falling over themselves to say it now, they weren't saying it 2 weeks ago though, which makes me wonder about the standard of the punditry, because I thought it was obvious enough. 



To be fair, once he won his 2nd one in 3 years (Only a small number of players have won it twice) a lot of people (pundits included) were saying he could dominate for years to come and have a go at Hendry record. 

The pundits for obvious reasons cant start this chat at the start of a world tournament!!

I can see him win a few more and get on the same level as Ronnie and Davies but it would take some dominance over the next 5/6 years to overtake Hendrys title as the best ever. 



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2017 at 11:27am
Originally posted by Roberto Baggio Roberto Baggio wrote:

Originally posted by deise316 deise316 wrote:

And I'm starting to wonder is it just as simple as there wasn't much else on the TV back then. Pre 2000 or so, I think you could make a case for it. But viewer habits & attention spans, including me own, have changed. Instead of watching a particular game in the early rounds of the champions league, I often find meself looking at the channel on BT where they just show the goals from all 8 games as they happen.
 
A friend of mine hates watching a full football match, finds football  boring, yet would barely miss match of the day or champions league highlights on ITV
 
 
Originally posted by deise316 deise316 wrote:


The other thing missing is a rivalry, Davis had Higgins, then Dennis Taylor & Joe Johnston appeared from nowhere and looked like they could be threats (they weren't able to sustain it), Hendry had White, but since then, even Ronnie or John Higgins rarely played the same player twice in the final, the overall standard has gone up, which meant all sorts of lads got to finals, and with respect to all, Barry Hawkins, Ali Carter & Stuart Bingham, excellent players all of them, never really got to the level of consistency that Davis & Hendry's challengers had. I think all those factors are reasons why snooker isn't as popular with the masses any more. 
 
Barely an ounce of personality between them. How could you watch a match involving any of them and care which one wins it. At least with the likes of Ebdon or Dott you would watch it and cheer against them, as they were blatantly unlikeable characters (IMO anyway).
White was loveable, Doherty we would always support for obvious reasons etc.
Too many bland characterless players.
 
Could never understand this at all.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Roberto Baggio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2017 at 11:29am
I've gone OTT.
He was likeable, probably as most people wanted him to eventually win one instead of bottling the final every year.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GoneToShowgies Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 May 2017 at 4:01pm
Originally posted by Drumcondra 69er Drumcondra 69er wrote:

Originally posted by TRV TRV wrote:

Well deaerved ,didnt panic when 10/4 down,Higgins was winning frames with 3/4 visits Selby knew he'd get back on track, higgins side of the draw was poor , likes of allen and trump need to stop thinking about top sixteen pay cheques and try win top tournaments


Higgins probably lumped on Selby when it was 10-4.
 
Ouch Ouch LOL LOL
 
 
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