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Up to Kenny to find a way of playing both. I think Coleman has to play against Slovakia.
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Originally posted by Green Cockade Green Cockade wrote:

Up to Kenny to find a way of playing both. I think Coleman has to play against Slovakia.
I’d agree with that. I haven’t seen Séamus looking this fit and he has definitely recovered some pace and has better physicality when in possession and while tackling which wasn’t there a year ago 
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Originally posted by Green Cockade Green Cockade wrote:

Up to Kenny to find a way of playing both. I think Coleman has to play against Slovakia.

Disagree with your first sentence
If Kenny’s gonna play 4-3-3 then there’s no place for both, he’ll choose the best right back of the two 
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Originally posted by Green Cockade Green Cockade wrote:

Up to Kenny to find a way of playing both. I think Coleman has to play against Slovakia.

Unfortunately our 2 best players play in the same position but I don’t think either can play in another position if we play 4-3-3.

Neither would be comfortable at LB or midfield. 

For me he has to play one of them. Considering he started Doherty the last 2 games I think the manager has decided to go with him for now.

Overall competition is good. We have good competition for the center back and forward positions.

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We should play Doherty LB.
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Originally posted by BrendanD88 BrendanD88 wrote:

We should play Doherty LB.


No, he is far less effective there.
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Stevens hasn't been particularly effective there either, so it's not a completely outlandish suggestion. I'd prefer to try him higher up the field on the right, but if that's not going to happen then left-back should also be considered.
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Originally posted by The O'Shea The O'Shea wrote:

Stevens hasn't been particularly effective there either, so it's not a completely outlandish suggestion. I'd prefer to try him higher up the field on the right, but if that's not going to happen then left-back should also be considered.
Nobody had done brilliantly for Ireland playing higher on the right over the last while so I’d agree we have to try Doherty there with his attacking potential there and goal threat a big plus and he’d be a help there defensively also I’d say. Coleman has to have played himself back in the team recently 


Edited by Liam Green - 27 Sep 2020 at 2:01pm
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Originally posted by Liam Green Liam Green wrote:

Originally posted by The O'Shea The O'Shea wrote:

Stevens hasn't been particularly effective there either, so it's not a completely outlandish suggestion. I'd prefer to try him higher up the field on the right, but if that's not going to happen then left-back should also be considered.
Nobody had done brilliantly for Ireland playing higher on the right over the last while so I’d agree we have to try Doherty there with his attacking potential there and goal threat a big plus and he’d be a help there defensively also I’d say. Coleman has to have played himself back in the team recently 

Should it need to be pointed out that Doherty’s strength is running into the box from deep? Playing as a wide forward in Kenny’s system will not utilize this skill. He’s not a pacey player. He won’t skin any full backs one on one but he’s a strong late runner.

Wide forwards look like Callum Robinson. They have a certain body shape that allows for acceleration. Doherty has a bulkier body shape than most footballers and pretty much every wide forward you could think of.

He’s a full back or wing back.
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Originally posted by Dots1982 Dots1982 wrote:

Originally posted by Liam Green Liam Green wrote:

Originally posted by The O'Shea The O'Shea wrote:

Stevens hasn't been particularly effective there either, so it's not a completely outlandish suggestion. I'd prefer to try him higher up the field on the right, but if that's not going to happen then left-back should also be considered.
Nobody had done brilliantly for Ireland playing higher on the right over the last while so I’d agree we have to try Doherty there with his attacking potential there and goal threat a big plus and he’d be a help there defensively also I’d say. Coleman has to have played himself back in the team recently 

Should it need to be pointed out that Doherty’s strength is running into the box from deep? Playing as a wide forward in Kenny’s system will not utilize this skill. He’s not a pacey player. He won’t skin any full backs one on one but he’s a strong late runner.

Wide forwards look like Callum Robinson. They have a certain body shape that allows for acceleration. Doherty has a bulkier body shape than most footballers and pretty much every wide forward you could think of.

He’s a full back or wing back.

It's not really though, he actually starts most of his runs from very high up the pitch. Doherty's shtick is to basically ignore the play while his team are moving out from the back while he jogs forward and positions himself right at the touchline in a "winger" position; when his team are in the opposition half he then looks to receive a switch of play, and then plays a quick one-two to get himself in behind the defence. There's no particular reason he couldn't do that playing on the right of an attacking three, all he needs is Coleman/one of the midfielders to be there when he takes possession to play his one-two with.
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Originally posted by The O'Shea The O'Shea wrote:

Originally posted by Dots1982 Dots1982 wrote:

Originally posted by Liam Green Liam Green wrote:

Originally posted by The O'Shea The O'Shea wrote:

Stevens hasn't been particularly effective there either, so it's not a completely outlandish suggestion. I'd prefer to try him higher up the field on the right, but if that's not going to happen then left-back should also be considered.
Nobody had done brilliantly for Ireland playing higher on the right over the last while so I’d agree we have to try Doherty there with his attacking potential there and goal threat a big plus and he’d be a help there defensively also I’d say. Coleman has to have played himself back in the team recently 

Should it need to be pointed out that Doherty’s strength is running into the box from deep? Playing as a wide forward in Kenny’s system will not utilize this skill. He’s not a pacey player. He won’t skin any full backs one on one but he’s a strong late runner.

Wide forwards look like Callum Robinson. They have a certain body shape that allows for acceleration. Doherty has a bulkier body shape than most footballers and pretty much every wide forward you could think of.

He’s a full back or wing back.

It's not really though, he actually starts most of his runs from very high up the pitch. Doherty's shtick is to basically ignore the play while his team are moving out from the back while he jogs forward and positions himself right at the touchline in a "winger" position; when his team are in the opposition half he then looks to receive a switch of play, and then plays a quick one-two to get himself in behind the defence. There's no particular reason he couldn't do that playing on the right of an attacking three, all he needs is Coleman/one of the midfielders to be there when he takes possession to play his one-two with.

So he needs coleman or one of the midfielders to be ahead of him but close to him to bounce a 1-2 off while Doherty plays as a wide forward. So we need coleman to play effectively the opposite to what he does now? To be the standing man in a give and go. Hmmmm.
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No, he needs someone in his vicinity to essentially act as a "rebound wall" for him; where did I say that player need be ahead of him? In fact, if you watch Doherty, the most common pass he plays is a square one/slightly back before setting off and looking for the return. It's not a complicated idea whatsoever.
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Originally posted by The O'Shea The O'Shea wrote:

No, he needs someone in his vicinity to essentially act as a "rebound wall" for him; where did I say that player need be ahead of him? In fact, if you watch Doherty, the most common pass he plays is a square one/slightly back before setting off and looking for the return. It's not a complicated idea whatsoever.

And you think coleman is good playing those kind of balls? You’ve seen him doing it? And that using coleman for that purpose is an effective use of his attacking skill? 
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Originally posted by Dots1982 Dots1982 wrote:

Originally posted by The O'Shea The O'Shea wrote:

No, he needs someone in his vicinity to essentially act as a "rebound wall" for him; where did I say that player need be ahead of him? In fact, if you watch Doherty, the most common pass he plays is a square one/slightly back before setting off and looking for the return. It's not a complicated idea whatsoever.

And you think coleman is good playing those kind of balls? You’ve seen him doing it? And that using coleman for that purpose is an effective use of his attacking skill? 

What kind of passes? A one-two? Yes, I believe that is something Coleman could manage.
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Originally posted by The O'Shea The O'Shea wrote:

Originally posted by Dots1982 Dots1982 wrote:

Originally posted by The O'Shea The O'Shea wrote:

No, he needs someone in his vicinity to essentially act as a "rebound wall" for him; where did I say that player need be ahead of him? In fact, if you watch Doherty, the most common pass he plays is a square one/slightly back before setting off and looking for the return. It's not a complicated idea whatsoever.

And you think coleman is good playing those kind of balls? You’ve seen him doing it? And that using coleman for that purpose is an effective use of his attacking skill? 

What kind of passes? A one-two? Yes, I believe that is something Coleman could manage.

A one-two are passes directly to each other’s feet to my understanding. The two in this one-two is a percentage ball into space beyond the defender. A pass I wouldn’t have seen coleman play much at all in his career.

Meanwhile that will be all doherty can do as right sided forward because he’s got little blinding acceleration one on one and no real tricks or stepovers  and his crossing and shooting from range are unknown quantities even if he manages to find space so our right hand side becomes a constant ball into space over the last defender if we want to use doherty. 

 I think you need a right sided forward with more variety.
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The variety is that you have either Doherty's clever link play and runs off the touchline; or Coleman's more traditional overlapping runs down the right. That is about as good a result as Ireland could have hoped for I'd have thought, it's certainly not to be scoffed at.
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Originally posted by The O'Shea The O'Shea wrote:

The variety is that you have either Doherty's clever link play and runs off the touchline; or Coleman's more traditional overlapping runs down the right. That is about as good a result as Ireland could have hoped for I'd have thought, it's certainly not to be scoffed at.

Coleman is doing a reduced bit in that system than we would normally get from him and I personally think picking a player out of position for one attacking purpose where he has very little variety is not a plan I’d like to see ireland go with. I’d rather different options who have more variety. Personal opinion.
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Coleman in a back 4 every day.
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