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Artie Ziff
Ray Houghton
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Posted: 25 Jul 2022 at 4:40pm |
The South China news come on B6.
But let's be straight here the western media is completely propagandising the war as well.
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It would damage this forums' reputation
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More Anne
Ronnie Whelan
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Posted: 25 Jul 2022 at 4:44pm |
B6 6HE wrote:
counterlock wrote:
More Anne wrote:
B6 6HE wrote:
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Are you going to address the questions and points that were put to you? You're not, are you?
What is it about the Russian Nazis that appeals to you so much?
The Russianness? Or the Nazism? |
Bump
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Not answering a ridiculous infantile question.
I made the point that there is a disgusting Nazi element in Ukraine and was asked that bizarre question.
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There is a disgusting Nazi element in every country, including Ireland. Ukraine has no special problem with Nazism that any other country doesn't have.
Russia, on other hand, very much does. It is a Nazi state run by a Nazi regime. This is the state you have decided to support.
Which leaves extremely disturbing questions about your attitude to Nazism.
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B6 6HE
Liam Brady
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Posted: 25 Jul 2022 at 5:08pm |
Artie Ziff wrote:
The South China news come on B6.
But let's be straight here the western media is completely propagandising the war as well. |
I try to watch all of the media outlets. They all have their own slant obviously.
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eireland
Ray Houghton
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Posted: 26 Jul 2022 at 10:03am |
Russian sending huge reinforcements to Kherson. Hard to see the Ukrainians taking it anytime soon. This will definitely ease pressure on other frontlines however.
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More Anne
Ronnie Whelan
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Posted: 26 Jul 2022 at 1:47pm |
Artie Ziff wrote:
The South China news come on B6.
But let's be straight here the western media is completely propagandising the war as well. |
Please explain exactly what you mean by that.
Explain exactly who you are referring to, exactly what the propaganda is, why it is supposedly propaganda, what you think is the truth - what truth an apparent genius like you has apparently uncovered that western media are apparently not telling an apparent dimwit like me.
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planning
Ray Houghton
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Posted: 26 Jul 2022 at 1:54pm |
More Anne wrote:
It is a catastrophic geo-political f**k up by Putin. But much more importantly, it's a much, much bigger catastrophe for Ukrainians, who are entirely innocent in all this.
This has always been the lens through which this should be and should have been viewed.
It's not enough and never has been enough for the west to provide merely enough armed support to "bog Russia down".
Russia has to be defeated - otherwise innocent Ukrainians will continue to die and be forcibly deported to death camps in Russia, Ukraine will be destroyed, and free societies in the west will end, devoured from within by kleptocratic Russian fifth columnists and their useful idiots.
The only way to defeat Russia is for the west to fight them directly, defeat them and make them to come to terms which gives the west ultimate control over what happens in Russia. This is an appalling prospect, but all prospects here appalling, and this one is the one which holds the best chance of mitigating the appalling long term term prospects for humanity which Russia existing in its current form unleashes. |
You can't do that. This is one man's war. He set it in motion, he determines how long it is, and he sets the rules of engagement. And he laughs at the incapability of the West to do anything about it, apart from send the Ukrainians a few weapons.
He may not have got what he ideally wanted. But he has taken 20% of the country, a landbridge to Crimea, and can use food, gas and oil as a weapon of war. Zelensky says it's not over until the Russians are gone but that's not going to happen. War always redraws maps. We fought the Brits for 900 years, and the result was losing the north east corner of the island, for the sake of peace. So it's just a question of how many more lives is he prepared to sacrifice before he does a peace deal, so he can limit the damage, to the region under Russian occupation at the time.
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More Anne
Ronnie Whelan
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Posted: 26 Jul 2022 at 2:15pm |
planning wrote:
More Anne wrote:
It is a catastrophic geo-political f**k up by Putin. But much more importantly, it's a much, much bigger catastrophe for Ukrainians, who are entirely innocent in all this.
This has always been the lens through which this should be and should have been viewed.
It's not enough and never has been enough for the west to provide merely enough armed support to "bog Russia down".
Russia has to be defeated - otherwise innocent Ukrainians will continue to die and be forcibly deported to death camps in Russia, Ukraine will be destroyed, and free societies in the west will end, devoured from within by kleptocratic Russian fifth columnists and their useful idiots.
The only way to defeat Russia is for the west to fight them directly, defeat them and make them to come to terms which gives the west ultimate control over what happens in Russia. This is an appalling prospect, but all prospects here appalling, and this one is the one which holds the best chance of mitigating the appalling long term term prospects for humanity which Russia existing in its current form unleashes. |
You can't do that. This is one man's war. He set it in motion, he determines how long it is, and he sets the rules of engagement. And he laughs at the incapability of the West to do anything about it, apart from send the Ukrainians a few weapons.
He may not have got what he ideally wanted. But he has taken 20% of the country, a landbridge to Crimea, and can use food, gas and oil as a weapon of war. Zelensky says it's not over until the Russians are gone but that's not going to happen. War always redraws maps. We fought the Brits for 900 years, and the result was losing the north east corner of the island, for the sake of peace. So it's just a question of how many more lives is he prepared to sacrifice before he does a peace deal, so he can limit the damage, to the region under Russian occupation at the time. |
The reality is Russia must be defeated and their allies in the west must be defeated. If our leaders don't fully understand that - and all the signs are that they don't - it's the end of the west and of our free societies. The long term consequences will be catastrophic. The stakes here are as high as when Hitler was invading the rest of Europe.
But when Hitler was invading Europe, there wasn't a threat of his allies winning power in free societies. That threat is now ever present in the west. Italy will likely fall in September and in the US Russia's allies in the shape of the Republican party are likely to return to power, and this time hold it for good.
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colemanY2K
Roy Keane
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Posted: 26 Jul 2022 at 5:55pm |
A fascinating paper from Yale researching the impacts of sanctions on russia.
tldr russias economy has gone down the pan!
Business Retreats and Sanctions Are Crippling the Russian EconomyAbstract As the Russian invasion of Ukraine enters into its fifth month, a common narrative has emerged that the unity of the world in standing up to Russia has somehow devolved into a “war of economic attrition which is taking its toll on the west”, given the supposed “resilience” and even “prosperity” of the Russian economy. This is simply untrue – and a reflection of widely held but factually incorrect misunderstandings over how the Russian economy is actually holding up amidst the exodus of over 1,000 global companies and international sanctions.
That these misunderstandings persist is not surprising. Since the invasion, the Kremlin’s economic releases have become increasingly cherry-picked, selectively tossing out unfavorable metrics while releasing only those that are more favorable. These Putin-selected statistics are then carelessly trumpeted across media and used by reams of well-meaning but careless experts in building out forecasts which are excessively, unrealistically favorable to the Kremlin.
Our team of experts, using private Russian language and unconventional data sources including high frequency consumer data, cross-channel checks, releases from Russia’s international trade partners, and data mining of complex shipping data, have released one of the first comprehensive economic analyses measuring Russian current economic activity five months into the invasion, and assessing Russia’s economic outlook.
From our analysis, it becomes clear: business retreats and sanctions are catastrophically crippling the Russian economy. We tackle a wide range of common misperceptions – and shed light on what is actually going on inside Russia, including:
- Russia’s strategic positioning as a commodities exporter has irrevocably deteriorated, as it now deals from a position of weakness with the loss of its erstwhile main markets, and faces steep challenges executing a “pivot to Asia” with non-fungible exports such as piped gas
- Despite some lingering leakiness, Russian imports have largely collapsed, and the country faces stark challenges securing crucial inputs, parts, and technology from hesitant trade partners, leading to widespread supply shortages within its domestic economy
- Despite Putin’s delusions of self-sufficiency and import substitution, Russian domestic production has come to a complete standstill with no capacity to replace lost businesses, products and talent; the hollowing out of Russia’s domestic innovation and production base has led to soaring prices and consumer angst
- As a result of the business retreat, Russia has lost companies representing ~40% of its GDP, reversing nearly all of three decades’ worth of foreign investment and buttressing unprecedented simultaneous capital and population flight in a mass exodus of Russia’s economic base
- Putin is resorting to patently unsustainable, dramatic fiscal and monetary intervention to smooth over these structural economic weaknesses, which has already sent his government budget into deficit for the first time in years and drained his foreign reserves even with high energy prices – and Kremlin finances are in much, much more dire straits than conventionally understood
- Russian domestic financial markets, as an indicator of both present conditions and future outlook, are the worst performing markets in the entire world this year despite strict capital controls, and have priced in sustained, persistent weakness within the economy with liquidity and credit contracting – in addition to Russia being substantively cut off from international financial markets, limiting its ability to tap into pools of capital needed for the revitalization of its crippled economy
Looking ahead, there is no path out of economic oblivion for Russia as long as the allied countries remain unified in maintaining and increasing sanctions pressure against Russia, and The Kyiv School of Economics and McFaul-Yermak Working Group have led the way in proposing additional sanctions measures.
Defeatist headlines arguing that Russia’s economy has bounced back are simply not factual - the facts are that, by any metric and on any level, the Russian economy is reeling, and now is not the time to step on the brakes. http://deliverypdf.ssrn.com/delivery.php?ID=428101121103108016081066091064089111015069058086095042085123117113111083124095113108004117037031126012054120125120122113078065102029022089006112120097095116089109121049050055084111109017003106083072012108122115122109121081085086072083094069119113083101&EXT=pdf&INDEX=TRUE
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"One of the dominant facts in English life during the past three quarters of a century has been the decay of ability in the ruling class." Orwell, 1942.
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B6 6HE
Liam Brady
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Posted: 26 Jul 2022 at 11:31pm |
colemanY2K wrote:
A fascinating paper from Yale researching the impacts of sanctions on russia.
tldr russias economy has gone down the pan!
Business Retreats and Sanctions Are Crippling the Russian EconomyAbstract As the Russian invasion of Ukraine enters into its fifth month, a common narrative has emerged that the unity of the world in standing up to Russia has somehow devolved into a “war of economic attrition which is taking its toll on the west”, given the supposed “resilience” and even “prosperity” of the Russian economy. This is simply untrue – and a reflection of widely held but factually incorrect misunderstandings over how the Russian economy is actually holding up amidst the exodus of over 1,000 global companies and international sanctions.
That these misunderstandings persist is not surprising. Since the invasion, the Kremlin’s economic releases have become increasingly cherry-picked, selectively tossing out unfavorable metrics while releasing only those that are more favorable. These Putin-selected statistics are then carelessly trumpeted across media and used by reams of well-meaning but careless experts in building out forecasts which are excessively, unrealistically favorable to the Kremlin.
Our team of experts, using private Russian language and unconventional data sources including high frequency consumer data, cross-channel checks, releases from Russia’s international trade partners, and data mining of complex shipping data, have released one of the first comprehensive economic analyses measuring Russian current economic activity five months into the invasion, and assessing Russia’s economic outlook.
From our analysis, it becomes clear: business retreats and sanctions are catastrophically crippling the Russian economy. We tackle a wide range of common misperceptions – and shed light on what is actually going on inside Russia, including:
- Russia’s strategic positioning as a commodities exporter has irrevocably deteriorated, as it now deals from a position of weakness with the loss of its erstwhile main markets, and faces steep challenges executing a “pivot to Asia” with non-fungible exports such as piped gas
- Despite some lingering leakiness, Russian imports have largely collapsed, and the country faces stark challenges securing crucial inputs, parts, and technology from hesitant trade partners, leading to widespread supply shortages within its domestic economy
- Despite Putin’s delusions of self-sufficiency and import substitution, Russian domestic production has come to a complete standstill with no capacity to replace lost businesses, products and talent; the hollowing out of Russia’s domestic innovation and production base has led to soaring prices and consumer angst
- As a result of the business retreat, Russia has lost companies representing ~40% of its GDP, reversing nearly all of three decades’ worth of foreign investment and buttressing unprecedented simultaneous capital and population flight in a mass exodus of Russia’s economic base
- Putin is resorting to patently unsustainable, dramatic fiscal and monetary intervention to smooth over these structural economic weaknesses, which has already sent his government budget into deficit for the first time in years and drained his foreign reserves even with high energy prices – and Kremlin finances are in much, much more dire straits than conventionally understood
- Russian domestic financial markets, as an indicator of both present conditions and future outlook, are the worst performing markets in the entire world this year despite strict capital controls, and have priced in sustained, persistent weakness within the economy with liquidity and credit contracting – in addition to Russia being substantively cut off from international financial markets, limiting its ability to tap into pools of capital needed for the revitalization of its crippled economy
Looking ahead, there is no path out of economic oblivion for Russia as long as the allied countries remain unified in maintaining and increasing sanctions pressure against Russia, and The Kyiv School of Economics and McFaul-Yermak Working Group have led the way in proposing additional sanctions measures.
Defeatist headlines arguing that Russia’s economy has bounced back are simply not factual - the facts are that, by any metric and on any level, the Russian economy is reeling, and now is not the time to step on the brakes. http://deliverypdf.ssrn.com/delivery.php?ID=428101121103108016081066091064089111015069058086095042085123117113111083124095113108004117037031126012054120125120122113078065102029022089006112120097095116089109121049050055084111109017003106083072012108122115122109121081085086072083094069119113083101&EXT=pdf&INDEX=TRUE
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https://foreignpolicy.com/2022/07/13/europe-eu-energy-crisis-war-russia-ukraine-gas-oil-coal-nuclear-germany/
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Sham157
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Posted: 27 Jul 2022 at 12:13am |
B6 6HE wrote:
Sham157 wrote:
B6 6HE wrote:
TRV wrote:
Imagine running brit intelligence reports on an Irish football forum, not long ago these cockroaches were running death squads in this country |
Exactly. It's really pathetic.
The same intelligence that compiled reports on Bloody Sunday and numerous other atrocities. | Welcome back. There were a few questions put to you a few pages back that you ran away from and disappeared for a while over. You might trot back and respond
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https://scroll.in/article/1026800/as-the-war-in-ukraine-drags-on-putin-is-counting-on-the-wests-short-attention-span |
So you’re not going to answer?
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TRV
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Posted: 27 Jul 2022 at 2:11am |
So what we have here on this forum is if you question an encirclement of a country by an aggressive military alliance you must personally answer questions about that country's response. but if you post up anything supporting the aggression belt away, you can give out serial numbers of what missiles been used and cheerleading the next batch , usual suspects on here with their crackpot scenarios
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colemanY2K
Roy Keane
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Posted: 27 Jul 2022 at 8:39am |
B6 6HE wrote:
colemanY2K wrote:
A fascinating paper from Yale researching the impacts of sanctions on russia.
tldr russias economy has gone down the pan!
Business Retreats and Sanctions Are Crippling the Russian EconomyAbstract As the Russian invasion of Ukraine enters into its fifth month, a common narrative has emerged that the unity of the world in standing up to Russia has somehow devolved into a “war of economic attrition which is taking its toll on the west”, given the supposed “resilience” and even “prosperity” of the Russian economy. This is simply untrue – and a reflection of widely held but factually incorrect misunderstandings over how the Russian economy is actually holding up amidst the exodus of over 1,000 global companies and international sanctions.
That these misunderstandings persist is not surprising. Since the invasion, the Kremlin’s economic releases have become increasingly cherry-picked, selectively tossing out unfavorable metrics while releasing only those that are more favorable. These Putin-selected statistics are then carelessly trumpeted across media and used by reams of well-meaning but careless experts in building out forecasts which are excessively, unrealistically favorable to the Kremlin.
Our team of experts, using private Russian language and unconventional data sources including high frequency consumer data, cross-channel checks, releases from Russia’s international trade partners, and data mining of complex shipping data, have released one of the first comprehensive economic analyses measuring Russian current economic activity five months into the invasion, and assessing Russia’s economic outlook.
From our analysis, it becomes clear: business retreats and sanctions are catastrophically crippling the Russian economy. We tackle a wide range of common misperceptions – and shed light on what is actually going on inside Russia, including:
- Russia’s strategic positioning as a commodities exporter has irrevocably deteriorated, as it now deals from a position of weakness with the loss of its erstwhile main markets, and faces steep challenges executing a “pivot to Asia” with non-fungible exports such as piped gas
- Despite some lingering leakiness, Russian imports have largely collapsed, and the country faces stark challenges securing crucial inputs, parts, and technology from hesitant trade partners, leading to widespread supply shortages within its domestic economy
- Despite Putin’s delusions of self-sufficiency and import substitution, Russian domestic production has come to a complete standstill with no capacity to replace lost businesses, products and talent; the hollowing out of Russia’s domestic innovation and production base has led to soaring prices and consumer angst
- As a result of the business retreat, Russia has lost companies representing ~40% of its GDP, reversing nearly all of three decades’ worth of foreign investment and buttressing unprecedented simultaneous capital and population flight in a mass exodus of Russia’s economic base
- Putin is resorting to patently unsustainable, dramatic fiscal and monetary intervention to smooth over these structural economic weaknesses, which has already sent his government budget into deficit for the first time in years and drained his foreign reserves even with high energy prices – and Kremlin finances are in much, much more dire straits than conventionally understood
- Russian domestic financial markets, as an indicator of both present conditions and future outlook, are the worst performing markets in the entire world this year despite strict capital controls, and have priced in sustained, persistent weakness within the economy with liquidity and credit contracting – in addition to Russia being substantively cut off from international financial markets, limiting its ability to tap into pools of capital needed for the revitalization of its crippled economy
Looking ahead, there is no path out of economic oblivion for Russia as long as the allied countries remain unified in maintaining and increasing sanctions pressure against Russia, and The Kyiv School of Economics and McFaul-Yermak Working Group have led the way in proposing additional sanctions measures.
Defeatist headlines arguing that Russia’s economy has bounced back are simply not factual - the facts are that, by any metric and on any level, the Russian economy is reeling, and now is not the time to step on the brakes. http://deliverypdf.ssrn.com/delivery.php?ID=428101121103108016081066091064089111015069058086095042085123117113111083124095113108004117037031126012054120125120122113078065102029022089006112120097095116089109121049050055084111109017003106083072012108122115122109121081085086072083094069119113083101&EXT=pdf&INDEX=TRUE
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https://foreignpolicy.com/2022/07/13/europe-eu-energy-crisis-war-russia-ukraine-gas-oil-coal-nuclear-germany/
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not sure what your article has to do with the paper produced by Yale
...and its not quite the home run you seem to think it is. did you even read the article? the final paragraph pretty much sums up the situation we face in the short term:
"Ironically, the beginning recession and reduction in economic activity will likely lower energy prices and ease supply shortages in Europe".
to save you from actually reading the article the theme of it focuses on europe needing to diversify its sources of energy going forward and highlights the mistakes made in recent years. in the short term european nations will focus on LNG and coal among other sources of energy to replace russian gas.
Edited by colemanY2K - 27 Jul 2022 at 8:41am
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"One of the dominant facts in English life during the past three quarters of a century has been the decay of ability in the ruling class." Orwell, 1942.
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colemanY2K
Roy Keane
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Posted: 27 Jul 2022 at 9:02am |
TRV wrote:
So what we have here on this forum is if you question an encirclement of a country by an aggressive military alliance you must personally answer questions about that country's response. but if you post up anything supporting the aggression belt away, you can give out serial numbers of what missiles been used and cheerleading the next batch , usual suspects on here with their crackpot scenarios |
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"One of the dominant facts in English life during the past three quarters of a century has been the decay of ability in the ruling class." Orwell, 1942.
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More Anne
Ronnie Whelan
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Posted: 27 Jul 2022 at 9:12am |
TRV wrote:
So what we have here on this forum is if you question an encirclement of a country by an aggressive military alliance you must personally answer questions about that country's response. but if you post up anything supporting the aggression belt away, you can give out serial numbers of what missiles been used and cheerleading the next batch , usual suspects on here with their crackpot scenarios |
Despite you posting entirely through the medium of riddles, it's apparent you are a cheerleader for Putin's war. Tell us, where exactly do you get your information on this barbaric war which Putin and Russia and nobody else chose to unleash?
Give us, say, 10 "good" sources of information as you see them.
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BrendanD88
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Posted: 27 Jul 2022 at 10:58am |
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/disability-62226636
Found this a tough watch last night, had no idea how those with disabilities are treated in Ukraine!
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eireland
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Posted: 27 Jul 2022 at 2:27pm |
They definitely have issues but are trending in the right direction. There's talks of legalization for gay marriage and the army also have a brigade for "gay's and allies". They are far more progressive then say Russia in this regard.
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colemanY2K
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Posted: 27 Jul 2022 at 4:23pm |
that's rough.
they seriously need to get their house in order before joining the eu. the treatment of suspected thieves (a lot of the time blamed on the roma) is another issue which leaves a lot to be desired - usually involves taping the suspected offenders to telephone poles or other street architecture.
Edited by colemanY2K - 27 Jul 2022 at 4:24pm
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"One of the dominant facts in English life during the past three quarters of a century has been the decay of ability in the ruling class." Orwell, 1942.
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Jackal
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Posted: 27 Jul 2022 at 7:59pm |
colemanY2K wrote:
that's rough.
they seriously need to get their house in order before joining the eu. the treatment of suspected thieves (a lot of the time blamed on the roma) is another issue which leaves a lot to be desired - usually involves taping the suspected offenders to telephone poles or other street architecture.
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They won't be left in for years. It'll be the same with Albania. The EU might have lessons learnt from letting Bulgaria in without reform.
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