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Any manager deserves another campaign after getting us to the Euros. 

We don't really know how much the Denmark result has affected the team as we haven't played any competitive matches since. Our nations league campaign and how the team plays will give us a better indication when it ends in November.

If you're talking about turning points, a 5-1 hammering isn't indicative of how we've done. Suicidal tactics with the heaviest consequences in missing out on the world cup and remember it was one game. He took a bigger risk than was needed in trying to get back into the game and it completely backfired.

For me the biggest turning point was Austria at home. We couldn't have played them at a better time and they were missing players. Coleman's injury vs Wales was devastating but in terms of results it derailed our momentum to finish first and we only got 2/9 points at home. We may not have even had to beat Serbia at home to win the group had we beaten Austria. 

To sack a manager after a poor Euros in 2012 or a heavy defeat in a playoff is very harsh IMO given the level of expectancy for a country of our size. 2nd place/playoffs is generally a good achievement in qualifying groups for Ireland. Finishing ahead of teams like Austria and Wales who are similar to us in ability is a good return IMO.

I think he should go if we not only get relegated in the Nations League but are comprehensively beaten in the games. I do think the players are still with him but not happy at all about his public comments (Graham Burke for example) about them at times. 

I'm probably stretching it here but was encouraged by how we tried to play on the floor against a better than expected USA team in the second half in the June friendly. Would hold some hope that we may play more like that in the nations league.

Roll on September.


Edited by irishmufc - 21 Jul 2018 at 10:00am
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Originally posted by irishmufc irishmufc wrote:


For me the biggest turning point was Austria at home. 

?

Not sure anything can overshadow dropping points to Georgia.

Not only was it dropping points to a pot 5 team, it was the way the match was played out and the scenario in the group where Serbia were playing like donkeys also (so much to the point they sacked the coach after the qualifying) it's probably the best opportunity we're gonna get to top a group stage in a World Cup qualifier in a long time.

In terms of fan confidence it had to be the most devastating result since Cyprus, absolutely no one believed we'd get anything after that match, when I say no one I don't mean just TJ either. All you have to do is go back on this thread alone to see how devastating it was.

Serbia sacked their Manager for playing sh*te but qualifying,the FAI keep our manager for playing sh*te and not qualifying. Serbia ended up having a decent World Cup run as a result, FAI need to grow some balls.


Edited by coyne - 21 Jul 2018 at 10:11am
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The problem here is there is no sense of reality, we are as deluded as the English lads are about our capabilities.
Serbia are years ahead of us talent-wise. We had the fourth best squad in the group, arguably the fifth best group of players technically, and came second. No matter how much of that was down to good fortune, and we did get a lot of breaks along the way, it must be acknowledged as a good achievement.
However, the reason the Denmark result and performance was so disastrous was because of the management. Those bizarre tactical changes and substitutions caused irreparable damage amongst the support and I would expect that most of the players have lost their faith in him too.
In club football he would have had a chance to put it right soon after, in international football, especially with the new layout, I'm not sure he will ever really get the chance to do so. He took a massive risk that failed spectacularly, sometimes you have to accept the consequences for that.
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He took a massive risk and it backfired spectacularly but, we need a manager who is willing to take a risk. Would have been very easy for him to shore things up at the back at 2-1 Or 3-1 down, or even when we were 1-0 up, and end with a respectable scoreline.

Denmark were outstanding that night, everything they hit went in. They were very good at the World Cup. Left unbeaten after credible draws against the eventual finalists.

A good manager will learn from that result, but put it behind them very quickly and I think MON will do that.
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Originally posted by Lenny82 Lenny82 wrote:

He took a massive risk and it backfired spectacularly but, we need a manager who is willing to take a risk. Would have been very easy for him to shore things up at the back at 2-1 Or 3-1 down, or even when we were 1-0 up, and end with a respectable scoreline.

Denmark were outstanding that night, everything they hit went in. They were very good at the World Cup. Left unbeaten after credible draws against the eventual finalists.

A good manager will learn from that result, but put it behind them very quickly and I think MON will do that.
Reading that, you’d swear it was the first blot on his record. He never learned. He’ll prove you wrong this autumn anyway
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Originally posted by Lenny82 Lenny82 wrote:

He took a massive risk and it backfired spectacularly but, we need a manager who is willing to take a risk. Would have been very easy for him to shore things up at the back at 2-1 Or 3-1 down, or even when we were 1-0 up, and end with a respectable scoreline.

Denmark were outstanding that night, everything they hit went in. They were very good at the World Cup. Left unbeaten after credible draws against the eventual finalists.

A good manager will learn from that result, but put it behind them very quickly and I think MON will do that.


I agree, he took a gamble and it back fired badly.

The bigger issue is the performances have been declining since the Austria away win, there is no game plan and players are all over the place.

While O'Neill is set to stay, I'd like him to make a change to his backroom staff.
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Originally posted by coyne coyne wrote:

Originally posted by irishmufc irishmufc wrote:


For me the biggest turning point was Austria at home. 

?

Not sure anything can overshadow dropping points to Georgia.

Not only was it dropping points to a pot 5 team, it was the way the match was played out and the scenario in the group where Serbia were playing like donkeys also (so much to the point they sacked the coach after the qualifying) it's probably the best opportunity we're gonna get to top a group stage in a World Cup qualifier in a long time.

In terms of fan confidence it had to be the most devastating result since Cyprus, absolutely no one believed we'd get anything after that match, when I say no one I don't mean just TJ either. All you have to do is go back on this thread alone to see how devastating it was.

Serbia sacked their Manager for playing sh*te but qualifying,the FAI keep our manager for playing sh*te and not qualifying. Serbia ended up having a decent World Cup run as a result, FAI need to grow some balls.


This totally sums it up and is something I've thought a lot about the last few months. A really good professionally run association knows the time to act.It doesn't get blinded by past achievements or earlier very good results or dazzled by a celebrity big name management team.I don't think we will ever get those kind of exacting standards from the FAI. It will always be run by chancers.
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Originally posted by coyne coyne wrote:

Originally posted by irishmufc irishmufc wrote:


For me the biggest turning point was Austria at home. 

?

Not sure anything can overshadow dropping points to Georgia.

Not only was it dropping points to a pot 5 team, it was the way the match was played out and the scenario in the group where Serbia were playing like donkeys also (so much to the point they sacked the coach after the qualifying) it's probably the best opportunity we're gonna get to top a group stage in a World Cup qualifier in a long time.

In terms of fan confidence it had to be the most devastating result since Cyprus, absolutely no one believed we'd get anything after that match, when I say no one I don't mean just TJ either. All you have to do is go back on this thread alone to see how devastating it was.

Serbia sacked their Manager for playing sh*te but qualifying,the FAI keep our manager for playing sh*te and not qualifying. Serbia ended up having a decent World Cup run as a result, FAI need to grow some balls.

That Georgia team should've beaten the pot 1 side away and anyone watching our previous games with Georgia knows that they deserved at least a draw in some of those games. That result in Georgia didn't surprise me and they were also unlucky at home to Serbia. They're a tough nut when they play the stronger teams. 

In terms of winning the group the momentum stopped after the Austria home game. The Welsh home overall was a good result given our injuries going into the game and we could've lost it with Bale's chance near the end. 


Edited by irishmufc - 21 Jul 2018 at 1:32pm
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Originally posted by TonyNotJack TonyNotJack wrote:

Originally posted by coyne coyne wrote:

Originally posted by irishmufc irishmufc wrote:


For me the biggest turning point was Austria at home. 

?

Not sure anything can overshadow dropping points to Georgia.

Not only was it dropping points to a pot 5 team, it was the way the match was played out and the scenario in the group where Serbia were playing like donkeys also (so much to the point they sacked the coach after the qualifying) it's probably the best opportunity we're gonna get to top a group stage in a World Cup qualifier in a long time.

In terms of fan confidence it had to be the most devastating result since Cyprus, absolutely no one believed we'd get anything after that match, when I say no one I don't mean just TJ either. All you have to do is go back on this thread alone to see how devastating it was.

Serbia sacked their Manager for playing sh*te but qualifying,the FAI keep our manager for playing sh*te and not qualifying. Serbia ended up having a decent World Cup run as a result, FAI need to grow some balls.


This totally sums it up and is something I've thought a lot about the last few months. A really good professionally run association knows the time to act.It doesn't get blinded by past achievements or earlier very good results or dazzled by a celebrity big name management team.I don't think we will ever get those kind of exacting standards from the FAI. It will always be run by chancers.

This is bollix. Their manager wasn't sacked for playing sh*te football, he was sacked because he fell out with the Serbian FA's President and refused to call up certain players. If you think their FA is far superior to ours, you are deluded.
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Originally posted by irishmufc irishmufc wrote:

Originally posted by coyne coyne wrote:

Originally posted by irishmufc irishmufc wrote:


For me the biggest turning point was Austria at home. 

?

Not sure anything can overshadow dropping points to Georgia.

Not only was it dropping points to a pot 5 team, it was the way the match was played out and the scenario in the group where Serbia were playing like donkeys also (so much to the point they sacked the coach after the qualifying) it's probably the best opportunity we're gonna get to top a group stage in a World Cup qualifier in a long time.

In terms of fan confidence it had to be the most devastating result since Cyprus, absolutely no one believed we'd get anything after that match, when I say no one I don't mean just TJ either. All you have to do is go back on this thread alone to see how devastating it was.

Serbia sacked their Manager for playing sh*te but qualifying,the FAI keep our manager for playing sh*te and not qualifying. Serbia ended up having a decent World Cup run as a result, FAI need to grow some balls.

That Georgia team should've beaten the pot 1 side away and anyone watching our previous games with Georgia knows that they deserved at least a draw in some of those games. That result in Georgia didn't surprise me and they were also unlucky at home to Serbia. They're a tough nut when they play the stronger teams. 

In terms of winning the group the momentum stopped after the Austria home game. The Welsh home overall was a good result given our injuries going into the game and we could've lost it with Bale's chance near the end. 

Georgia are a 6th seed for a reason. Let me know what other decent team went to Tbilisi and had 31% possession and completed anything like 150 passes.

We had 38% possession at home against them. Complete and utter sh*te.
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The possession stats vs Georgia were woeful. 

I know we don’t have great technical players, but even Trap’s team would have kept the ball better against them. 

Anyone have any idea how Stephen Kenny can play a technical European game with Dundalk despite the fact the his players came through the same cr*p underage set up as the rest of our players and are generally the lads who wouldn’t have been as good as the likes of Robbie Brady, Hendrick etc when playing under age. 

I seem to recall Kenny’s side going toe to toe with Zenit, Bate, Alkamaar, Legia and that Israeli shower with a group of “technically inferior” Irish players. 

If you put Ireland out against Zenit we’d have about 25% possession, and Kenny did this with a squad of players who have spent the majority of their career slogging it out in what is a effectively a semi-proffessional League. 

In saying this I’m not suggesting that Kenny would do a fantastic job with Ireland, but if our players are naturally technically inferior to Europeans, how did he do such a good job with such a limited crop? 


Edited by Maccatacca - 21 Jul 2018 at 2:23pm
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fortuitous results in some  games have masked piss poor performances in pretty much them all 

Wales away a prime example 

The players don’t believe in him and it shows 
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This is bollix. Their manager wasn't sacked for playing sh*te football, he was sacked because he fell out with the Serbian FA's President and refused to call up certain players. If you think their FA is far superior to ours, you are deluded.
[QUOTE=Lenny82]



None of us are experts I'm sure on the Serbian FA. All we know is they saw something wrong; a manager not picking what they thought were some of their best players and changed things. They had just fallen over the line in one of the least impressive European world cup qualifying groups there was,but they weren't satisfied with that or their style of play.They looked a much better team in the finals. The FAI are always reactive not proactive.They wait until the wheels completely fall off before they do anything.That's the way they've always operated.


Edited by TonyNotJack - 21 Jul 2018 at 3:59pm
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Originally posted by Newryrep Newryrep wrote:

fortuitous results in some  games have masked piss poor performances in pretty much them all 

Wales away a prime example 

The players don’t believe in him and it shows 
Hate to say this but have to agree with you NR .

I always try to back the manager but i  go very quite when the end is near . Same with Trap as i loved the guy made us very hard to beat but in the end you knew it was coming sooner rather  than later . Mon is in the same spot we have had super times with under him but i feel it's going to end very soon as after the nations thingy he will get the sack , i do hope i am wrong as i will always want us to do well under any manager .
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Will O'Neill keep his job if we are relegated in the nation's league.
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Originally posted by kevincronin2000 kevincronin2000 wrote:

Will O'Neill keep his job if we are relegated in the nation's league.

I don't think so Kev . Lets see how many ST we sell this season as this will push JD as money is king with him . Can't  see JD putting up with small crowds and a new man would give us some kind of hope if we were relegated maybe . 
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Originally posted by kevincronin2000 kevincronin2000 wrote:

Will O'Neill keep his job if we are relegated in the nation's league.

Yes. He is on €2m/year. The FAI are not going to fork out that to cover the remainder of his contract after this year are they? Add to that a further near €1m for the backroom team including Keane.

It's another crazy situation Delaney has got them into


Edited by Pipkin - 21 Jul 2018 at 4:12pm
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How many games did we play well in the last campaign? 

I'd say none.  The highlight was 45 mins int he 2nd half in Vienna.  The rest was pure dogsh*t.  We had unbelievable amounts of luck and couldn't take advantage of the weakest group we were ever drawn in for the WC qualifying.

If we were playing well and showing signs of progress you could justify keeping him on. The football has been worse than pub team standards with minnows running rings around us.  MON talks up Georgia as if they are Germany and we should be grateful for a draw because he cant figure out how to beat a 5th seed side.  Much gets talked of MON's tactics at home to Denmark and rightly so but his tactics are consistently poor and his approach in Copenhagen cost us. He parked the bus when it is vital to score an away goal.  That was a sh*t show.

He got some good results when he had lots of luck going his way but can anyone say we deserved to beat Germany or draw with them in Gelsenkirchen?  We were shocking in those games and just rode the arse off our luck.  Italy no matter who wants to justify it has to have a major asterisk beside that result after fielding a reserve team in a dead rubber for them.

People are only waking up to him now. The warning signs were there from the start.  He had settled for a draw against Georgia in 2014 by not bringing on Hoolahan and we didn't try to to go for the winner instead sitting back.  Only for McGeady's magic the press would hve been hounding him from that night onwards.  It was a cowardly display and TOD rightly pulled him up on it afterwards hence him taking a dislike to him ever since.

By the way MON won 2 European Cups you know.  (Not as a manager though)

David May also won a European Cup.
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