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John Delaney and the latest FAI controversy

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Denis Irwin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2019 at 4:41pm
Can see a scenario where the 50% of Lansdowne is offered to to the IRFU  to get money into the coffers and we're back as tenants again ahead of schedule 

Edited by Denis Irwin - 15 May 2019 at 4:41pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BabbsBalls Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2019 at 4:46pm
Not a hope Dinny.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cardwizzard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2019 at 5:02pm
It's the complete lack of accountability, head in the sand that fecks me off. FAI hoping this will go away and things go back to the way they were. 

They've done irreparable damage in my eyes, cost us a fortune both financially and through grassroots. And we haven't even got to the bottom of the barrel yet... I for one hope it folds and we can rebuild a new association for the greater good.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote OohAah... Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2019 at 5:11pm
They must be at something. All playing dumb, and would rather hide behind expensive legal advice and risk bankcrupting themselves than face up and own up and dare anyone take the rap

They are all complicit in this game. Including the sports council

Look at how they changed their tune from their first hearing to the second. They actually praised the FAI in the first meeting, then when the horse had bolted they played the tough cop.

then look at how the FAI behaved, every single one of them played dumb. again no one wanted to be caught with an actual answer as it would imply knowledge.

They get away with cos its only football.

And now the overlords Uefa and Fifa who all carry on in the same way, are acting the saviours of transparency and governence. ffs


Edited by OohAah... - 15 May 2019 at 5:12pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2019 at 5:16pm
I just had an email exchange with a woman in the complaints department at Tesco, I’m off to get a selfie with her...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cliffrichard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2019 at 5:28pm
Interesting that FAI feel confident enough to pick a fight with SIPTU, who presumably represent a significant proportion of FAI's employees...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sham157 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2019 at 5:35pm
Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

I just had an email exchange with a woman in the complaints department at Tesco, I’m off to get a selfie with her...
But did she get you into the staff canteen to meet the butcher, fishmonger, checkout operator and shelf stacker? 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote OohAah... Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2019 at 5:51pm
The FAi standard line has been like that Iraqi government media lad in Bagdad, nothing to see here, while they are occupied by the US.

They have 3 auditors in plus 2 investigations(ODCE and Revenue),  mounting legal bills, the very least they could say to SIPTU was We appreciate your concern 

It would be comical if it wasnt so serious


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sligo Hornet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2019 at 6:01pm
Originally posted by Sham157 Sham157 wrote:

Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

I just had an email exchange with a woman in the complaints department at Tesco, I’m off to get a selfie with her...
But did she get you into the staff canteen to meet the butcher, fishmonger, checkout operator and shelf stacker? 

pM is just pulling your leg Sham......no way would he lower his standards to shop in Tesco ffs Shocked
Wallet ?? What the fcuk is that ?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2019 at 6:03pm
They are sh*te! Aldi or Morrison’s!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote inlikeflynn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2019 at 7:17pm
Does Irish football need the FAI?

The Irish national team will continue to exist if the association should fail. As will the clubs in the leagues. 

I'm struggling to see what the issue would be if the whole dirty lot were wound up tomorrow and something new be put in its place. I don't care if we are tenants in Lansdowne. I can't see much difference, beyond the stadium being a different building, to how things were before being co-owners. 

Sell it off, clear the debts and start again with a new organisation which puts fans and national clubs first!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kevincronin2000 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2019 at 7:20pm
Tbf we could play our home games in tallaght, there just wouldn't be the scope to hand out 10k free tickets. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wanderer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2019 at 7:33pm
Originally posted by inlikeflynn inlikeflynn wrote:

Does Irish football need the FAI?

The Irish national team will continue to exist if the association should fail. As will the clubs in the leagues. 

I'm struggling to see what the issue would be if the whole dirty lot were wound up tomorrow and something new be put in its place. I don't care if we are tenants in Lansdowne. I can't see much difference, beyond the stadium being a different building, to how things were before being co-owners. 

Sell it off, clear the debts and start again with a new organisation which puts fans and national clubs first!

This isn't a smart question now but genuinely how would a national team and all its underage sides continue to run without an association? You can't just wind up and replace something like this as easy as that 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SuperDave84 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2019 at 7:35pm
Originally posted by inlikeflynn inlikeflynn wrote:

Does Irish football need the FAI?

The Irish national team will continue to exist if the association should fail. As will the clubs in the leagues. 

I'm struggling to see what the issue would be if the whole dirty lot were wound up tomorrow and something new be put in its place. I don't care if we are tenants in Lansdowne. I can't see much difference, beyond the stadium being a different building, to how things were before being co-owners. 

Sell it off, clear the debts and start again with a new organisation which puts fans and national clubs first!


This is completely the wrong time to be selling off the interest in the Aviva, with the debt not a million miles from being cleared.

If the debt is cleared on that, then proceeds from every home game until the 50 years is up goes directly to the FAI.

If the FAI sell their interest in the Aviva, there's only going to be one buyer, and that's the IRFU, especially when they paid their share of the stadium up front and are about to sell the second round of ten year tickets.

Then the FAI are off cap in hand to them again, paying stupid rent to use the place, with nowhere else to go, and the cream from every set of ticket sales going to Giles and Niles in the IRFU.

The financial position of the FAI has not changed from when they were tenants (if anything, it has got a lot worse) but it is inarguable that the position will get better if there is no debt to pay and that that day is not a million miles away.

The FAI appear to be close to insolvent, yes, but that does not mean they are bankrupt. They are not generating mountains of cash but it does not mean that their liabilities exceed their assets or that that is close. The primary asset is the interest in the Aviva, the millstone is the debt. But the debt from the Aviva ought to be paid off soon and it is not the time to cash in the interest in the Aviva, simply to cover a few short term financial difficulties. It has the potential to be the best thing that has ever happened to Irish football. Simply put, the FAI have never had a situation where they owned a stadium of that capacity, debt free, and got to keep all the gate receipts from an event there, without debt to be paid. They cannot mortgage that future now.

It's not even that so much has been invested to here, it's that the investment required, at this stage, to make sure they keep the potential cash cow that it represents makes absolute sense. The primary aim for the FAI now has to be to ensure the long term financial health of the organisation so that it can properly invest in clubs, leagues, youth development and whatever else. It is hard to argue that that is best served by cashing in their one prime asset when it is only a couple of years from generating millions of euro, every year, at minimal expense.

If that potential is lost because of mismanagement of the FAI by Delaney, it would undoubtedly be the gravest sin of his entire reign.


Edited by SuperDave84 - 15 May 2019 at 7:38pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote OohAah... Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2019 at 7:56pm
i still can't understand how fai are classed as owner of the aviva. If its only a lease.

They own a lease, in 60 or so years all that money they spent paying off the loan on it will have disappeared

I.e what's the comparative cost of rent versus loan payments

It seems like a typical half baked fainomics


Edited by OohAah... - 15 May 2019 at 7:57pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SuperDave84 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2019 at 8:22pm
They are half owners of the leasehold interest in the stadium. However, the IRFU own the actual ground. The lease expires after 50 years. There is no actual rent to pay on the lease, as such. The FAI paid part of the construction costs of the stadium in exchange for the lease. However, once the stadium is paid for, the FAI receive their income from the stadium until the end of the 50 years.

It's like an apartment: you don't actually own a freehold interest, just a long lease. But the effect is the same; until the lease expires, you are basically the owner and have all the rights and responsibilities of the owner. Whether it was a good deal at the time or not is now neither here nor there; we have to look at the position right now. That position is that the FAI have an asset (a 40 year lease on the stadium) and a debt (a good few million) along with a cashflow problem.

They shouldn't be solving the shorter term problem (the cashflow problem) and conflating it with the debt by selling the asset (the lease, which is a big long term benefit). It is certainly not in the long term interests of Irish football to return to being a tenant. I would imagine that this is clear to those running the FAI, and hopefully to anyone else who may be involved in running it in the near future.

Simply put, you don't sell your house in the winter just because you can't afford a coat.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gufct Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2019 at 8:28pm
The only problem i’d Have Dave is no one actually knows what the debt is and how much we have already paid.

I wouldn’t believe any of the financial information that was made public since jd became treasurer in 2001 .
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote OohAah... Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2019 at 8:37pm
cheers Dave.

But i still don't see the basic benefit financially. How much was spent, what was the size of the loan, what is the interest. 

I don't want you to answer these ofcourse, but if you compare all that money that was spent to what the cost of rent would've been I'd wonder if the 2 figures would be comparable.

This idea of part owning to me seems to be an excercise in words. They own a lease. When the lease expires they own nothing. They've only spent money 

 A land leasehold in an apartment say, is in the region of hundreds of years .not 60.

Now if the plan was to clear the loan, then save money and offer to buy half off the irfu in 60 years then maybe I could understand. But it's a gamble.

Besides my whole pint here is probably bollox anyway cos will the stadium not be delapidated in 60 years anyway


Edited by OohAah... - 15 May 2019 at 8:38pm
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