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Éire v Switzerland 05.09.19

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Ronnie Whelan
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote King_Kenny Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 2019 at 1:47am
Yes don’t get the legend of Seamus Coleman myself!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Strazdas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 2019 at 1:58am
One big change from the Trap and O'Neill eras is we didn't play the ball long at all. Randolph rolled the ball out to the full back every time. That is a big improvement and explains why our possession stats are much higher under Mick.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote howieb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 2019 at 8:45am
Originally posted by Strazdas Strazdas wrote:

One big change from the Trap and O'Neill eras is we didn't play the ball long at all. Randolph rolled the ball out to the full back every time. That is a big improvement and explains why our possession stats are much higher under Mick.

Good point and when we counter attack it's usually on the ground and not just a long ball unless someone makes a good run. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lenny82 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 2019 at 9:33am
We averaged 35% possession in MON's last 5 games. In Mick's first 5, we have averaged 53%. Not a direct, or fair comparison, given some of our opponents, but an indicator at least, that we are making some progress and not lumping it long at every opportunity.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tetsujin1979 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 2019 at 9:49am
Originally posted by Strazdas Strazdas wrote:

One big change from the Trap and O'Neill eras is we didn't play the ball long at all. Randolph rolled the ball out to the full back every time. That is a big improvement and explains why our possession stats are much higher under Mick.
he didn't do it every time, but I'd have said he kicked it long to the left of centre midfield far more than he rolled it out to Coleman or Stevens
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BigStrongMan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 2019 at 10:00am
yeah he bated it up to McClean a good few times
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Green Devil Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 2019 at 10:13am
Originally posted by howieb howieb wrote:

Originally posted by Green Devil Green Devil wrote:

Originally posted by BabbsBalls BabbsBalls wrote:

Originally posted by Paul Andrew White Paul Andrew White wrote:

We are Ireland we should demand it better. Fear no enemy. Our problem is confidence when on the ball.

It is. 

Some want each of our managers to pass the ball till the cows come home yet we can’t put five passes together most times.

That's because they're not allowed or encouraged to?

Instructions under Trap and O'Neill was to hoof the ball forward as quick as possible.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with retaining possession and playing some simple 5 and 10 yard passes.

Our kick and rush style just hands the ball back to the opposition straight away, for every Shane Long moment against Germany there are 50 needless passes given straight back to the opposition. 

It's all about finding a balance. 

Of course they are allowed and encouraged to pass the ball . When you don't have that technical player to see that pass and hold onto the ball it's very hard to retain possession when your been pressed by a team 
If you have a couple of technical players in the midfield that are comfortable on the ball and can open up space it's easier to hold onto possession and pass the ball . Unfortunately we don't have that type of player. 
It's easy to say pass the ball but when you are been closed down really quickly and don't have the ability to find a little pocket of space it's really difficult... 

It was tongue in cheek.

If you're honestly trying to tell me that Trap and O'Neill weren't guilty of forcing our players into minimal phases of play i.e. getting rid of the ball up the field as quick as possible you need to have a scan of the archives.

Its all a myth that every team presses from the front nowadays, most of the bottom 1 and 2 tier sides allow you to more or less have the ball in your own half and they put 9 men behind the ball, even 10 at times and camp inside their own half looking to counter attack.

No one is saying we should be hitting 800 passes against Denmark away, my point is retaining possession in certain areas and at times imo would definitely bring a far greater level of calm and patience to our play.

I fully understand that we're not blessed with the most technically gifted players in the world but there's no trust being put in these lads at international level (as if being allowed to play football is knocked out of them) to at least attempt to be more calculated and controlled in our play.


Edited by Green Devil - 08 Sep 2019 at 10:14am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Maccatacca Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 2019 at 10:41am
There’s nothing wrong with the occasional long ball so long as it’s intelligent and not an aimless punt.

The under 21s played some very affective long balls up the wing against Armenia where the ball was chipped over the full backs head which gave our wingers and strikers a chance to run in behind. 

I don’t recall too many long balls against the Swiss on Thursday.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NewtNewbie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 2019 at 10:59am
I was watching an amateur game yesterday and every time one particular team had a goal kick one of the centre-halves would take it and boot it as high and as far down the park as he could.

Even at that level I was struck by the absolute futility of having possession of the ball and deciding to turn that possession into a 50/50 ball you had to compete for in order to regain that possession.


Edited by NewtNewbie - 08 Sep 2019 at 11:05am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote t_rAndy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 2019 at 11:41am
We tried to play out from the back a good few times against the Swiss, however, the net result is we didn’t get out of our own half and had to kick it aimlessly long anyway as Swiss put the players under too much pressure and they couldn’t work their way out. So mick and players are trying to be positive, just lacking quality to execute it against stronger sides, which is ok. We can only imo I’ve bit by bit and then hope some of these young players make the strp up and can improve the quality and execution 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Left foot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 2019 at 12:47pm
Originally posted by NewtNewbie NewtNewbie wrote:

I was watching an amateur game yesterday and every time one particular team had a goal kick one of the centre-halves would take it and boot it as high and as far down the park as he could.

Even at that level I was struck by the absolute futility of having possession of the ball and deciding to turn that possession into a 50/50 ball you had to compete for in order to regain that possession.

This is old school coaching that has continued to plague irish football for decades. I played and managed in an amateur 11 a side team in hackney marshes in london and most teams approached games like this, teams would clearly play the big strong lad over the technically better smaller lad 

We made the decision to play from the back and move the ball around, play the technically better players and not be afraid to pass the ball up the field.

We pretty much lost every game that season, silly mistakes at the back, bullied off the ball, couldn't pass up the field. We got better and better after each game. We avoided relegation due to teams dropping out 

The next season we were the best team in the division, we would hold possession and work the ball upfield, when we lost the ball opposition just gave it straight back to us.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Banjaxed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 2019 at 1:03pm
Molumby could be a godsend in our midfield if he continues to excel. Exactly what we're missing both on and off the ball. Not to mention he comes across as a great leader and communicator. The "leading by example" player we need in the middle of the pitch. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote horsebox Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 2019 at 1:24pm
Very true.
I can see him making the step up soon enough, hopefully at the expense of Arter.

He was very vocal the other night.
     
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Maccatacca Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 2019 at 1:43pm
Originally posted by Banjaxed Banjaxed wrote:

Molumby could be a godsend in our midfield if he continues to excel. Exactly what we're missing both on and off the ball. Not to mention he comes across as a great leader and communicator. The "leading by example" player we need in the middle of the pitch. 

He’s very vocal on the pitch and is constantly badgering his team mates if they’re not doing enough. 

Is also a brilliant tackler. 

If he gets solid championship game time between now and Switzerland away then there has to be a decent chance of him making the squad. 

From the early signs it looks like he’s exactly what we need in midfield. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote deise316 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 2019 at 1:57pm
He'll have to nail down a place at Millwall first, and maintain a decent level of performance. Even if he does that, I wouldn't think he will be considered for any of the next 3 games unless there's an injury crisis. He could very well make the squad alright, though on the other night, I think its only Connolly & himself you could say that about.

Very exciting prospect though, big fella, can run all day, does some amount of roaring at lads, sticks the foot in tackles, good long passer. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MC Hammered Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 2019 at 2:18pm
 

The midfield trio for the 21s v Armenia all looked very promising. Molumphy stood out but I thought Coventry and Kilkenny were also technically tidy in possession and busy without it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote howieb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 2019 at 2:25pm
Originally posted by deise316 deise316 wrote:

He'll have to nail down a place at Millwall first, and maintain a decent level of performance. Even if he does that, I wouldn't think he will be considered for any of the next 3 games unless there's an injury crisis. He could very well make the squad alright, though on the other night, I think its only Connolly & himself you could say that about.

Very exciting prospect though, big fella, can run all day, does some amount of roaring at lads, sticks the foot in tackles, good long passer. 

We have so many promising players coming through but they have an awful lot to prove yet . They need to start playing first team football consistently to start with . The step up is huge . How many times have we seen a young player been talked up and nothing becoming of them . 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote howieb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 2019 at 2:40pm
Originally posted by Green Devil Green Devil wrote:

Originally posted by howieb howieb wrote:

Originally posted by Green Devil Green Devil wrote:

Originally posted by BabbsBalls BabbsBalls wrote:

Originally posted by Paul Andrew White Paul Andrew White wrote:

We are Ireland we should demand it better. Fear no enemy. Our problem is confidence when on the ball.

It is. 

Some want each of our managers to pass the ball till the cows come home yet we can’t put five passes together most times.

That's because they're not allowed or encouraged to?

Instructions under Trap and O'Neill was to hoof the ball forward as quick as possible.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with retaining possession and playing some simple 5 and 10 yard passes.

Our kick and rush style just hands the ball back to the opposition straight away, for every Shane Long moment against Germany there are 50 needless passes given straight back to the opposition. 

It's all about finding a balance. 

Of course they are allowed and encouraged to pass the ball . When you don't have that technical player to see that pass and hold onto the ball it's very hard to retain possession when your been pressed by a team 
If you have a couple of technical players in the midfield that are comfortable on the ball and can open up space it's easier to hold onto possession and pass the ball . Unfortunately we don't have that type of player. 
It's easy to say pass the ball but when you are been closed down really quickly and don't have the ability to find a little pocket of space it's really difficult... 

It was tongue in cheek.

If you're honestly trying to tell me that Trap and O'Neill weren't guilty of forcing our players into minimal phases of play i.e. getting rid of the ball up the field as quick as possible you need to have a scan of the archives.

Its all a myth that every team presses from the front nowadays, most of the bottom 1 and 2 tier sides allow you to more or less have the ball in your own half and they put 9 men behind the ball, even 10 at times and camp inside their own half looking to counter attack.

No one is saying we should be hitting 800 passes against Denmark away, my point is retaining possession in certain areas and at times imo would definitely bring a far greater level of calm and patience to our play.

I fully understand that we're not blessed with the most technically gifted players in the world but there's no trust being put in these lads at international level (as if being allowed to play football is knocked out of them) to at least attempt to be more calculated and controlled in our play.

I agree Trap and O'Neill didn't trust our players to pass the ball .. I was talking about the team under Mick
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