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International Elections Thread
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sid waddell View Drop Down
Roy Keane
Roy Keane

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Points: 12173 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sid waddell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Oct 2020 at 11:26am
Originally posted by Het-field Het-field wrote:

What has Hong Kong got to do with Chile?

Any libertarian who understands the ideology doesn't venerate Pinochet, for numerous reasons. At best its for the fig-leaf libertarians. Same types who applaud post revolution Somalia.
Well I would think Hong Kong and Pinochet era Chile would be quite comparable in that political freedom is and was, shall we say, not looked upon very kindly there, yet libertarians eulogise their "freedom"

The whole "libertarian" cabal, from Buchanan to the Koch Brothers to the litany of right wing pseudo academic "institutions" in US universities like Chicago and the Hooover "Institution" at Stanford, to the Wall Street Journal etc in media, to gobsh*tes like Niall Ferguson and the British right-wing, including of course Thatcher, loved Pinochet 

The Pinochet era constitution was designed specifically by the American libertarian cult to destroy political freedom and enchain democracy within a set of constitutional constraints which prevented real democratic change

This remained the case even after the monumental nationwide democratic effort to oust Pinochet in 1988 and has continued up to the present day
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Roy Keane
Roy Keane

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Points: 10532 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Het-field Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Oct 2020 at 11:29am
Again, not libertarian. None of that actually relates to libertarian philosophy.

And Hong Kong's issues are not of its own makings. The fact that its affairs are being meddled in by another nation, one which has no interest in human rights (see its ranking in the link you provided), is the bigger issue.

And you list another group of right-wingers who are not libertarian, and it is easy to pick apart why they aren't. And it doesn't matter who they venerate.


Edited by Het-field - 26 Oct 2020 at 11:30am
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sid waddell View Drop Down
Roy Keane
Roy Keane

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Points: 12173 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sid waddell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Oct 2020 at 11:39am
Originally posted by Het-field Het-field wrote:

Again, not libertarian. None of that actually relates to libertarian philosophy.

And Hong Kong's issues are not of its own makings. The fact that its affairs are being meddled in by another nation, one which has no interest in human rights (see its ranking in the link you provided), is the bigger issue.

And you list another group of right-wingers who are not libertarian, and it is easy to pick apart why they aren't. And it doesn't matter who they venerate.

Well the libertarians think they're libertarian

Chile had its affairs meddled with by another nation and that was grand, said the libertarians

What's the Mont Pelerin society if not libertarian? 

They all supported Pinochet

You seem to be fascinated by the search for the one "pure", intellectually honest yet completely naive libertarian who may or may not exist on this earth - if they do they're probably stuck down the back of the Berkeley library in Trinners, smoking a joint and w**king to Ayn Rand with a dildo up their ass, actually, no - that's not intellectually pure as Ayn Rand was a so called "benefit scrounger"






Edited by sid waddell - 26 Oct 2020 at 11:40am
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Roy Keane
Roy Keane

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Genuine libertarians wouldn't. I'm not looking for "purity". But there are fundamental consistencies which differentiate a libertarian from a conservative.

"Well the libertarians think they're libertarian". So what? They can call themselves what they like, but if it doesn't accord with basic principles, it is a clear ideological fig leaf, to sit over bog standard conservatism, or alt rightism. 

Where did "the libertarians" say "that was grand". 
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sid waddell View Drop Down
Roy Keane
Roy Keane

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Originally posted by Het-field Het-field wrote:

Genuine libertarians wouldn't. I'm not looking for "purity". But there are fundamental consistencies which differentiate a libertarian from a conservative.

"Well the libertarians think they're libertarian". So what? They can call themselves what they like, but if it doesn't accord with basic principles, it is a clear ideological fig leaf, to sit over bog standard conservatism, or alt rightism. 

Where did "the libertarians" say "that was grand". 
"Libertarianism" has always been a fig leaf for authoritarian right-wing crackpotism

That's what it is 

You can live in reality or you can keep fooling yourself that you've not been played for an eejit
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Roy Keane
Roy Keane

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Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

"Libertarianism" has always been a fig leaf for authoritarian right-wing crackpotism

That's what it is 

You can live in reality or you can keep fooling yourself that you've not been played for an eejit

Thats incorrect in an ideological sense. If you use it as a fig leaf, you never were in the first place. It falls off exceptionally quickly when conservatives etc discover that it requires open borders, civil rights etc.

I often think on the other side of the fence, the more watered down left-wing ideologies are fig leafs for a highly statist approach. Its strange that it works in reverse, I suppose.
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sid waddell View Drop Down
Roy Keane
Roy Keane

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Originally posted by Het-field Het-field wrote:

Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

"Libertarianism" has always been a fig leaf for authoritarian right-wing crackpotism

That's what it is 

You can live in reality or you can keep fooling yourself that you've not been played for an eejit

Thats incorrect in an ideological sense. If you use it as a fig leaf, you never were in the first place. It falls off exceptionally quickly when conservatives etc discover that it requires open borders, civil rights etc.

I often think on the other side of the fence, the more watered down left-wing ideologies are fig leafs for a highly statist approach. Its strange that it works in reverse, I suppose.
You might as well be arguing for the "religious" aspects of Scientology and completely ignoring the cult bit
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Roy Keane
Roy Keane

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Originally posted by sid waddell sid waddell wrote:

You might as well be arguing for the "religious" aspects of Scientology and completely ignoring the cult bit

Not really. Bad analogy. 
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Roy Keane
Roy Keane

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I think maybe the true, intellectually pure libertarian was that "Do What You Feel" guy in The Simpsons

He's the guy to lead us to an intellectually pure "libertarian" paradise
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Roy Keane
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I wouldn't be interested.

But like I said, I'm not interested in ideological purity. But basic consistency. Not much to ask for.


Edited by Het-field - 26 Oct 2020 at 12:28pm
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Liam Brady
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Some win for the Ivory Coast President. 92%Clap
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Liam Brady
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A pro EU candidate has won the Moldovan election. A second region voted to break away like Transnistria if they joined the EU. 
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Liam Brady
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Points: 1352 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jackal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jan 2021 at 10:15pm
Italian government needs a new coalition partner. Silvio is the favourite.
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Liam Brady
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Points: 1352 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jackal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 May 2021 at 8:59pm
Syria's Assad is up for reelection today.
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