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sid waddell
Roy Keane
On a dark desert highway
Joined: 20 Nov 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 12173
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Posted: 03 Aug 2020 at 9:19am |
Roberto Baggio wrote:
You’re proving my point with your last two posts Sid, that everything is out |
How?
You're running with the "cancel culture" meme which is designed specifically to advance the far right's ideology
So called "cancel culture" is either i) a real thing - in which case it's a fraud and a lie as the people who push the term "cancel culture" tend to be the biggest "cancellers" of the lot, or ii) it doesn't exist
A fraud or it doesn't exist - which is it in your view?
You've made zero contribution to the thread to explain your views
Generalised, venomous kicking down Tory/UKIP style vilification of the disadvantaged and marginalised society should very much be out
Stuff like "bin dipppers" should certainly be out as it's a generalised, venomous and dehumanising slur against both Liverpudlians and poor and working class people which is designed to serve the narratives of the Tory press
Whereas I can remain free to call Manchester City slave owners and paedophile protectors, because it's taking aim at a vile, despotic regime and those who protected paedophiles
I also remain free to call Manchester City supporters Trumpbots, because many of them act like it, their social media behaviour is very reminiscent of actual Trump supporting bots and trolls, you would be an example there
Funnily enough such people seem to reserve a lot of their venom for actual Manchester City supporters who can exercise critical thinking like David Conn, and, eh, I can't think of any others at the moment, but I'm sure there have to be some others
Edited by sid waddell - 03 Aug 2020 at 9:24am
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Roberto Baggio
Robbie Keane
UNBELIEVABLE JEFF
Joined: 28 Jan 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 37344
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Posted: 03 Aug 2020 at 9:47am |
So to sum up, in Sid's opinion Jocks, Paddys and Taffs are not offensive and are ok to use, but once you bring race into it its a definite no no as are any jibes at Liverpool fans Also Sid - lets start a thread listing terms some people will find offensive, but if anyone says that they are all offensive and shouldn't be used then its "cancel culture" So in other words Sid can preach to people what they should and shouldn't be offended by and if they disagree they are "cancellers" or "snowflakes" or "virtue signallers" or some other term invented in the last couple of years Get ya now Now keep you going with the same old broken record rhetoric about Trump, Man City and racism on every thread like a good lad there. Its so intriguing.
Edited by Roberto Baggio - 03 Aug 2020 at 9:51am
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sid waddell
Roy Keane
On a dark desert highway
Joined: 20 Nov 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 12173
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Posted: 03 Aug 2020 at 10:24am |
Roberto Baggio wrote:
So to sum up, in Sid's opinion Jocks, Paddys and Taffs are not offensive and are ok to use, but once you bring race into it its a definite no no as are any jibes at Liverpool fansAlso Sid - lets start a thread listing terms some people will find offensive, but if anyone says that they are all offensive and shouldn't be used then its "cancel culture" So in other words Sid can preach to people what they should and shouldn't be offended by and if they disagree they are "cancellers" or "snowflakes" or "virtue signallers" or some other term invented in the last couple of years Get ya now Now keep you going with the same old broken record rhetoric about Trump, Man City and racism on every thread like a good lad there. Its so intriguing.
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I've quite reasonably explained why certain terms should not be used and also taken on board the view of an actual Scottish person about why he doesn't like the term "Jock"
You haven't engaged with anything I've said, or indeed what Ersatz Thistle or pre madonna have said
You aren't engaging in good faith at all and are only using buzzwords and a horrible tabloid meme
It's really weird that you bring up the "cancel culture" meme as a jibe at me because I'm not the person using it - you are
The "cancel culture" meme is something that is used to advance right wing ideology by portraying "the left" (with which I am widely associated on this forum) as wanting to silence people
It's a meme that is used to protect power and privilege, and to sh*t on the marginalised and disadvantaged
I think you're not engaging in good faith because you know you don't have any real argument but are doing that INTERNET thing where you're prepared to dig in and defend a wrong position out of some weird sense of INTERNET persona pride
I think you're also secretly embarrassed by Manchester City's horrible associations with a despotic regime and the rotten events that took place in their past regarding child abuse but feel that INTERNET sense of duty to airbrush that from existence
I find it weird that you would object to discussions about racism, as I've said before, a lot of white people get weirdly paranoid and start playing the fake victim when a discussion about racism or generalised hatred takes them out of their comfort zone
Edited by sid waddell - 03 Aug 2020 at 10:32am
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Roberto Baggio
Robbie Keane
UNBELIEVABLE JEFF
Joined: 28 Jan 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 37344
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Posted: 03 Aug 2020 at 10:41am |
My belief is that all of the terms you listed on your opening post cannot be used in this day and age, in a world that has gone mad with political correctness. I said that on the previous page Do you honestly think it would be acceptable during a world cup for Darragh Maloney to come on RTE or Gary Lineker on the BBC to say - "and welcome to the first day of the round of 16, today we've some fantastic games in store, its the Jocks vs the Krauts followed by the Frogs vs the Wops" Are you seriously asking if any of this would be acceptable? Are you out of your mind asking this question? you of all people.
Edited by Roberto Baggio - 03 Aug 2020 at 10:48am
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coyne
Paul McGrath
Joined: 17 Aug 2013
Location: Sunderland
Status: Offline
Points: 15881
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Posted: 03 Aug 2020 at 11:05am |
Don’t bother arguing with Sid RB. He’s never wrong. Just nod your head at the post or yawn and move along.
The O’Shea 2.0. 1 of em is bad enough.
Edited by coyne - 03 Aug 2020 at 11:08am
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Zinedine Kilbane 110
Jack Charlton
Man City records obsession
Joined: 20 Mar 2012
Location: Dundalk
Status: Offline
Points: 9647
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Posted: 03 Aug 2020 at 11:25am |
FFS This thread needs to be removed.
Where is BSM when you need him.
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Flanno7hi
Liam Brady
Joined: 26 Jul 2010
Location: Chester
Status: Offline
Points: 2618
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Posted: 03 Aug 2020 at 11:53am |
I would say it is always better to avoid saying these things at all. It is not up to me to decide if saying jock or taff etc is offensive it is up to the person. The father in law is quite racist and an idiot and will argue that saying the p word to describe someone from Pakistan is fine because it relates to where they are from, I've tried to explain that it is up to the particular people to decide if that is ok or not. had it myself when I moved to England, had some ex army **** in my aerospace job in Burnley call me a Paddy a few times, it was said to put me down. I asked him did he have a problem with me and Irish people? He said it again and said that's what they were called in the army. I explained that he was not in the army anymore and that someone from my background wouldn't be joining the british army. He kept on saying it, in front of colleagues and bosses so I asked him if he wanted to chat about it outside after work in a meeting one day (I'm no hard man, I was expecting to get my head kicked in) but he decided to say oh i'm only jokin and seemed to avoid me after that. It's a all about context isn't it? If one of my French colleagues or African colleagues had called me a paddy I probably wouldn't have taken it as badly but from and Englishman and an ex brit at that it did piss me off. I guess I would try to avoid being like that guy by just avoid saying things that could be taken as offensive.
Edited by Flanno7hi - 03 Aug 2020 at 11:55am
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Our City. Our Community. Our Club IG @flanno_7hi
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sid waddell
Roy Keane
On a dark desert highway
Joined: 20 Nov 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 12173
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Posted: 03 Aug 2020 at 12:04pm |
Roberto Baggio wrote:
My belief is that all of the terms you listed on your opening post cannot be used in this day and age, in a world that has gone mad with political correctness. I said that on the previous page |
Expand on this, please
A lot of the terms referenced on this thread are still widely used
Paddies, Jocks, Tans, Taffs, Frogs, Krauts, Argies, Yanks, Ruskies, Convicts are definitely still used without any repercussion
Your post here seems to imply that you're deeply unhappy that not all of the terms referenced here are seen as acceptable to use
That includes terms like "Paki", "nip" and "chink"
Do you think it's "political correctness" gone mad that these terms are widely seen as unacceptable?
Does that also apply to the other n word?
The phrase you use "a world that has gone mad with political correctness" seems to display a complete refusal to engage with the concept that terms of generalised hatred should not be used, and also displays a belief (a wrong belief) that the people who want to use these terms are the real victims
The notion that people who want to use generalised terms of hatred and incitement to hatred against traditionally marginalised peoples, but feel they cannot do so because "political correctness" - that these "anti-PC" people could be victims of "oppression"? I find that totally ludicrous
"Cancel culture" and "political correctness gone mad" are right-wing tabloid memes deliberately designed for purposes of crude reductionism and the destruction of any sort of critical thinking, in the service of right-wing interests and the protection of white, male, straight, imperialist power and privilege
Edited by sid waddell - 03 Aug 2020 at 12:05pm
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Roberto Baggio
Robbie Keane
UNBELIEVABLE JEFF
Joined: 28 Jan 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 37344
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Posted: 03 Aug 2020 at 12:09pm |
sid waddell wrote:
The phrase you use "a world that has gone mad with political correctness" seems to display a complete refusal to engage with the concept that terms of generalised hatred should not be used, and also displays a belief (a wrong belief) that the people who want to use these terms are the real victims
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On the contrary I've said three times now that none of those words on the opening post on this thread should be used in 2020. You seem to be failing to grasp or accept my simple answer to the question you pose on the opening post. You're the one trying to defend some of them and dictate which ones are offensive and which ones aren't. Don't use any of them is the easy solution. Each of them is going to offend a lot of people. Another silly thread to give you a chance to get on your soapbox and preach about racism, your favourite subject. Ohhh look at me i'm so knowledgeable and intelligent about everything to do with racism that i'm going to dedicate every thread to it.
Edited by Roberto Baggio - 03 Aug 2020 at 12:09pm
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sid waddell
Roy Keane
On a dark desert highway
Joined: 20 Nov 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 12173
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Posted: 03 Aug 2020 at 12:09pm |
Roberto Baggio wrote:
My belief is that all of the terms you listed on your opening post cannot be used in this day and age, in a world that has gone mad with political correctness. I said that on the previous page Do you honestly think it would be acceptable during a world cup for Darragh Maloney to come on RTE or Gary Lineker on the BBC to say - "and welcome to the first day of the round of 16, today we've some fantastic games in store, its the Jocks vs the Krauts followed by the Frogs vs the Wops" Are you seriously asking if any of this would be acceptable? Are you out of your mind asking this question? you of all people.
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Well I don't think that's ever happened, ever
They are TV presenters of whom a level of gravitas is expected
It's not as if Peter Dimmock or Kenneth Wolstenholme or David Coleman or Brian Moore or Des Lynam or Bill O'Herlihy were doing that back in the day, I don't think so at least
The way you frame this implies that that did happen in the past, and that something of value in discourse has been taken away
I don't see that at all
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sid waddell
Roy Keane
On a dark desert highway
Joined: 20 Nov 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 12173
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Posted: 03 Aug 2020 at 12:15pm |
Roberto Baggio wrote:
sid waddell wrote:
The phrase you use "a world that has gone mad with political correctness" seems to display a complete refusal to engage with the concept that terms of generalised hatred should not be used, and also displays a belief (a wrong belief) that the people who want to use these terms are the real victims
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On the contrary I've said three times now that none of those words on the opening post on this thread should be used in 2020. You seem to be failing to grasp or accept my simple answer to the question you pose on the opening post. You're the one trying to defend some of them and dictate which ones are offensive and which ones aren't. Don't use any of them is the easy solution. Each of them is going to offend a lot of people. |
You've expressed anger (why are you angry?) that terms of generalised hatred should not be seen as acceptable (hence your use of the "world gone mad due to political correctness" meme) and you're also treating all these terms as equal in their acceptability/unacceptability as the case may be
These terms are not equal
"Mick" or "Paddy" or "Jock" or "Frog" is not equal to "Paki"
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sid waddell
Roy Keane
On a dark desert highway
Joined: 20 Nov 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 12173
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Posted: 03 Aug 2020 at 12:18pm |
coyne wrote:
Don’t bother arguing with Sid RB. He’s never wrong. Just nod your head at the post or yawn and move along.
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Roberto Baggio wrote:
Another silly thread to give you a chance to get on your soapbox and preach about racism, your favourite subject. Ohhh look at me i'm so knowledgeable and intelligent about everything to do with racism that i'm going to dedicate every thread to it. |
Bizarre reactions
"Where does it stop, I ask you, where does it stop!?"
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Roberto Baggio
Robbie Keane
UNBELIEVABLE JEFF
Joined: 28 Jan 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 37344
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Posted: 03 Aug 2020 at 12:19pm |
Where did I express anger? Where did I say they were equal? You can go and murder someone in the street or you can go and steal their wallet. Both are wrong and shouldn't be done, but no one is implying they're equal acts. You're making a lot of assumptions to get me embroiled in a debate on your favourite subject. All those terms are out, for me. That's my answer to your question. End of.
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sid waddell
Roy Keane
On a dark desert highway
Joined: 20 Nov 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 12173
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Posted: 03 Aug 2020 at 12:31pm |
Flanno7hi wrote:
It's a all about context isn't it? If one of my French colleagues or African colleagues had called me a paddy I probably wouldn't have taken it as badly but from and Englishman and an ex brit at that it did piss me off. I guess I would try to avoid being like that guy by just avoid saying things that could be taken as offensive.
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In general I think the use of some of these terms is mostly about context but the misunderstanding of context or the deliberate clouding or obliteration of context is where the problems can lie
There is a concerted far right campaign internationally to obliterate context and to try and legitimise the use of terms which I think the overwhelming majority of people would see as unacceptable and despicable
In this country there is a widespread and deliberate campaign to try and legitimise the use of the term "knacker" as used in reference to Travellers
A lot of Irish people seem either publicly or privately angry that the word is largely seen as unacceptable - they want to use it
That only comes from a position of horrible racist bigotry
Yet most of those same people would deny being racist
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Green Devil
Robbie Keane
Aye Kes, I've pissed me-self again
Joined: 06 Oct 2010
Location: Barbados
Status: Offline
Points: 22174
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Posted: 03 Aug 2020 at 12:37pm |
Roberto Baggio wrote:
sid waddell wrote:
The phrase you use "a world that has gone mad with political correctness" seems to display a complete refusal to engage with the concept that terms of generalised hatred should not be used, and also displays a belief (a wrong belief) that the people who want to use these terms are the real victims
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On the contrary I've said three times now that none of those words on the opening post on this thread should be used in 2020. You seem to be failing to grasp or accept my simple answer to the question you pose on the opening post. You're the one trying to defend some of them and dictate which ones are offensive and which ones aren't. Don't use any of them is the easy solution. Each of them is going to offend a lot of people. Another silly thread to give you a chance to get on your soapbox and preach about racism, your favourite subject. Ohhh look at me i'm so knowledgeable and intelligent about everything to do with racism that i'm going to dedicate every thread to it.
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That's it in a nutshell....
One look back at the countless unfunny ramblings of his on numerous threads in the ROTW section back that up.
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"He drives two Ferraris; I think he's a very lucky lad to have 50 caps for Ireland,"
Eamonn Dunphy on Glenn Whelan
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Flanno7hi
Liam Brady
Joined: 26 Jul 2010
Location: Chester
Status: Offline
Points: 2618
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Posted: 03 Aug 2020 at 12:39pm |
So just avoid using all of those terms you mention then. Easy. I would have said knacker a lot as a young fella, I also would have called things gay when I meant they were uncool or lame. I wouldn't do either now as they are offensive and times have moved on. Just avoid using terms that describe a group in this lumped together way that may be construed as offensive.
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Our City. Our Community. Our Club IG @flanno_7hi
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Green Devil
Robbie Keane
Aye Kes, I've pissed me-self again
Joined: 06 Oct 2010
Location: Barbados
Status: Offline
Points: 22174
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Posted: 03 Aug 2020 at 12:41pm |
Flanno7hi wrote:
So just avoid using all of those terms you mention then. Easy.I would have said knacker a lot as a young fella, I also would have called things gay when I meant they were uncool or lame. I wouldn't do either now as they are offensive and times have moved on. Just avoid using terms that describe a group in this lumped together way that may be construed as offensive. |
Brilliant post
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"He drives two Ferraris; I think he's a very lucky lad to have 50 caps for Ireland,"
Eamonn Dunphy on Glenn Whelan
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Roberto Baggio
Robbie Keane
UNBELIEVABLE JEFF
Joined: 28 Jan 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 37344
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Posted: 03 Aug 2020 at 12:42pm |
Flanno7hi wrote:
So just avoid using all of those terms you mention then. Easy.I would have said knacker a lot as a young fella, I also would have called things gay when I meant they were uncool or lame. I wouldn't do either now as they are offensive and times have moved on. Just avoid using terms that describe a group in this lumped together way that may be construed as offensive. |
+1
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