Non Irish born fans

That's because until recently at least, rugby in Ireland was seen as a cultural and social, even class, matter, with little or none of the political baggage which infected so much of the rest of Irish life. It was helped too by the fact that Ulster/NI was for long a (the?) powerhouse of the game within Ireland.

And you shouldn't imagine that such people represent a majority of the Unionist population. When you count the numbers of Unionists who don't vote for the DUP, or don't vote at all, they outnumber those who do. And even for those who do vote DUP, many do so solely in order to keep "Themmuns" out, rather than because they're Bible-bashing, anti-gay bigots etc. (It's like not assuming that every SF voter is a Provo-loving terrorist sympathiser, even if the candidates who receive their vote may be)

Meanwhile, the TUV only receives a pitiful vote these days, which I predict will disappear entirely when Allister snuffs it.

As for the OO, no-one knows for certain how many members it has, since they don't publish the figures (curiously enough), but reliable estimates suggest that it is now down to fewer than 25k, which as a percentage of the PUL community of 1m, represents 2-3% at most.

And all of that is before you consider the make-up of northern rugby fans themselves. For rugby itself is very much a minority activity in NI, confined mostly to middle class, grammar school types from affluent areas East of the Bann.

All of which means that your observation, even if accurate, isn't very representative of very much at all.

Like a lot of your comments on NI, as it happens.

horsebox wrote: Move away from sports and they'd see Ireland as a foreign country.

I think you mean the "Irish Republic", rather than "Ireland", which confusion actually goes to the heart of the matter.

For when rugby fans from NI looked on their game, they always saw it purely in sporting, social and cultural terms. Therefore they could happily park their personal political preferences for 80 minutes at Lansdowne and get behind their team.

But I use the past tense, because many are increasingly uneasy with what they see as the growing process whereby the "Ireland" (i.e. island) team is now just becoming the "ROI team with a couple of added Prods".

This was brought sharply into focus when LR was closed and Ireland decided to play Italy at Ravenhill a few years back, thus raising the thorny issue of the anthem.

Traditionally, when the team played home games in Dublin, the SS was always played, but when playing at home in Belfast, it was supposed to be GSTQ. Sometime in the 50's, however, some Southern players refused to come out of the dressing room until GSTQ was over as a protest. However the IRFU was able to duck the issue since they stopped playing at Ravenhill around then anyhow, meaning the fiction of "2 anthems in 2 jurisdictions" could be maintained.

Then the Italy match unexpectedly arose. Now this should have been the ideal pretext for doing away with all political anthems entirely and  in future simply sticking with a neutral tune to which all could adhere, Ireland's Call being the obvious choice.

But no, by a feat of contortion to do a gymnast proud, they decided that this was being played "outside Ireland" [sic]], meaning the protocol for away games would be followed. And that protocol demands (surprise surprise) that only Ireland's Call be played!

For a number of rugby fans in NI, that proved to be the last straw and they stopped following the team as before. Meanwhile for others, traditional allegiances and friendships still prevail, and/or their love for the game means that they don't want to be left completely without any international team to follow, so they just grin and bear it. Either way, many are unhappy.

Moreover, those few Ulster players who do now get picked for the team are unable to repeat the earlier protest by the men of Munster and Leinster, since the game is now professional. Which means they'd be putting their livelihood on the line, rather  than just having 3 or 4 extra Saturdays free to attend to the farm etc.

Meaning that the IRFU now clearly doesn't give a fcuk. Worse still, it doesn't see why it should have to so long as LR is filled every game, which it is.

This.. Its that bad I and others I suspect, just skip past his drivel. 

No one denies N.I. exists. It's a statelet/part of the British state of the United Kingdom just as the rest of our country (Ireland) and India etc etc was previously part of the British state. India was still India, it's own country and nation just as Ireland was and is to this day.  

If the UK countries applied to join UEFA nowadays then they wouldn't be left in. It's why Jersey was refused. UEFA now only let's real countries join. 

Having territorial on this forum shouldn't be a point of contention, I dont care much for his political commentary or views on 'what is ireland'

However, let's not live in an echo chamber where we just look to agree with each other, some of his posts can be an interesting perspective from the point of view other may not have considered. 

For me @Territorial, I appreciate your contributing efforts to this forum even if I disagree with them.

Saying that territorial - posts are a bit wordy sometimes... it's a football forum, we're not defining the rights of man.. 

Having territorial on this forum shouldn't be a point of contention, I dont care much for his political commentary or views on 'what is ireland'

However, let's not live in an echo chamber where we just look to agree with each other, some of his posts can be an interesting perspective from the point of view other may not have considered. 

For me @Territorial, I appreciate your contributing efforts to this forum even if I disagree with them.

Saying that territorial - posts are a bit wordy sometimes... it's a football forum, we're not defining the rights of man.. 

Het-field wrote: Okay Terri, at Ravenhill against Italy, what were they supposed to do?

Simple.

Take the opportunity to dispense with political anthems entirely and replace them with a purely sporting one.

It's a simple matter of respect and would avoid the ridiculous situation whereby they have to declare that a match in Belfast is being staged "outside Ireland".

It would also avoid the unnecessarily prolonged pre-match formalities at Lansdowne, whereby they play the Soldiers Song and Ireland's Call.

So that when playing NZ, by the time you get through the haka and their anthem, the formalities last nearly as long as the match!