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Éire v Switzerland 05.09.19

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Roy Keane
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Het-field Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Aug 2019 at 4:40pm
Originally posted by Hans Moleman Hans Moleman wrote:

Would agree about the toughness of the 02 group. Wouldn't agree about the monumental rebuild job. Just because a squad has gotten older and many need to be moved doesn't mean the rebuild was monumental. There were lots of quality younger Irish players around at that point.

Personally, I think MM didn’t go with the safe rebuild, and it certainly didn’t go smoothly. If I recall correctly we played 4-5-1 in Bucharest, and Ian Harte was deployed initially as a centre back. As was Keane against Iceland.  The 96-97 period wasn’t impressive, results wise, and even the results we did get often left pause for concern. But that was the build which made the 98-99 period a lot more enjoyable.

I also don’t necessarily believe we were as aflush with great young players as we may think. Many of the lads were reasonable international standard. Others got a chance between 96-97 and MM moved on. I suspect you could pick a full 11 of players who made between 1-5 appearances in the early years and didn’t make any real impact.

Look, I think any rebuild Kenny has to do will outstrip what MM did in the 1990s. With MM we had the most reliable left back in the UK, and a Man U Captain in waiting, and they are just two examples. But MM did an exceptional rebuild in those days, as it was more than just rebuilding the 11 for the post Charlton era.

Thanks PM for clearing up my little error earlier!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote delgado Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Aug 2019 at 5:22pm
whats the odds mick getting us to the euros and does reasonably well ,Kenny gets job makes a mess of it and they bring mccarthy .
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Healy52003 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Aug 2019 at 5:30pm
Originally posted by delgado delgado wrote:

whats the odds mick getting us to the euros and does reasonably well ,Kenny gets job makes a mess of it and they bring mccarthy .

Mick could stay on in a consultant type of role ??
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Banjaxed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Aug 2019 at 6:00pm
Originally posted by Healy52003 Healy52003 wrote:

Originally posted by delgado delgado wrote:

whats the odds mick getting us to the euros and does reasonably well ,Kenny gets job makes a mess of it and they bring mccarthy .

Mick could stay on in a consultant type of role ??

If Mick gets us to the Euros, he's guaranteed a bottom half premier League/top half championship gig. 

He'll still be young enough to want another crack at club football. He wont be hanging around. I'd say those are his short term goals and why he wants/needs ireland gig to go as well as possible. 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote t_rAndy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Aug 2019 at 6:55pm
If McCarthy goes to the euros and does well, there will be some amendment that would see him stay on. Jaysus i’d love if we got ourselves into that predicament!

Regarding throwing younger players in, i don’t think the Swiss game is the one to do it. It also might be beneficial to have lads playing the U21 game under Kenny rather than the friendly against Bulgaria.
What i don’t like is just the general philosophy of McCarthy and around certain players in terms of if they are playing he will consider them, if not then he won’t. So basically only players he will consider are players he has had in before and players who have since been getting game time for their clubs. Meaning likes of Parrott and maybe James McCarthy (although he since got game time) are going to be overlooked.
For me, it’s a bit of a cop out. He doesn’t want to try anything new and his excuse is their lack of game time, even though half the squad are in the same predicament. 


Edited by t_rAndy - 19 Aug 2019 at 6:55pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Healy52003 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Aug 2019 at 8:50pm
Byrne tearing it up for rovers 2 great goals 

Sadly wont make the squad for the upcoming games 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Aug 2019 at 8:52pm
I can hear the sighs of relief echoing around the Alps.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zizu Kilbane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Aug 2019 at 9:01pm
Matt Doherty off injured at half time for Wolves 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sham157 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Aug 2019 at 9:06pm
Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

I can hear the sighs of relief echoing around the Alps.
LOL
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Huntacha Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Aug 2019 at 9:53pm
Originally posted by zizu Kilbane zizu Kilbane wrote:

Matt Doherty off injured at half time for Wolves 

Seems like it was an illness rather than an injury.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Paul Andrew White Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Aug 2019 at 10:19pm
Mick must play James McCarthy in the starting eleven asap.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Aug 2019 at 8:13am
Originally posted by Banjaxed Banjaxed wrote:

Originally posted by Healy52003 Healy52003 wrote:

Originally posted by delgado delgado wrote:

whats the odds mick getting us to the euros and does reasonably well ,Kenny gets job makes a mess of it and they bring mccarthy .

Mick could stay on in a consultant type of role ??

If Mick gets us to the Euros, he's guaranteed a bottom half premier League/top half championship gig. 

He'll still be young enough to want another crack at club football. He wont be hanging around. I'd say those are his short term goals and why he wants/needs ireland gig to go as well as possible. 


If Mick gets these lads to the Euros he will have his pick of teams! Barcelona, Real, Juve...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hans Moleman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Aug 2019 at 8:30am
Originally posted by Het-field Het-field wrote:

Originally posted by Hans Moleman Hans Moleman wrote:

Would agree about the toughness of the 02 group. Wouldn't agree about the monumental rebuild job. Just because a squad has gotten older and many need to be moved doesn't mean the rebuild was monumental. There were lots of quality younger Irish players around at that point.

Personally, I think MM didn’t go with the safe rebuild, and it certainly didn’t go smoothly. If I recall correctly we played 4-5-1 in Bucharest, and Ian Harte was deployed initially as a centre back. As was Keane against Iceland.  The 96-97 period wasn’t impressive, results wise, and even the results we did get often left pause for concern. But that was the build which made the 98-99 period a lot more enjoyable.

I also don’t necessarily believe we were as aflush with great young players as we may think. Many of the lads were reasonable international standard. Others got a chance between 96-97 and MM moved on. I suspect you could pick a full 11 of players who made between 1-5 appearances in the early years and didn’t make any real impact.

Look, I think any rebuild Kenny has to do will outstrip what MM did in the 1990s. With MM we had the most reliable left back in the UK, and a Man U Captain in waiting, and they are just two examples. But MM did an exceptional rebuild in those days, as it was more than just rebuilding the 11 for the post Charlton era.

Thanks PM for clearing up my little error earlier!

There is no such thing as a safe rebuild, but McCarthy wasn't exactly a footballing maverick replacing any older player with the next young thing. It was more a case of it being beyond the point of no return for lots of older Irish player in his first 3-4 years in charge. At some point you just have to move on and play younger players. Just like now, if Murphy hadn't retired I reckon he'd be involved in every qualifier this campaign. Back then Tony Cascarino who could barely move in '97 , was still being trotted out by '99. McCarthy is a horribly conservative manager and make no bones about it, he did everything in his power to hold off this 'rebuild' for as long as possible. 

The difference in quality of player waiting in the wings between then and now is massive. McCarthy had lots of quality players to call on after stalwarts like McGrath, Houghton, Townsend, Cascarino finished up. Back then you could put together an incredible young side in the early 00's. 

We could go down the route of the Ian Harte CB fiasco, the Roy Keane CB fiasco, but I've been there and done that on here. Just amazes me how often the sh*t show that it was under McCarthy at times is overlooked. His final 2 games as Ireland manager are more or less written out of history, yet he cost us that campaign. 

Roy Keane at CB LOL Our Mick Clap
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hans Moleman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Aug 2019 at 8:33am
Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

Originally posted by Banjaxed Banjaxed wrote:

Originally posted by Healy52003 Healy52003 wrote:

Originally posted by delgado delgado wrote:

whats the odds mick getting us to the euros and does reasonably well ,Kenny gets job makes a mess of it and they bring mccarthy .

Mick could stay on in a consultant type of role ??

If Mick gets us to the Euros, he's guaranteed a bottom half premier League/top half championship gig. 

He'll still be young enough to want another crack at club football. He wont be hanging around. I'd say those are his short term goals and why he wants/needs ireland gig to go as well as possible. 


If Mick gets these lads to the Euros he will have his pick of teams! Barcelona, Real, Juve...

Tbf to McCarthy he had those big club options before coming back to us. He just felt he had unfinished business and loves his country. Those huge offers will be waiting for him next season, successful qualifying campaign or not.
"I called him an embarrassment to FIFA and to himself," .... He said 'No-one speaks to me like that'.... and I said, "well I do' and that was that."
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Aug 2019 at 8:47am
Originally posted by Hans Moleman Hans Moleman wrote:

Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

Originally posted by Banjaxed Banjaxed wrote:

Originally posted by Healy52003 Healy52003 wrote:

Originally posted by delgado delgado wrote:

whats the odds mick getting us to the euros and does reasonably well ,Kenny gets job makes a mess of it and they bring mccarthy .

Mick could stay on in a consultant type of role ??

If Mick gets us to the Euros, he's guaranteed a bottom half premier League/top half championship gig. 

He'll still be young enough to want another crack at club football. He wont be hanging around. I'd say those are his short term goals and why he wants/needs ireland gig to go as well as possible. 


If Mick gets these lads to the Euros he will have his pick of teams! Barcelona, Real, Juve...

Tbf to McCarthy he had those big club options before coming back to us. He just felt he had unfinished business and loves his country. Those huge offers will be waiting for him next season, successful qualifying campaign or not.
Even you would have to admit that getting this bunch to a tournament would be an incredible achievement. It won’t happen, of course, but the point stands!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hans Moleman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Aug 2019 at 8:55am
Well not incredible at all really. Chances are we are 2 knockout games against similar or even lesser opposition away from qualifying. Granted we will probably be away in the SF making things tougher but we could potentially go through those play offs even with 2 horrid 0-0 results and penalty shootout wins. I don't fancy us at all, but even the bookies have us around 50/50 to qualify at the moment iirc.

Now, if we were to make it through the group in the top 2 that would be a serious achievement for McCarthy. Either way though I've no doubt McCarthy is already fending off offer after offer from huge clubs. Rightly so after a phenomenal last few years in management.
"I called him an embarrassment to FIFA and to himself," .... He said 'No-one speaks to me like that'.... and I said, "well I do' and that was that."
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Newryrep Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Aug 2019 at 10:21am
We get it , you don't like McCarthy
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Aug 2019 at 11:35am
Originally posted by Hans Moleman Hans Moleman wrote:

Well not incredible at all really. Chances are we are 2 knockout games against similar or even lesser opposition away from qualifying. Granted we will probably be away in the SF making things tougher but we could potentially go through those play offs even with 2 horrid 0-0 results and penalty shootout wins. I don't fancy us at all, but even the bookies have us around 50/50 to qualify at the moment iirc.

Now, if we were to make it through the group in the top 2 that would be a serious achievement for McCarthy. Either way though I've no doubt McCarthy is already fending off offer after offer from huge clubs. Rightly so after a phenomenal last few years in management.
Lesser opposition? They would be tough to find! We both agree that this is a horrendous group of players in a group with two decent teams, were he to get out of it, or through a playoff system with three other teams he will deserve huge credit.
Qualifying for a major tournament without a midfield or striker would be miraculous.
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