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Trap junior View Drop Down
Robbie Keane
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Originally posted by lassassinblanc lassassinblanc wrote:

Originally posted by Trap junior Trap junior wrote:

Packie wasn't the best keeper was he?  Still can't forgive Shay Given for Euro 2012.    I read his autobiography and was utter selfishness to play in that finals.


Can't remember much of Bonner tbh, but I always think he was helped in fact we had a pretty decent defence during his time Moran,McCarthy, McGrath ahead of him they were hard to get through.

He was a tall enough and was decent on the high balls (Can't remember him being beaten much of hand). and had a decent long boot on him.


The penalty save though I think does gloss over a lot of his flaws though and probably makes us look upon him with more tinted glasses.

I'll agree Shay shouldn't have played 2012, in fact I don't think he should have come back. Still the best keeper we've ever produced his shot stopping and reflexes were superb.

P.S. haven't read his book any use? it be somewhere in the house


Shay was one of my favourite players but I lost a lot of respect for him for a number of reasons.  He was way better than Packie but it became clear to me he is a me feiner.  Coming back in 2015 was nothing short of a joke.  His autobiography was pretty poor and unmemorable bar the Euro 2012 story about his fitness.
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Points: 7675 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Devrozex Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Jun 2019 at 3:45pm
Originally posted by Drumcondra 69er Drumcondra 69er wrote:

Originally posted by Devrozex Devrozex wrote:

Originally posted by Ibaraki Ibaraki wrote:

Packie in Orlando v Netherlands 
 
And in Rome vs Italy.

Not remotely comparable. 
 
In what way? They were both pretty poor mistakes, albeit the 94' one was worse.
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Roy Keane
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Originally posted by Trap junior Trap junior wrote:

Originally posted by Het-field Het-field wrote:

Originally posted by Trap junior Trap junior wrote:

Still can't forgive Shay Given for Euro 2012.    

In fairness there was more than just players playing through the pain barrier. The nonsense for leaving Coleman at home etc made the tournament a real farce.


Dave O'LEARY was left out of the Euro 88 squad as was Liam BRADY.  I didn't have a big issue with Coleman as he was young and had a poor season at Everton.  Trap probably overtrained the players and should have dropped Dunne and Given and taken the decision out of their hands.

Green had been injured for a lot that season, and McShane had played very little. Coleman was young, but was not nearly as poor as had been suggested and could have been easily included. The narrative at the time made little sense to me.
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Paul McGrath
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Originally posted by Het-field Het-field wrote:

Originally posted by Trap junior Trap junior wrote:

Originally posted by Het-field Het-field wrote:

Originally posted by Trap junior Trap junior wrote:

Still can't forgive Shay Given for Euro 2012.    

In fairness there was more than just players playing through the pain barrier. The nonsense for leaving Coleman at home etc made the tournament a real farce.


Dave O'LEARY was left out of the Euro 88 squad as was Liam BRADY.  I didn't have a big issue with Coleman as he was young and had a poor season at Everton.  Trap probably overtrained the players and should have dropped Dunne and Given and taken the decision out of their hands.

Green had been injured for a lot that season, and McShane had played very little. Coleman was young, but was not nearly as poor as had been suggested and could have been easily included. The narrative at the time made little sense to me.


don't forget what happened to Kevin Foley extremely harsh I think he had a slight hamstring injury but would have recovered in time.
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Liam Brady
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Points: 1227 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cliffrichard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Jun 2019 at 4:05pm
2012 was an absolute pox of a tournament. Waiting ten years to qualify and the whole gig more or less over after one half of football. The Spain game was the pits.
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yeah once croatia scored their second we were hosed , misery 
The first time the Devil made me do it. The second time I did it on my own.
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Originally posted by Ibaraki Ibaraki wrote:

Packie in Orlando v Netherlands 
 

I think i have repressed that bad memory , how the hell did i forget that LOL
The first time the Devil made me do it. The second time I did it on my own.
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Originally posted by Trap junior Trap junior wrote:

utter selfishness to play in that finals.
 

macateer did the same in Japan Angry
The first time the Devil made me do it. The second time I did it on my own.
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Liam Brady
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In the BBC Euro 2012 preview Garth Crooks picked out Ireland as definitely the worst team in the tournament. He got a lot of abuse at the time,but was spot on for once.

Edited by TonyNotJack - 19 Jun 2019 at 4:13pm
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Roy Keane
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Originally posted by cliffrichard cliffrichard wrote:

2012 was an absolute pox of a tournament. Waiting ten years to qualify and the whole gig more or less over after one half of football. The Spain game was the pits.

I think there may have been three players in our squad who were in “the shop window”, arriving in Poland unattached and uncontracted. That also didn’t take into account the number of players contracted to a poor Wolves team, which had just been relegated or how some of our key lads were carrying injuries. And, our spine was more or less what had been our star players at the World Cup a decade earlier.

Retrospectively, it couldn’t have gone any other way.


Edited by Het-field - 19 Jun 2019 at 4:14pm
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Ray Houghton
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Originally posted by Trap junior Trap junior wrote:

Originally posted by Het-field Het-field wrote:

Originally posted by Trap junior Trap junior wrote:

Still can't forgive Shay Given for Euro 2012.    

In fairness there was more than just players playing through the pain barrier. The nonsense for leaving Coleman at home etc made the tournament a real farce.


Dave O'LEARY was left out of the Euro 88 squad as was Liam BRADY.  I didn't have a big issue with Coleman as he was young and had a poor season at Everton.  Trap probably overtrained the players and should have dropped Dunne and Given and taken the decision out of their hands.

Given said he couldn't jump off his left leg FFS and was getting treatment off the German team doctor on the day of the Croatia match unknown to everybody.  He went way down in my estimation that day.
And boy, did that show in that game, especially the 1st goal when he took half the night to try and get to that header (which he would surely have saved comfortably if fully fit. 
 
As for Packie - I thought he was unlucky for Schillaci's goal in that he slipped just after parrying the shot from Donadoni.  If that hadn't happened, he would probably have been able to either get closer to Schillachi quicker to smother the shot or even just get back on his line. 
 
But the one from Jonk in Orlando that he let slip through his hands was definitely a dreadful moment for him and a sad way for him to finish his international career. Cry
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Liam Brady
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Points: 2028 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote armahibee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Jun 2019 at 4:28pm
 On the packie thing, he made a balls of a couple of goals in poznan in 91. Childhood hero of mine but you argue he cost us 90,92,94. 
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Robbie Keane
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Saipan
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Robbie Keane
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Shay Given has a book? He always came across as especially dense, I can’t imagine it is worth reading!
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Paul McGrath
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Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

Shay Given has a book? He always came across as especially dense, I can’t imagine it is worth reading!

Don't think it done much in sales tbh. Don't think I have seen in paperback form usually a sign of demand. 

I'd be interested in reading it more for his views on his time at Newcastle and saipan 
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Roy Keane
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Bonner in Orlando by a mile.

2012 we were sh*t and weren't getting out of the group whatever. 

In 1994 we'd beaten Italy and deserved to do so, and the sky felt the limit after that. 

But the tournament just completely petered out for us. 

Bonner letting that shot through was the point of no return. 

We were probably going to lose anyway, but once that ball slipped through him there was no way back and everybody knew it immediately.

Everything felt wrong about that day - we'd assumed it would be Belgium after the group and then they somehow lost to Saudi Arabia meaning it was the Dutch, who we knew were better than us, the venue, the line up, the horrible kit. 
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Roy Keane
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Closely followed by Terry Phelan in the same match, by the way. 

Urgghhh. 

Here Holland, have a free place in the quarter-finals on us.
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Packie s perfermance against England in Stuttgard is up there with the save from the penalty. He has cost us too though 
And it's come through now to mackay... and it's there
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