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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 2019 at 7:13pm
The same court admitted there should have been a points deduction, or to paraphrase them: we’re pretty certain West Ham would have been three points worse off without Carlos Tevez.

Something along those lines. What Sheffield United did or didn’t do is irrelevant. The faux Cockneys cheated and got away with it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Het-field Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 2019 at 7:21pm
Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

The same court admitted there should have been a points deduction, or to paraphrase them: we’re pretty certain West Ham would have been three points worse off without Carlos Tevez.

Something along those lines. What Sheffield United did or didn’t do is irrelevant. The faux Cockneys cheated and got away with it.

Arbitration.

And you can’t be “certain” of anything like that.

What Sheffield United did was totally relevant. They had a 9 point lead and messed it up. The rules were clear as mud and the transfer was ratified at the crucial point. And what is regularly forgotten is that Tevez was something of a non entity for most of the season.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 2019 at 7:40pm
It really isn’t.West Ham cheated and weren’t punished, it just so happens that Sheffield United were the ones with most to gain from them being properly punished. Having one of the best players in the world on the pitch undoubtedly helped West Ham and there is no way he would have signed without the skulduggery involved.

The most sickening thing in football is off-field cheating, something the powers that be have been ridiculously relaxed about. Birmingham City are probably  the first club to receive close to the deserved punishment for it, albeit for a different crime. Still, it is all off field cheating.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Het-field Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 2019 at 7:48pm
Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

It really isn’t.West Ham cheated and weren’t punished, it just so happens that Sheffield United were the ones with most to gain from them being properly punished. Having one of the best players in the world on the pitch undoubtedly helped West Ham and there is no way he would have signed without the skulduggery involved.

The most sickening thing in football is off-field cheating, something the powers that be have been ridiculously relaxed about. Birmingham City are probably  the first club to receive close to the deserved punishment for it, albeit for a different crime. Still, it is all off field cheating.

There are things there which are wrong

-West Ham were  punished twice. A £5.5 million fine in May and the Arbitration Award later for a combined £25 million. Or roughly what was paid on transfers by the club over the first 18 months back in the PL.

-There was no “skullduggery”. There were poor rules which all and sundry struggled to understand, hence the transfer being ratified in the first place.

-Tevez was actually in an out of the team until March. At the same point Lucas Neill entered the team full time, Mark Noble was promoted o the first team, Bobby Zamora scored 5 more goals, Robert Green pulled off a Keeper of the Century performance in a 1-0 win against Arsenal, James Collins and Anton Ferdinand were paired together in defence, and when West Ham picked up a crucial 9 points against Wigan, Bolton and Man Utd, Tevez’s presence was given the all clear.

-Sheffield United has a 9 or 10 point lead over WHU on St Patrick’s Day. 7 matches to go, including games against Watford, West Ham and Wigan at home. 


Edited by Het-field - 22 Apr 2019 at 7:50pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 2019 at 7:56pm
A laughable punishment, West Ham’s representatives were seen laughing at both.
How come nobody else struggled to understand the rules?
The rest is still irrelevant.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Het-field Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 2019 at 8:00pm
Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

A laughable punishment, West Ham’s representatives were seen laughing at both.
How come nobody else struggled to understand the rules?
The rest is still irrelevant.

The rules were clearly misunderstood otherwise the events of 31 August 2006 don’t happen. After the fact, superficial chimes of “third party ownership is verboten” is not the same as what happened at the time.

The rest is totally relevant, and is jus an inconvenience if you make the incorrect assumption about the rules in 2006.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 2019 at 8:12pm
Originally posted by Het-field Het-field wrote:

Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

A laughable punishment, West Ham’s representatives were seen laughing at both.
How come nobody else struggled to understand the rules?
The rest is still irrelevant.

The rules were clearly misunderstood otherwise the events of 31 August 2006 don’t happen. After the fact, superficial chimes of “third party ownership is verboten” is not the same as what happened at the time.

The rest is totally relevant, and is jus an inconvenience if you make the incorrect assumption about the rules in 2006.
It is irrelevant because West Ham weren't punished.For example, if they had finished bottom I would still have wanted them to be punished. Sheffield United's results aren't relevant to the rules being applied.Neither are West Ham's.
West Ham admitted to breaching the rules and their managing director admitted to telling a lie, the FA/EPL essentially left them away with, even allowing Tevez to continue playing after they confirmed the rules were broken.
The reason the players were allowed in was because of who they are, or were. It was seen as good for the EPL. It is indefensible, but West Ham fans have a history of defending the indefensible.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Het-field Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 2019 at 8:21pm
Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

Originally posted by Het-field Het-field wrote:

Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

A laughable punishment, West Ham’s representatives were seen laughing at both.
How come nobody else struggled to understand the rules?
The rest is still irrelevant.

The rules were clearly misunderstood otherwise the events of 31 August 2006 don’t happen. After the fact, superficial chimes of “third party ownership is verboten” is not the same as what happened at the time.

The rest is totally relevant, and is jus an inconvenience if you make the incorrect assumption about the rules in 2006.
It is irrelevant because West Ham weren't punished.For example, if they had finished bottom I would still have wanted them to be punished. Sheffield United's results aren't relevant to the rules being applied.Neither are West Ham's.
West Ham admitted to breaching the rules and their managing director admitted to telling a lie, the FA/EPL essentially left them away with, even allowing Tevez to continue playing after they confirmed the rules were broken.
The reason the players were allowed in was because of who they are, or were. It was seen as good for the EPL. It is indefensible, but West Ham fans have a history of defending the indefensible.

So you see the multiple issues at play when the powers that be were involved. That is what made this situation very difficult in the first place. And I’m not here to defend the powers that be. But Tevez’s key involvement came with the thumbs up of the powers that be, so the 9 points at the end of the season, which made the difference were legitimately won.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pauldaly1984 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 2019 at 8:30pm
Go on the didzi
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 2019 at 8:33pm
Originally posted by Het-field Het-field wrote:

Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

Originally posted by Het-field Het-field wrote:

Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

A laughable punishment, West Ham’s representatives were seen laughing at both.
How come nobody else struggled to understand the rules?
The rest is still irrelevant.

The rules were clearly misunderstood otherwise the events of 31 August 2006 don’t happen. After the fact, superficial chimes of “third party ownership is verboten” is not the same as what happened at the time.

The rest is totally relevant, and is jus an inconvenience if you make the incorrect assumption about the rules in 2006.
It is irrelevant because West Ham weren't punished.For example, if they had finished bottom I would still have wanted them to be punished. Sheffield United's results aren't relevant to the rules being applied.Neither are West Ham's.
West Ham admitted to breaching the rules and their managing director admitted to telling a lie, the FA/EPL essentially left them away with, even allowing Tevez to continue playing after they confirmed the rules were broken.
The reason the players were allowed in was because of who they are, or were. It was seen as good for the EPL. It is indefensible, but West Ham fans have a history of defending the indefensible.

So you see the multiple issues at play when the powers that be were involved. That is what made this situation very difficult in the first place. And I’m not here to defend the powers that be. But Tevez’s key involvement came with the thumbs up of the powers that be, so the 9 points at the end of the season, which made the difference were legitimately won.
West Ham cheated, lied about the cheating, got a paltry punishment and then had the gall to pretend to be the victims. I find the points won or not as a result of Tevez to be irrelevant, although others didn't. If he had spent the season injured I would still have expected them to be properly punished for deliberately breaking the rules.
The reason Tevez got the 'thumbs up' was because West Ham had lied during his registration.

Anyway, this is the Dave McGoldrick thread. I will leave at that, other than to say West Ham really are ****s.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lenny82 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 2019 at 9:05pm
His 2nd goal was a screamer. Is he only there on a one year deal?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Het-field Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 2019 at 9:14pm
Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

Originally posted by Het-field Het-field wrote:

Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

Originally posted by Het-field Het-field wrote:

Originally posted by pre Madonna pre Madonna wrote:

A laughable punishment, West Ham’s representatives were seen laughing at both.
How come nobody else struggled to understand the rules?
The rest is still irrelevant.

The rules were clearly misunderstood otherwise the events of 31 August 2006 don’t happen. After the fact, superficial chimes of “third party ownership is verboten” is not the same as what happened at the time.

The rest is totally relevant, and is jus an inconvenience if you make the incorrect assumption about the rules in 2006.
It is irrelevant because West Ham weren't punished.For example, if they had finished bottom I would still have wanted them to be punished. Sheffield United's results aren't relevant to the rules being applied.Neither are West Ham's.
West Ham admitted to breaching the rules and their managing director admitted to telling a lie, the FA/EPL essentially left them away with, even allowing Tevez to continue playing after they confirmed the rules were broken.
The reason the players were allowed in was because of who they are, or were. It was seen as good for the EPL. It is indefensible, but West Ham fans have a history of defending the indefensible.

So you see the multiple issues at play when the powers that be were involved. That is what made this situation very difficult in the first place. And I’m not here to defend the powers that be. But Tevez’s key involvement came with the thumbs up of the powers that be, so the 9 points at the end of the season, which made the difference were legitimately won.
West Ham cheated, lied about the cheating, got a paltry punishment and then had the gall to pretend to be the victims. I find the points won or not as a result of Tevez to be irrelevant, although others didn't. If he had spent the season injured I would still have expected them to be properly punished for deliberately breaking the rules.
The reason Tevez got the 'thumbs up' was because West Ham had lied during his registration.

Anyway, this is the Dave McGoldrick thread. I will leave at that, other than to say West Ham really are ****s.

The issue of the “lie” is still disputed as it was never adequately tested in the course of the case. It was asserted, and it was never rebutted as it was never given a chance to be rebutted, in the normal course where natural justice prevails. So that also can’t be stated factually, and it was certainly not the case that there was an admission.

I have laid out my points on the rules, and I have said what I said. Like you said, it’s a thread about David McGoldrick, and I’m also going to leave it there.


Edited by Het-field - 22 Apr 2019 at 9:15pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baldrick Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 2019 at 9:15pm
To be fair I think PM left it there first :)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pre Madonna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 2019 at 9:19pm
Why is he called 'the Didzi'? I have seen it mentioned a couple of times.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The O'Shea Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 2019 at 9:31pm
Originally posted by Lenny82 Lenny82 wrote:

His 2nd goal was a screamer. Is he only there on a one year deal?

Originally yes, but they sensibly extended it. It'll be interesting to see how he does in the Premier League next year, I dont think he'll score more than 5-8 goals, but he has the ability to be an effective link man.
We're decent enough..
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gerry Geary Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Apr 2019 at 1:36am
His partnership with Hogan is really good. We need the 4 in the premier league.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote amccarten313 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Apr 2019 at 3:14pm
Originally posted by Gerry Geary Gerry Geary wrote:

His partnership with Hogan is really good. We need the 4 in the premier league.
 
I like Hogan, but will sheff u try and buy him? feel like he hasn't exactly set the world on fire since joining, I know madine is only on loan but hes certainly behind mcgoldrick and sharp, feel like them buying him becomes less likely if they go up. not sure what his next move should be, would be interesting if both sheff u and villa go up bc then I don't think he would be in either's plans
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bham_McDermott Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Apr 2019 at 6:30pm
Can see him staying at champ level if he is forced out, maybe to Warnock's Cardiff when they go… although Wilder doesn't seem the kind of bloke to force a player out if he has done a job. 

Where was I think Norwich would be a lot more cut throat to players that took them up, in their summer transfer policy.
I don't agree with THAT, in the workplace!
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