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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote coyne Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Jan 2019 at 8:23pm
Originally posted by Territorial Territorial wrote:

Originally posted by coyne coyne wrote:

You've done it now HB. You've done the thing he's most allergic to and provided facts.

He'll now beat you down with irrelevant numbers and articles, prepare yourself LOL
Well it's tempting, but even I bow down to the superior "beating down" qualities of your very own Danny Invincibile in such matters.

Speaking of whom.... Wink

Is there another "Danny Invincible" out there? Or has your DI changed his tune since October 2017?

For here is what he posted on another site, wrt Conor Tee of Leicester City, son of an English-born mother, whose own mother (CT's grandmother) was Mayo-born (my emphasis):

From Danny Invincibile Mk.I - 
[Conor's] uncle's statement is technically correct. He's quoted as saying:

"[Conor] wants to play for Ireland and the Leicester Under 18 manager has been in contact with the FAI. If he was to play, he would actually qualify through his granny as Maureen [his mother] was born in England before we moved home not long after."

Tee's mother is an automatic Irish national from birth on account of the fact that she was born to Irish citizens who were born in Ireland - I don't think the uncle is denying that - but as she herself was not born in Ireland, Tee's birth would have to be registered in the Foreign Births Register for him to acquire Irish citizenship. The article 7 criteria would apply to him then as he isn't a national from birth and the only criterion he satisfies is 7(c), relating to grandparentage from the territory of the relevant association.

"The lines are open, and I'm waiting for your call, Danny!" LOL

Guess what Terri.
DI thinks Eric Dier is crap. Whats your thoughts on this
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gazurtoids Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Jan 2019 at 10:32pm
Jack Clark at Leeds eligible? ...Jack sounds a bit Irish, I'm sure I've met a few
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The O'Shea Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jan 2019 at 12:02am
I honestly can't believe you're persisting with this. Your argument is entirely conjecture-based, you have absolutely no evidence to back it up. Our position on the other hand is backed by concrete examples. Essentially, you rely on a literal interpretation of the statutes, apparently completely oblivious to the fact that laws are often not interpreted literally (particularly in cases where a literal interpretation would lead to an absurd outcome, which clearly applies here....)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Danny Invincible Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jan 2019 at 4:03am
Originally posted by Territorial Territorial wrote:

Originally posted by Territorial Territorial wrote:

Originally posted by The O'Shea The O'Shea wrote:

Originally posted by Territorial Territorial wrote:

Should that be so, then FIFA may consider this person to be "acquiring a new nationality" (i.e. other than that the country of birth eg Australia, UK etc). And FIFA's rules are clear that for anyone acquiring a new nationality, the grandparent would have to have been born on the territory of the new Association which the grandchild wishes to represent. Therefore if the grandparent(s) was born in NI, then the relevant association would be the IFA, not the FAI.

I should add that I'm by no means certain about this, and although there may have been one or two individuals capped by the FAI at under-age level who did not satisfy this test (Adam Barton?), they may have been an oversight?

In any case, I'm pretty sure it has never been tested at "A" (senior) international level, for a competitive game at least.

There's no "possibly" about this. We went through it ad infinitum around a year ago and definitive evidence was provided to you repeatedly by both myself and Danny Invincible which you simply chose not to accept... Your refusal to accept it does not change the finality of the evidence, however, no matter how much you might wish it did.
Unless you can point to a clear flaw in my argument; or you can point to a specific adjudication; or until it is properly tested by an actual example, you cannot claim that it is "definitive".

I am saying it could still go either way.

UPDATE:

Is there another "Danny Invincible" out there? Or has your DI changed his tune since October 2017?

For here is what he posted on another site, wrt Conor Tee of Leicester City, son of an English-born mother, whose own mother (CT's grandmother) was Mayo-born (my emphasis):

From Danny Invincibile Mk.I - 
[Conor's] uncle's statement is technically correct. He's quoted as saying:

"[Conor] wants to play for Ireland and the Leicester Under 18 manager has been in contact with the FAI. If he was to play, he would actually qualify through his granny as Maureen [his mother] was born in England before we moved home not long after."

Tee's mother is an automatic Irish national from birth on account of the fact that she was born to Irish citizens who were born in Ireland - I don't think the uncle is denying that - but as she herself was not born in Ireland, Tee's birth would have to be registered in the Foreign Births Register for him to acquire Irish citizenship. The article 7 criteria would apply to him then as he isn't a national from birth and the only criterion he satisfies is 7(c), relating to grandparentage from the territory of the relevant association.

(See also Article 7, page 71, of the relevant FIFA Regulations: https://resources.fifa.com/mm/document/affederation/generic/02/78/29/07/fifastatutsweben_neutral.pdf )




Hi Terri, I've been on a bit of a break from forums for a while, but a little birdie told me you were chasing after me. Yes, that's me on Foot.ie too, and I'm truly flattered that you've been trawling through Foot.ie threads on eligibility to read my posts. EmbarrassedHeart

Anyway, to the point, what exactly have I said that you perceive to be contradictory? What did I say in October of 2017 that is supposedly contradicted? It is my understanding that, for the purpose of applying article 7(c) in the Irish context, FIFA regard the entire island as the "territory" of the FAI; they apply a purposive interpretation rather than a literal one.

The purposive approach to legal, statutory or regulatory interpretation is not something I'm just making up either. It has a long history in the legal tradition: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purposive_approach 

By the way, I note you never saw fit to respond to my rebuttal of your errors in understanding back last March: https://forum.ybig.ie/forum_posts.asp?TID=51293&PID=2085508&title=were-not-brasil-were-tuaisceart-ireann#2085508

Can it be assumed that you now accept the points I made? (I hope you did actually read the Kearns judgment along with articles 5-8 of FIFA's Regulations Governing the Application of the Statutes and that it proved enlightening for you.)

Originally posted by NIGreenWall NIGreenWall wrote:

Originally posted by The O'Shea The O'Shea wrote:

Originally posted by Territorial Territorial wrote:

Originally posted by The O'Shea The O'Shea wrote:

Originally posted by Territorial Territorial wrote:

Should that be so, then FIFA may consider this person to be "acquiring a new nationality" (i.e. other than that the country of birth eg Australia, UK etc). And FIFA's rules are clear that for anyone acquiring a new nationality, the grandparent would have to have been born on the territory of the new Association which the grandchild wishes to represent. Therefore if the grandparent(s) was born in NI, then the relevant association would be the IFA, not the FAI.

I should add that I'm by no means certain about this, and although there may have been one or two individuals capped by the FAI at under-age level who did not satisfy this test (Adam Barton?), they may have been an oversight?

In any case, I'm pretty sure it has never been tested at "A" (senior) international level, for a competitive game at least.

There's no "possibly" about this. We went through it ad infinitum around a year ago and definitive evidence was provided to you repeatedly by both myself and Danny Invincible which you simply chose not to accept... Your refusal to accept it does not change the finality of the evidence, however, no matter how much you might wish it did.
Unless you can point to a clear flaw in my argument; or you can point to a specific adjudication; or until it is properly tested by an actual example, you cannot claim that it is "definitive".

I am saying it could still go either way.

The clear flaw(s) in your argument were tirelessly laid out for you already, you still chose to ignore them. The easiest way to sum it up is with two simple examples; Alex Bruce and Adam Barton.


How many times has it so be said that Alex Bruce qualifies for the ROI through his ROI born grandparent on his mothers side irrespective of the NI born grandparent on his fathers side.

https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/bruce-junior-plots-irish-future-19280

Adam Barton as you correctly say has no ROI link and played for your U21's based on his NI born grandparent, as far as the FAI are concerned there is no difference, FIFA don't look into the intricacies of all its members citizenship laws so it would be up to the IFA to raise a query with FIFA to see if the FAI's policy is correct or not.
 

Your notion that Barton may not have been eligible, despite having represented us in an under-21 friendly and four competitive qualification games for the European Under-21 Championship, is conspiracy theory. The FAI aren't sloppy with capping players in competitive games. It'd be a serious breach of rules and would be punished if found out. Barton's appearance in multiple competitive games is evidence of his eligibility - that reasonably satisfies the burden of proof here - unless you can supply some evidence to the contrary. If you can't, it's reasonable to assume he's eligible, based on the evidence.  

So, it was reported that Alex Bruce actually has a southern grandparent. Any idea where this alleged grandparent is from? I'd only ever seen it reported that he had a grandparent from Bangor when it came to media explanations for his eligibility for both the FAI and IFA. Can we be certain the Birmingham Mail picked up the facts of his case correctly? Media outlets are notorious for misreporting facts on eligibility matters. (For what's it's worth, the FAI's Disciplinary Control Unit confirmed to me in March of 2015 that Bruce was fully eligible to play for the FAI.)

To suggest FIFA don't concern themselves with the specifics of states' nationality laws is nonsense. They have to in order to know whether articles other than just article 5 should apply to a player wishing to play for an international team. And what do you think the Players' Status Committee spend their time doing for months after a player requests a switch of association and before they approve the request?

Originally posted by Luis Amor Rodriguez Luis Amor Rodriguez wrote:

Fact is, for all the abuse you're giving Terri, he's correct. 

The selection of players apparently eligible for Ireland solely through a NI born grandparent is a grey area for the reasons he concisely and cogently points out about 3 pages back - just look at the wording of the various FIFA statutes and ROI citizenship rules (if you want good bed-time reading material).  

AFAIK, no such player has played a competitive senior international for ROI.  

However, if it were tested, my expectation is that a fudge would be made and the player would be ruled eligible. 

I appreciate we're re-hashing a discussion that was done to death here a year or so ago.  
 

Whether or not a player who fits the criteria under discussion has played a competitive senior international for us is irrelevant. Adam Barton played in four competitive under-21 games. Competitive means competitive, whether that's senior or under-age. The eligibility rules apply equally to all competitive age groups.

If it were tested, Barton would be ruled eligible not because of any "fudge". It would because FIFA apply a purposive (rather then literal) approach to interpretation of the relevant regulation in the FAI's case and Barton is fully eligible under such an interpretation. 

Originally posted by Territorial Territorial wrote:

With the Kearns case, for instance, the CAS came down on the side of the FAI only, since that accorded with their strict interpretation of FIFA's rules - i.e. no "fudge" there.
 

"Only" because the FAI's position accorded with the rules? LOL The rules are pretty crucial. A dispute over them - due to a so obviously erroneous IFA interpretation - was the whole basis of the case. The case was never going to go any other way than the way it did, because the IFA erroneously thought article 16 (now article 6) applied to Kearns in respect of his eligibility to play for the FAI. Reality is that only article 15 (now article 5) applied to him in respect of his eligibility to play for the FAI. What other interpretation was possible?

Edited by Danny Invincible - 12 Jan 2019 at 5:00am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote horsebox Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jan 2019 at 10:35am
Originally posted by Territorial Territorial wrote:

Originally posted by horsebox horsebox wrote:

Jimmy Dunne and Michael O'Connor are 2 other players currently being poached by the O'Neill.

I'm sure there are many others.

Bottom line is O'Neill is poaching players from the ROI no matter what spin you put on it.
Michael is speaking to foreign-born players who, assuming they qualify for British nationality, are then eligible to represent the IFA by virtue of their NI-born grandparent(s).

Whereas we are talking about foreign-born players who as Irish nationals are looking to represent the FAI without having the requisite ROI-born grandparent(s) (or Irish born parents).

Either you lack the intelligence to see the difference, or the integrity to accept it, but whichever it is, you're only making yourself look silly.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The O'Shea Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jan 2019 at 12:47pm
It's also worth noting that Bailey Peackock-Farrell (who qualifies through his Enniskillen-born grandfather) was very recently approached by the FAI only to turn them down. So if Barton and Bruce were somehow actually ineligible despite the FAI picking them repeatedly, then they haven't learned their lesson.... Now the logical conclusion to this would be that there is no eligibility issue whatsoever; but in Territorial's world the FAI are dim-witted idiots, doomed to repeat the same mistakes over-and-over (all the while conveniently avoiding any sanctions from FIFA despite flaunting their rules...) LOL


https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/sport/soccer/proud-bailey-peacock-farrell-embraces-his-northern-roots-1.3621851%3fmode=amp

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Luis Amor Rodriguez Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jan 2019 at 3:43pm
Originally posted by The O'Shea The O'Shea wrote:

It's also worth noting that Bailey Peackock-Farrell (who qualifies through his Enniskillen-born grandfather) was very recently approached by the FAI only to turn them down. So if Barton and Bruce were somehow actually ineligible despite the FAI picking them repeatedly, then they haven't learned their lesson.... Now the logical conclusion to this would be that there is no eligibility issue whatsoever; but in Territorial's world the FAI are dim-witted idiots, doomed to repeat the same mistakes over-and-over (all the while conveniently avoiding any sanctions from FIFA despite flaunting their rules...) LOL


https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/sport/soccer/proud-bailey-peacock-farrell-embraces-his-northern-roots-1.3621851%3fmode=amp


BPF was approached by Noel King at U21.  He was not approached by senior management to be considered for a senior competitive cap.  Therefore that example does not change the position or add anything to the discussion unfortunately.  

Taken one step further, it might be considered odd that BPF was not approached by senior management when he was playing GK for one of the best Championship teams (a position we're not laden down with quality for).

Senior management also omitted to contact George Saville and Jamal Lewis, despite both featuring regularly at Championship level (and more recently playing better than any of our lot in the Aviva Ouch).  

Possibly we can put these failures down to inadvertent and negligent scouting at senior level, but they do seem odd omissions. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The O'Shea Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jan 2019 at 4:14pm
Originally posted by Luis Amor Rodriguez Luis Amor Rodriguez wrote:

Originally posted by The O'Shea The O'Shea wrote:

It's also worth noting that Bailey Peackock-Farrell (who qualifies through his Enniskillen-born grandfather) was very recently approached by the FAI only to turn them down. So if Barton and Bruce were somehow actually ineligible despite the FAI picking them repeatedly, then they haven't learned their lesson.... Now the logical conclusion to this would be that there is no eligibility issue whatsoever; but in Territorial's world the FAI are dim-witted idiots, doomed to repeat the same mistakes over-and-over (all the while conveniently avoiding any sanctions from FIFA despite flaunting their rules...) LOL


https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/sport/soccer/proud-bailey-peacock-farrell-embraces-his-northern-roots-1.3621851%3fmode=amp


BPF was approached by Noel King at U21.  He was not approached by senior management to be considered for a senior competitive cap.  Therefore that example does not change the position or add anything to the discussion unfortunately.  

Taken one step further, it might be considered odd that BPF was not approached by senior management when he was playing GK for one of the best Championship teams (a position we're not laden down with quality for).

Senior management also omitted to contact George Saville and Jamal Lewis, despite both featuring regularly at Championship level (and more recently playing better than any of our lot in the Aviva Ouch).  

Possibly we can put these failures down to inadvertent and negligent scouting at senior level, but they do seem odd omissions. 

You literally have no idea what you're talking about, do you? You do realise that U-21 level is a FIFA-sanctioned age group, don't you? That means that the eligibility rules relating to it are exactly the same as at senior level, they're indistinguishable....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Luis Amor Rodriguez Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jan 2019 at 4:50pm
No need to be gratuitously rude O'Shea.  We're all adults here.  Take a deep breath.  Look out the window.  And think happy thoughts.  

Yes, of course I realise U21 is a FIFA-sanctioned age-group.  However if we were to breach FIFA regulations in a U21 competition, the penalty (beyond a fine) would be a points-deduction in that competition (i.e.: at U21).  It would not impact any senior team campaign.

So BPF is in the Adam Barton category.  And, as I said, AFAIK no player in those eligibility circumstances has been capped in a senior competitive international for us.  Therefore, that risk has never been incurred at that level (e.g.: of a potential points deduction in an WC qualifying campaign, for example - a serious deterrent, one would have thought).  


Edited by Luis Amor Rodriguez - 12 Jan 2019 at 4:52pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Danny Invincible Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jan 2019 at 5:09pm
Originally posted by Luis Amor Rodriguez Luis Amor Rodriguez wrote:

No need to be gratuitously rude O'Shea.  We're all adults here.  Take a deep breath.  Look out the window.  And think happy thoughts.  

Yes, of course I realise U21 is a FIFA-sanctioned age-group.  However if we were to breach FIFA regulations in a U21 competition, the penalty (beyond a fine) would be a points-deduction in that competition (i.e.: at U21).  It would not impact any senior team campaign.

So BPF is in the Adam Barton category.  And, as I said, AFAIK no player in those eligibility circumstances has been capped in a senior competitive international for us.  Therefore, that risk has never been incurred at that level (e.g.: of a potential points deduction in an WC qualifying campaign, for example - a serious deterrent, one would have thought).  


You're peddling nonsense. Don't cry foul, play the victim and act like butter wouldn't melt when someone pulls you up on your disingenuous baloney, which you persist with again and again, despite having been corrected on the errors of your position months ago.

You're creating this false dichotomy between youth level and the senior team in order to try and make room for your groundless theory - it really is clutching at straws at this point - but the eligibility rules apply throughout all age groups.

Are you seriously suggesting the FAI would be happy to cap or would be careless about capping ineligible players in competitive under-21 games just because the penalty they'd incur wouldn't impact the senior team? I mean, the FAI deserve criticism on many matters, but they're not that unprofessional, for heaven's sake. Something like that would do huge reputational damage beyond the formal punishment FIFA or UEFA would dish out.

Edited by Danny Invincible - 12 Jan 2019 at 5:11pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The O'Shea Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jan 2019 at 5:19pm
Originally posted by Luis Amor Rodriguez Luis Amor Rodriguez wrote:

No need to be gratuitously rude O'Shea.  We're all adults here.  Take a deep breath.  Look out the window.  And think happy thoughts.  

Yes, of course I realise U21 is a FIFA-sanctioned age-group.  However if we were to breach FIFA regulations in a U21 competition, the penalty (beyond a fine) would be a points-deduction in that competition (i.e.: at U21).  It would not impact any senior team campaign.

So BPF is in the Adam Barton category.  And, as I said, AFAIK no player in those eligibility circumstances has been capped in a senior competitive international for us.  Therefore, that risk has never been incurred at that level (e.g.: of a potential points deduction in an WC qualifying campaign, for example - a serious deterrent, one would have thought).  

I'm not being "gratuitously rude", I'm repeating something that has been repeated on here a thousand times before. If it was your first time making the mistake, I'd have no issue with that; but it isn't, you continue to propagate your nonsense theory despite the fact you have been continuously corrected on it. That is, naturally enough, frustrating for those of us who actually have a rudimentary understanding of how FIFA's eligibility rules function.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Luis Amor Rodriguez Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jan 2019 at 5:25pm
Danny, another one who needs to take a deep breath, and not succumb to the temptation to throw your toys out of the pram.  We're discussing a rather boring, inoffensive topic; there's no need to be rude about it. 

Understand what's being said:  

- No one disputes the eligibility laws don't apply through the age-groups (those that are FIFA-sanctioned at least; they have no bearing on, say U15, afaik), so there's no need to suggest I'm saying that. 

- your view on whether FIFA would apply a literal or purposive approach to interpretation of the relevant FIFA statutes is simply that, "your view".  It's not the law, it's not been tested, and, for the reasons Terri outlined, departs from the actual wording of what the FIFA statutes say.  It is therefore a grey area.  I am merely repeating where this discussion got to 12 months ago.

- As it happens, if it were tested, I (unlike Terri afaik) believe FIFA would agree with your view.  But it's still just your view, (as well-considered and researched as it is).

- I can't say that I know what the FAI's position on it is or whether they've definitely considered it.  I do however find it odd that they never approach BPF, Jamal Lewis, George Saville or even Conor Washington at senior level - even for an exploratory chat.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Luis Amor Rodriguez Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jan 2019 at 5:30pm
Originally posted by The O'Shea The O'Shea wrote:

Originally posted by Luis Amor Rodriguez Luis Amor Rodriguez wrote:

No need to be gratuitously rude O'Shea.  We're all adults here.  Take a deep breath.  Look out the window.  And think happy thoughts.  

Yes, of course I realise U21 is a FIFA-sanctioned age-group.  However if we were to breach FIFA regulations in a U21 competition, the penalty (beyond a fine) would be a points-deduction in that competition (i.e.: at U21).  It would not impact any senior team campaign.

So BPF is in the Adam Barton category.  And, as I said, AFAIK no player in those eligibility circumstances has been capped in a senior competitive international for us.  Therefore, that risk has never been incurred at that level (e.g.: of a potential points deduction in an WC qualifying campaign, for example - a serious deterrent, one would have thought).  

I'm not being "gratuitously rude", I'm repeating something that has been repeated on here a thousand times before. If it was your first time making the mistake, I'd have no issue with that; but it isn't, you continue to propagate your nonsense theory despite the fact you have been continuously corrected on it. That is, naturally enough, frustrating for those of us who actually have a rudimentary understanding of how FIFA's eligibility rules function.

O'Shea, tell us where this situation has been tested?  

Go back to Terri's post (maybe 5 pages back) and explain how the logic is incorrect.  He's referred to the FIFA and Irish citizenship law there.  Look it up, and you'll see that on a literal interpretation, he's right. There has not been any decision on this specific case, and so, given the competing view based on a literal interpretation, it is literally "undecided", or a grey area.   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SuperDave84 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jan 2019 at 5:47pm
Originally posted by Luis Amor Rodriguez Luis Amor Rodriguez wrote:

Danny, another one who needs to take a deep breath, and not succumb to the temptation to throw your toys out of the pram.  We're discussing a rather boring, inoffensive topic; there's no need to be rude about it. 

Understand what's being said:  

- No one disputes the eligibility laws don't apply through the age-groups (those that are FIFA-sanctioned at least; they have no bearing on, say U15, afaik), so there's no need to suggest I'm saying that. 

- your view on whether FIFA would apply a literal or purposive approach to interpretation of the relevant FIFA statutes is simply that, "your view".  It's not the law, it's not been tested, and, for the reasons Terri outlined, departs from the actual wording of what the FIFA statutes say.  It is therefore a grey area.  I am merely repeating where this discussion got to 12 months ago.

- As it happens, if it were tested, I (unlike Terri afaik) believe FIFA would agree with your view.  But it's still just your view, (as well-considered and researched as it is).

- I can't say that I know what the FAI's position on it is or whether they've definitely considered it.  I do however find it odd that they never approach BPF, Jamal Lewis, George Saville or even Conor Washington at senior level - even for an exploratory chat.



I'm not sure we can say this. It could well be the case that they were quietly approached and said no. It could be that there was no point because the FAI knew they said no. It could be that the FAI didn't realise they were eligible until they were called up by NI.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The O'Shea Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jan 2019 at 5:54pm
It's not even relevant given all the other evidence, but you are of course right. The only reason we know Peacock-Farrell was approached is because he came out and said it (prior to that, Luis was pulling his hair out posting on here every other day about what a disgrace it was that the FAI hadn't approached him....) LOL. It could well be exactly the same case with the likes of Saville, Lewis, etc.
We're decent enough..
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Luis Amor Rodriguez Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jan 2019 at 6:15pm
Originally posted by SuperDave84 SuperDave84 wrote:

Originally posted by Luis Amor Rodriguez Luis Amor Rodriguez wrote:

Danny, another one who needs to take a deep breath, and not succumb to the temptation to throw your toys out of the pram.  We're discussing a rather boring, inoffensive topic; there's no need to be rude about it. 

Understand what's being said:  

- No one disputes the eligibility laws don't apply through the age-groups (those that are FIFA-sanctioned at least; they have no bearing on, say U15, afaik), so there's no need to suggest I'm saying that. 

- your view on whether FIFA would apply a literal or purposive approach to interpretation of the relevant FIFA statutes is simply that, "your view".  It's not the law, it's not been tested, and, for the reasons Terri outlined, departs from the actual wording of what the FIFA statutes say.  It is therefore a grey area.  I am merely repeating where this discussion got to 12 months ago.

- As it happens, if it were tested, I (unlike Terri afaik) believe FIFA would agree with your view.  But it's still just your view, (as well-considered and researched as it is).

- I can't say that I know what the FAI's position on it is or whether they've definitely considered it.  I do however find it odd that they never approach BPF, Jamal Lewis, George Saville or even Conor Washington at senior level - even for an exploratory chat.



I'm not sure we can say this. It could well be the case that they were quietly approached and said no. It could be that there was no point because the FAI knew they said no. It could be that the FAI didn't realise they were eligible until they were called up by NI.

Of course Dave. But to the best of our knowledge, what I have said is the case.  


Edited by Luis Amor Rodriguez - 12 Jan 2019 at 6:15pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Luis Amor Rodriguez Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jan 2019 at 6:19pm
Originally posted by The O'Shea The O'Shea wrote:

It's not even relevant given all the other evidence, but you are of course right. The only reason we know Peacock-Farrell was approached is because he came out and said it (prior to that, Luis was pulling his hair out posting on here every other day about what a disgrace it was that the FAI hadn't approached him....) LOL. It could well be exactly the same case with the likes of Saville, Lewis, etc.

BPF was approached by Noel King... as had previously been much discussed on here - that's hardly an approach which would inspire someone to join our side.  

Really MON and RK should have been dangling the carrot of senior football before him (particularly as around about that time we were playing a 30-something year old goalkeeper who's last transfer was for 50p).  

To the best of our knowledge (and these things usually get out one way or the other) none of these players were approached by senior management. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote coyne Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jan 2019 at 6:20pm
Has Will Buckley declared yet.
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