The Rugby Thread |
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Het-field
Roy Keane By Appointment to His Majesty The King Joined: 08 Mar 2016 Status: Offline Points: 10345 |
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Maybe if people didnt sneer at achievement, Ireland might actually realise its full potential.
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Cabra Hoop
Roy Keane Joined: 06 Feb 2012 Location: Royal County Status: Offline Points: 10781 |
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" BFC always gives me a laugh........ "
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Het-field
Roy Keane By Appointment to His Majesty The King Joined: 08 Mar 2016 Status: Offline Points: 10345 |
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While its part of it, I think there is undoubted jealously about the relative sporting success of the rugby team, and in particular its a cohort of football fans that have the biggest bee in their bonnet about it. The reason it is becoming more and more pronounced is down to the gradual decline in the fortunes of the Senior Men's Team. Ditto the fact that Irish provinces have been quite successful on the European stage.
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Bo Jackson
Liam Brady Joined: 31 Dec 2014 Location: 1st and Goal Status: Offline Points: 2396 |
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Or maybe the absolute incessant coverage of these achievements is beyond nauseating when compared with the failures of the same team in the same sport across the last 20 years. Rugby gets 7/8 pages in sports supplements, wall to wall coverage on radio/TV, for a sport that isn't anywhere on the same scale in stature or competition to football yet it is our National team that gets lambasted and looked down upon. I guarantee you, if Ireland fail to progress past the last 8 of the RWC, it will not be treated as a catastrophic failure in the column inches or airwaves. Nor will there be hard questions asked of the mgmt. or players on a level seen when Ireland got knocked out of Euro 2012. It would never happen but put all the best football teams/players/facilities in Leinster under the same "club" and they would generate better results in Europe. It might take a while but the Leinster Rugby team took their time before becoming a dominant force in Club Rugby. You can't compare like for like. Football is a global game and we can be rightfully proud of our achievements in the past and ambitions for the future. Nothing the Rugby team does has any impact on that for me. Rugby has done brilliant to capture the imagination of the public since the turn of the millenium. I followed the Irish teams exploits regularly myself up until 10 years ago. But let's not get carried away in these achievements. There is nothing the Irish Rugby team can do this September that will result in the same scenes post Italia 90. And it goes a lot deeper than the perceived bee in their bonnet you think this dislike comes down. |
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You don't know Bo?
2018 YBIG Fantasy Football Champ! |
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Shedite
Jack Charlton Joined: 09 Dec 2011 Status: Offline Points: 9795 |
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I really don't know why people can't support both, or just ignore the one they don't want to support.
Always seems to have to be an either/or. Same with GAA. There's plenty of room for all sort of sports in peoples lives
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Het-field
Roy Keane By Appointment to His Majesty The King Joined: 08 Mar 2016 Status: Offline Points: 10345 |
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There is always the post mortem after each WC defeat. But Ireland seem quick to get back up on the horse after that, and to renew expectation. Whether that is justified or not is to be debated. And there may well be some delusion amongst supporters ranks. But thanks to three Grand Slam in just over a decade, and 5 championships, it has undoubted increased expectation and coverage. Then there are some of the 'soft' achievements, such as becoming only the fifth side ever to beat NZ over a single touring series on NZ soil. And that ignores the European Cup wins by Munster, Leinster and Ulster since 1999
Sadly the last five years has been anything but inspiring for the Men's Senior team. Since the defeat to Denmark in 2017 the decline has been noticeable. The quality of football has been very poor, and the rustles have gotten worse and worse. Ten years ago there is no way we would have lost to Luxembourg and drawn with Azerbaijan at home. Armenia away, another one for the list. Or in friendly matches against Malta and Lithuania we are looking for late goals and strokes of luck to keep us going. Since November 2019, we have had two or three genuinely good results.
In fact, if you cast you mind back to 1999 when Ireland lost in Lens to Argentina there was a very serious post-mortem on the back of what was an embarrassing exit, after a very poor decade, where expectations around Irish rugby were in the basement. How did Warren Gatland deal with that after the form was carried into the opening game of the 2000 Six Nations, he changed the team's approach, capped five new players, and brought more back into the fold. After that the results changed. That was the springboard that brought confidence to the game. The reason 2012 was so heavily scrutinised was due to the omission of some good players, in lieu of war horses, and the fact that management doubled down on team selection even when it came unstuck. Rather than pivoting, Trapp made the most basic of changes to the team for the Kazakstan game, and we were fortunate to get away with a win that day. It came to a halt a month late when Germany hit us for six in Dublin. But, I can also suggest, in the opposite that if a QF exit does happen in France, the same discussion takes place i.e. 'where next', 'why this stage' etc etc.
Good corporate governance and forward planning is responsible for how that panned out.
How many people ever talk down our past achievements in football? Italia 90 will always be seen as the pinnacle. Even USA '94 we rightly celebrated the achievements in that, even if it didnt match 1990. Euro 88 could have been even bigger, we were unlucky. When we won underage tournaments in the 1990s the television cameras were there to witness it, and celebrate it appropriately. Perhaps we could have done even more of the WMT's achievement last year, but that tournament is yet to happen.
But is there perhaps a small fear that if, and it is a big if, Ireland win in France that it would somehow overtake Italia '90? |
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Cabra Hoop
Roy Keane Joined: 06 Feb 2012 Location: Royal County Status: Offline Points: 10781 |
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" BFC always gives me a laugh........ "
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t_rAndy
Robbie Keane Joined: 06 Feb 2008 Location: Ireland Status: Offline Points: 26163 |
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I would agree that rugby probably does get much a little more media coverage compared to other sports in comparison to maybe where its viewed amongst the general public but obviously there is a reason for it. Sponsors, downloads, viewership etc. would be behind it.
I think another element is that there are often real stakes involved when it comes to the international rugby team because the games are usually 6 nations where there is a trophy at the end of it for winner, World Cup the same and even the down under series we do play again the outcome of winning a series is it stays on your CV as an achievement. Only really the November games and rugby world cup build up games have a feeling that there not really something at stake. Football, unfortunately lately we have not been qualifying or going far in qualifying so we have lots of games where it feels nothing is really at stake so doesn't really capture the full imagine of the people and therefore also not the media.
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Borussia
Roy Keane Joined: 14 Oct 2010 Location: UK Status: Offline Points: 10608 |
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Saturdays game was the most watched sporting event in Ireland since 2017.
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irelandfan
Ray Houghton Joined: 13 Aug 2010 Location: Ireland Status: Offline Points: 3650 |
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For the 14th most played sport in Ireland very Impressive
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I'm the gaffer whatever I say goes.
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t_rAndy
Robbie Keane Joined: 06 Feb 2008 Location: Ireland Status: Offline Points: 26163 |
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Some viewership alright. For people who knock it as not popular outside of a certain cohort the numbers don't lie.
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Artie Ziff
Ray Houghton Joined: 10 Oct 2007 Status: Offline Points: 3565 |
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I would like to add that I watched it on a dodgy box so if Neilsen can update those figure it would be appreciated
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It would damage this forums' reputation
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B6 6HE
Liam Brady Joined: 25 Aug 2021 Status: Offline Points: 1028 |
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Yet, flipall play it.
Popular spectator sport with patrons who have no idea of the rulles. Its the genuine lack of passion. Irish Football team has fans. Rugby team has customers. I've been to many rugby games, the posh disinterested onlooker offends me more than any foul mouthed football fan ever could. |
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Het-field
Roy Keane By Appointment to His Majesty The King Joined: 08 Mar 2016 Status: Offline Points: 10345 |
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Why should you care how people support the sport of their choice?
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jamo1
Liam Brady Joined: 22 Oct 2009 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 1933 |
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Del Boy: You do know what a pyscopath is dont you Grandad
Grandad: Of course i know what a Pyscopath is, its a fella who dresses up in womens clothes. |
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zizu Kilbane
Jack Charlton Joined: 23 Oct 2007 Location: Ireland Status: Offline Points: 8327 |
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They're a very impressive team with an equally impressive coaching staff behind them. I like Andy Farrell. He has a bit of that Jack Charlton -Northern English-Doesnt suffer fools likely, quality to him.
If you look at the under 20s, they've done back to back to grandslams now. The conveyor belt of talent is there so we could be the cusp of a period of unprecedented Irish dominance. The Italians are now even overtaking the Scots and Welsh at this level which is gas! Could be us and France for the next while. As for the hyperbole merchants like Sweeney in the Indo on Saturday, no they are not the greatest irish team ever in any sport. This nonsense actually does a disservice to what they've just achieved. Maybe if the go and win the WC in the autumn they can be in the conversation. Ultimately rugby is played by approximately 10 competitive nations in the world, and that has to be factored in to any debate on this topic. For context we were sixth (SIXTH) in the FIFA world rankings under Jack back in the early 90s
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"Sometimes, sh*t happens, someone's gotta deal with it, and who ya gonna call?"
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Shedite
Jack Charlton Joined: 09 Dec 2011 Status: Offline Points: 9795 |
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longford claret
500 Club la la la Joined: 31 Dec 2016 Location: Longford Status: Offline Points: 530 |
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Ireland U20s also beat England at the weekend to claim a second successive 6 Nations and Grand Slam.
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