English Clubs and New Stadiums

Terri, Arsenal have been on a terminal decline since they moved stadiums. When they left Highbury they were Champions League finalists and had won several titles in the preceding years (including the “invincibles”). Since leaving they have won two FA Cups, but have fallen off the top table, and they have become almost an “upper mid-table club”. In fact, their star has fallen so much that numerous players have left for major UK rivals since they moved. It’s a long time since their top players were only leaving for Barca and Juve.

Edited by Territorial - 29 Apr 2020 at 4:50pm

Shedite wrote: Territorial wrote: Those questioning why clubs like Everton should bother trying to keep up with the Big Clubs by moving to a new stadium, might like to consider this report by Kieran Maguire, football expert at the University of Liverpool School of Management. Not sure where ya got that list, the Deloitte money list is the definitive guide.

Jackal wrote: The problem with these new stadiums is the people you lose and the people that replace them. A lot of Arsenal's normal fans were priced out and replaced with tourists and non traditional fans.

Jackal wrote: What facilities has the Emirates got that Highbury didn't have. I mean from a fan point of view? All you need is a seat, a chipper, a bar and a toilet. What more do people want or need going to match? I understand the increase in capacity for tourists.

According to Territorial's logic you need more corporate boxes to get top 6 - that's what got Man City over the line 

Territorial wrote: Het-field wrote: Terri, Arsenal have been on a terminal decline since they moved stadiums. When they left Highbury they were Champions League finalists and had won several titles in the preceding years (including the “invincibles”). Since leaving they have won two FA Cups, but have fallen off the top table, and they have become almost an “upper mid-table club”. In fact, their star has fallen so much that numerous players have left for major UK rivals since they moved. It’s a long time since their top players were only leaving for Barca and Juve. With Spurs, it’s too early to tell whether this will be a major build in their efforts to actually win trophies. But I would have considered their first season in their new ground to be mixed. Also, Leicester have played in several divisions since their move to their new stadium after leaving Filbert Street. They dropped quickly before rising to win the PL. In the old days, when there wasn't a huge amount of money in the game and the teams were more equal in wealth, good management was the key to significant success - see eg Brian Clough. These days it isn't enough to have good management, you also need to give your management the resources (money) to go with it - see eg Klopp at Liverpool or Guardiola at City. Arsenal's problem was that they financed their move at the expense of their team, just at the very time when Wenger began to lose his touch. It was inevitable that they would fall back. But even then, they've still managed to keep well ahead of middling teams like Everton, Newcastle, WHU or Villa. Spurs meantime had excellent management in Redknapp and Poch, who managed to punch above their weight on a restricted playing budget for 5 or 6 seasons. But as we're now seeing, they've not been able to keep it up permanently. For as my figures from my earlier post clearly demonstrate, it is exceptionally hard to compete consistently with the Big Boys unless you also have the financial muscle to keep up with them. And with TV money still relatively equally distributed, and new billionaire owners prevented from just pouring money into clubs like a decade or two ago, then the need for clubs to generate their own increased revenues is becoming ever more vital in that respect. On which point, a large, modern, well-designed stadium is a crucial component for entering the Financial Big League. Otherwise such well-known tightwads as the Glazers, Kronke and Lewis/Levy wouldn't be investing their clubs' money in such ventures - they can see the need/benefits over the long term. Which also explains why Forhad Moshiri, formerly of Arsenal btw, has made it his first priority to push through a new stadium for Everton after previous, half-hearted plans for a rebuilt or new stadium had repeatedly stalled, as the team foundered on the pitch. P.S. I'd love it if Arsenal's decline really was "terminal", but if Arteta turns out to be the manager people like Guardiola say he can be, then I could see him at least stopping the rot. Whether they then begin to climb back up would depend on whether Kronke releases the finance to get rid of the rubbish and replace them with proper players.

Jackal wrote: Territorial wrote: pre Madonna wrote: Football is about community, watching two clubs reliant on and part of their community is far, far closer to what the game is about than two multinational franchises selling something that isn't real. How to sell soul to a soulless people who sold their sold... My in-laws are all Evertonians to the core and I've also been to Goodison a couple of times recently, so I have some insight into what their fanbase thinks. So what do the fans need from a new stadium?