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Are You going to pay the Water Charge?

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Poll Question: Are You going to pay the Water Charge?
Poll Choice Votes Poll Statistics
40 [46.51%]
46 [53.49%]
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Hans Moleman View Drop Down
Roy Keane
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hans Moleman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2014 at 12:29am
Originally posted by MayoMark MayoMark wrote:

People in rural Ireland have been paying for water for years. 

The issue is that EVERYBODY has been paying for water in some shape or form. It didn't just magically appear in my house for the past 20 years - general taxes paid for it. This is just another form of double taxation. Only in Ireland would the 'sheeple' accept this nonsense.
"I called him an embarrassment to FIFA and to himself," .... He said 'No-one speaks to me like that'.... and I said, "well I do' and that was that."
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MayoMark Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2014 at 12:33am
Originally posted by Hans Moleman Hans Moleman wrote:

Originally posted by MayoMark MayoMark wrote:

People in rural Ireland have been paying for water for years. 

The issue is that EVERYBODY has been paying for water in some shape or form. It didn't just magically appear in my house for the past 20 years - general taxes paid for it. This is just another form of double taxation. Only in Ireland would the 'sheeple' accept this nonsense.

No, my point is people in rural Ireland have been paying for their water for many, many years. It has never been an issue. People in rural Ireland pay tax, too!
They finally did it man... They killed my f**kin' car...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Madferret Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2014 at 12:33am
Originally posted by MayoMark MayoMark wrote:

People in rural Ireland have been paying for water for years. 

EVERY citizen that buys as much as a lollipop throughout the ENTIRE country have been paying for water for years thru both indirect and direct taxation which after being collected by central govt (Revenue.ie) thereafter is re-distributed to local authorities. So we have ALWAYS paid for water, EVERYONE.

You are either a govt stooge or easily fooled.

I'm not against direct payment for water btw and water conservation is essential for the Planet, not just Ireland. But this process has been hamfisted and badly thought out with no need for additional Quangos. Plus they need to fix the abysmal under-invested leaking infrastructure first before having the cheek to ask citizens to pay even more for the stuff. 


Edited by Madferret - 02 Oct 2014 at 12:34am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote irishmufc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2014 at 12:38am
Originally posted by Hans Moleman Hans Moleman wrote:

Originally posted by MayoMark MayoMark wrote:

People in rural Ireland have been paying for water for years. 

The issue is that EVERYBODY has been paying for water in some shape or form. It didn't just magically appear in my house for the past 20 years - general taxes paid for it. This is just another form of double taxation. Only in Ireland would the 'sheeple' accept this nonsense.

Dead

You sound like some auld fella in his local on a barstool giving off about anything and everything. "Ah sure only in this country would ........" . How on earth do you know that something like this wouldn't happen in other countiries given the implication of your 'only in Ireland' post?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Clonbhoy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2014 at 12:38am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ireland4ever Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2014 at 12:44am
Originally posted by Madferret Madferret wrote:

Originally posted by MayoMark MayoMark wrote:

People in rural Ireland have been paying for water for years. 


EVERY citizen that buys as much as a lollipop throughout the ENTIRE country have been paying for water for years thru both indirect and direct taxation which after being collected by central govt (Revenue.ie) thereafter is re-distributed to local authorities. So we have ALWAYS paid for water, EVERYONE.

You are either a govt stooge or easily fooled.

I'm not against direct payment for water btw and water conservation is essential for the Planet, not just Ireland. But this process has been hamfisted and badly thought out with no need for additional Quangos. Plus they need to fix the abysmal under-invested leaking infrastructure first before having the cheek to ask citizens to pay even more for the stuff. 



Tell me, where will they get the money to pay for these infrastructural repairs?

Edited by Ireland4ever - 02 Oct 2014 at 12:44am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Hans Moleman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2014 at 12:47am
Originally posted by Madferret Madferret wrote:

Originally posted by MayoMark MayoMark wrote:

People in rural Ireland have been paying for water for years. 

EVERY citizen that buys as much as a lollipop throughout the ENTIRE country have been paying for water for years thru both indirect and direct taxation which after being collected by central govt (Revenue.ie) thereafter is re-distributed to local authorities. So we have ALWAYS paid for water, EVERYONE.

You are either a govt stooge or easily fooled.

I'm not against direct payment for water btw and water conservation is essential for the Planet, not just Ireland. But this process has been hamfisted and badly thought out with no need for additional Quangos. Plus they need to fix the abysmal under-invested leaking infrastructure first before having the cheek to ask citizens to pay even more for the stuff. 

This ClapClapClapClapClapClapClapClapClapClap

@Muff - You may think I sound like this, that or the other. It doesn't bother me tbh. To pick up one little indirect point I made, instead of actually giving an opinion on whether you think the current water situation is fair smacks of someone just looking for a silly argument.

In saying all that Muff, I stand over that highlighted part - if the government tomorrow brought in a new tax on taking a dump, some people would kick up for a day or two, then the rest of the sheeple in the majority would say 'ah that's grand, that dump tax is only a few euros a year' and the issue would blow over. This is Ireland.
"I called him an embarrassment to FIFA and to himself," .... He said 'No-one speaks to me like that'.... and I said, "well I do' and that was that."
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guest Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2014 at 12:53am
If we don't pay wont we get cut off? No choice really but to pay.
There was uproar over the household charges and now nobody seems to be bothered about the water charges,am i missing something? I haven't seen many complaints about it. People mustn't be as broke as they are making out to be. If they bring in any new charges i dont know how people are going to survive.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MayoMark Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2014 at 12:54am
Originally posted by Madferret Madferret wrote:

Originally posted by MayoMark MayoMark wrote:

People in rural Ireland have been paying for water for years. 

EVERY citizen that buys as much as a lollipop throughout the ENTIRE country have been paying for water for years thru both indirect and direct taxation which after being collected by central govt (Revenue.ie) thereafter is re-distributed to local authorities. So we have ALWAYS paid for water, EVERYONE.


Yes, and people in rural Ireland have been paying more. Because they pay the exact same taxes as everybody else ON TOP of their water rates. 
They finally did it man... They killed my f**kin' car...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote irishmufc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2014 at 1:01am
Originally posted by Hans Moleman Hans Moleman wrote:

Originally posted by Madferret Madferret wrote:

Originally posted by MayoMark MayoMark wrote:

People in rural Ireland have been paying for water for years. 

EVERY citizen that buys as much as a lollipop throughout the ENTIRE country have been paying for water for years thru both indirect and direct taxation which after being collected by central govt (Revenue.ie) thereafter is re-distributed to local authorities. So we have ALWAYS paid for water, EVERYONE.

You are either a govt stooge or easily fooled.

I'm not against direct payment for water btw and water conservation is essential for the Planet, not just Ireland. But this process has been hamfisted and badly thought out with no need for additional Quangos. Plus they need to fix the abysmal under-invested leaking infrastructure first before having the cheek to ask citizens to pay even more for the stuff. 

This ClapClapClapClapClapClapClapClapClapClap

@Muff - You may think I sound like this, that or the other. It doesn't bother me tbh. To pick up one little indirect point I made, instead of actually giving an opinion on whether you think the current water situation is fair smacks of someone just looking for a silly argument.

In saying all that Muff, I stand over that highlighted part - if the government tomorrow brought in a new tax on taking a dump, some people would kick up for a day or two, then the rest of the sheeple in the majority would say 'ah that's grand, that dump tax is only a few euros a year' and the issue would blow over. This is Ireland.

Being honest I don't really have an opinion on the water charge yet as we haven't received the packet hence why I come on this thread to see what the rest of you are posting. 

What annoyed me was this lazy assertion from you that ''only in Ireland' would we put up with this! I'm pretty sure you haven't lived in the 190+ countries to make that ludicrous statement. 

Do you really think there isn't at least one of  the 196 countries in the world that may be as politically docile as us?

It's not that I don't agree with your sentiment. I actually think we're a very conservative country with a sheeplike mentality especially when it comes to any EU issue where the government tells us what we should do and vote accordingly.


Edited by irishmufc - 02 Oct 2014 at 1:04am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Madferret Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2014 at 1:10am
Originally posted by Ireland4ever Ireland4ever wrote:

Originally posted by Madferret Madferret wrote:

Originally posted by MayoMark MayoMark wrote:

People in rural Ireland have been paying for water for years. 


EVERY citizen that buys as much as a lollipop throughout the ENTIRE country have been paying for water for years thru both indirect and direct taxation which after being collected by central govt (Revenue.ie) thereafter is re-distributed to local authorities. So we have ALWAYS paid for water, EVERYONE.

You are either a govt stooge or easily fooled.

I'm not against direct payment for water btw and water conservation is essential for the Planet, not just Ireland. But this process has been hamfisted and badly thought out with no need for additional Quangos. Plus they need to fix the abysmal under-invested leaking infrastructure first before having the cheek to ask citizens to pay even more for the stuff. 



Tell me, where will they get the money to pay for these infrastructural repairs?

Exactly where we were always SUPPOSED to have got it, from direct and indirect taxation which is collected by central govt (Revenue.ie) and subsequently re-distributed to Local Authorities whose function it was to provide both the infrastructure and supply of potable water.
This isn't revolutionary. It is exactly how most modern states organise themselves bar 'Murica with their institutionalised economic & social apartheid.

People are failing to realise the blindingly obvious that is happening here. I'll spell it out as clearly & concisely as I can;
  • The State (Incl Local Authorities) function/remit is to provide potable water to it's citizens in exchange for their (Citizens) agreement to comply with direct & indirect taxation obligations.
  • In this kip, successive govts have failed to live up to their side of the bargain by providing that infrastructure and adequate service (see Galway Cryptosporidium, Boil water notices, 40% of water lost thru faulty pipes,etc) and instead were financially profligate with the citizens payments (taxes direct and indirect) and wasted it on other "priorities". I.E.; the state has broken the implicit agreement in the relationship of citizenship & state.
  • Now, because successive administrations have squandered their own citizens money thru inefficiency, corruption and other "priorities" they are now turning around and using a Quango at remove from themselves to avoid political flack, to charge citizens ON THE DOUBLE. Your income tax or indirect tax will not reduce in correspondence to the proposed water charges. Therefore you are now paying twice. 
  • Whats worse, the government (because they now have additional income as a result of not having to pay the central grant out to Local Authorities for Water services & supply), now have even more of our money to fcukin waste as they know best.
  • There is no need for consultants and quangos. We have a (mostly) well paid and structured civil & public service infrastructure to deliver essential services already.
  • Make no mistake, this new Quango is a stepping stone to complete privatisation of an essential basic service. We are being softened up for that. Now I'm no raving Monster looney lefty by any means and I'm not against privatisation of governement services where it can be proven to benefit & secure the long term interests of citizens, but there are some essential basic human requirements, such as water, that should NEVER be handed over to be controlled at the whim of a boardroom, foreign or domestic.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Madferret Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2014 at 1:13am
Originally posted by MayoMark MayoMark wrote:

Originally posted by Madferret Madferret wrote:

Originally posted by MayoMark MayoMark wrote:

People in rural Ireland have been paying for water for years. 

EVERY citizen that buys as much as a lollipop throughout the ENTIRE country have been paying for water for years thru both indirect and direct taxation which after being collected by central govt (Revenue.ie) thereafter is re-distributed to local authorities. So we have ALWAYS paid for water, EVERYONE.


Yes, and people in rural Ireland have been paying more. Because they pay the exact same taxes as everybody else ON TOP of their water rates. 

Why are you trying to drive a wedge between urban and rural? I am a Dub but have every sympathy and some understanding of problems in rural Ireland having lived there and have many relatives.
I'm arguing on behalf of ALL citizens. You seem to be only concerned with the interests of one cohort. You're not in charge of the IFA by any chance are you?? I mean the farmers NOT the pub team.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote irishmufc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2014 at 1:17am
Originally posted by Madferret Madferret wrote:

Originally posted by MayoMark MayoMark wrote:

Originally posted by Madferret Madferret wrote:

Originally posted by MayoMark MayoMark wrote:

People in rural Ireland have been paying for water for years. 

EVERY citizen that buys as much as a lollipop throughout the ENTIRE country have been paying for water for years thru both indirect and direct taxation which after being collected by central govt (Revenue.ie) thereafter is re-distributed to local authorities. So we have ALWAYS paid for water, EVERYONE.


Yes, and people in rural Ireland have been paying more. Because they pay the exact same taxes as everybody else ON TOP of their water rates. 

Why are you trying to drive a wedge between urban and rural? I am a Dub but have every sympathy and some understanding of problems in rural Ireland having lived there and have many relatives.
I'm arguing on behalf of ALL citizens. You seem to be only concerned with the interests of one cohort. You're not in charge of the IFA by any chance are you?? I mean the farmers NOT the pub team.

LOL
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Madferret has replaced Sid Waddell as my forum crush.
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CB trying his luck after 1am suprise suprise.... Maybe tomorrow love, I'm tired ok...Yeah, yeah ok I love Your arse too..Heart
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote da scientist Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2014 at 7:12am
To the 18 people who voted yes....... off to the spastic list with ya with the other heros
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sham157 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2014 at 7:43am
I have no contract with Irish Water. If say O2 send me bill when I haven't signed a contract, it would go in the bin. If I was feeling particularly good humored on the day this bill was received, I may ring them to inform them of their error. I'm more than happy with my existing water supplier thank you very much (bar the addition of Fluoride) and have no intention of changing. As a taxpayer, I have always paid my water bill. Should Irish Water offer a better deal at some stage, I may consider changing to them. 
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