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Amateur Football - In crisis ?

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    Posted: 22 Sep 2015 at 9:08pm
Teams seem to be folding quicker than ever and not just at the lower levels of amateur football . Even Pemier sides are unable to field teams more than ever it seems with those who ive talked to saying a lack of proper commitment is killing them . Is amateur football declining beyond repair ? It's a different world now with kids being molly-coddled with playstations etc etc ...

Thoughts ??
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Doyler1993 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Sep 2015 at 9:57pm
I know of a few teams that have stopped entering fai and connacht cups due to the costs associated and just focus on the leagues
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ripbomb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Sep 2015 at 9:59pm
Involved at junior  level in the west of Ireland and commitment a huge issue. If say playing away on Sunday morning over an hour's drive away some lad's just don't want to know. Also the weekend match never takes priority anymore. Parties, stags. weddings, weekends away always seem to come first. The molly- coddled wans now even wont tog even if they have a slight head cold. What really drives me crazy is that during the summer break you would hardly see these fella's down the local but as soon as the season starts it's holiday and party time.Angry
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Green Devil Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Sep 2015 at 10:01pm

TBH the lack of basic coaching being given to these kids leaves a lot to be desired.

FFS I was watching the 10s/11s being coached in my local club this evening whilst I was preparing drills for my session with my Youth team and one group were doing a penalty shoot and the other group were practicing throw in's Pinch
 
The standard of coaching in this country is very poor for the most part, now while efforts are being made it simply isn't enough.
 
I know its easy for an experienced coach like myself to stand back an criticize but something has to give especially at that age!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote seanyshuffler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Sep 2015 at 10:09pm
Had over 20 tonight at training between junior and senior. There's probably too many tamsteur teams. Some small town might have two teams. I imagine in Dublin there's loads?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BigStrongMan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Sep 2015 at 10:11pm
The shoot out may have been a bit of fun for the kids.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Green Devil Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Sep 2015 at 10:15pm
Originally posted by BigStrongMan BigStrongMan wrote:

The shoot out may have been a bit of fun for the kids.
 
Would doing that at the end of training not make sense?
 
TBH, the two lads who were coaching the group are there to give a hand out and nothing more.
 
That sort of theme played its way through the session, think they went straight into a match then.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bitored Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Sep 2015 at 10:52pm
Dokter was trying to reduce the amount of amateur district leagues in the country, currently 32 down to 10 but met with stiff opposition. There's no doubt there are too many teams and leagues but when clubs won't concede a bit of ground for the betterment of the game it's hopeless.
Ideally we should have a proper structure of
10 district leagues
       {
3-4 Proper regional/provincial leagues (not glorified County leagues like now and they wouldn't have to be confined to provincial borders)
       {
2 regionalised first divisions of the League of Ireland acting as the top of the amateur game.

But hey that probably makes too much sense.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PanteirA Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Sep 2015 at 12:09am
We had a crazy amount of games forfeited in the top division in Kerry last year. At a League meeting in the summer , Killarney Celtic and St Brendans Park proposed a mandatory fine for clubs who couldn't field a team for whatever reason but it was rejected. Its no use to our bigger clubs who wish to do well in FAI junior cup etc , if they cant get enough game time. Its certainly an issue. I do think there are too many clubs in one regard and some clubs should merge. I think every junior club should have a B side.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Blue Man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Sep 2015 at 2:23am
Its getting to the stage where if lads are not getting games at clubs, instead of dropping to play Saturday football, they're going and forming their own clubs. Lads they drink with all sign from the initial club, play at a lower level with no commitment, have a laugh and the initial club then struggles for numbers. Baldoyle Grange United are a prime example of this.

Baldoyle were an established AUL club, title challengers before Sheriff's dominance started yet all the younger 1st team lads, Saturday players and Under 18s at the club went off and started Grange United which started 4 or 5 leagues below Premier A. 3 years later, Grange field 2 senior teams and an under 19 side while Baldoyle effectively folded as senior club . This year Grange got promoted to Premier A and amalgamated with the ashes of Baldoyle United. Now they're at a higher level and the commitment grows, coupled with Sheriff never going to lose a league game ever again, I can see lads jacking it in


Edited by Blue Man - 23 Sep 2015 at 2:25am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BigStrongMan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Sep 2015 at 6:28am
Originally posted by Green Devil Green Devil wrote:

Originally posted by BigStrongMan BigStrongMan wrote:

The shoot out may have been a bit of fun for the kids.

 
Would doing that at the end of training not make sense?
 
TBH, the two lads who were coaching the group are there to give a hand out and nothing more.
 
That sort of theme played its way through the session, think they went straight into a match then.
Yep,I presumed it was the end!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BabbsBalls Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Sep 2015 at 9:07am
Originally posted by Green Devil Green Devil wrote:

TBH the lack of basic coaching being given to these kids leaves a lot to be desired.

FFS I was watching the 10s/11s being coached in my local club this evening whilst I was preparing drills for my session with my Youth team and one group were doing a penalty shoot and the other group were practicing throw in's Pinch
 
The standard of coaching in this country is very poor for the most part, now while efforts are being made it simply isn't enough.
 
I know its easy for an experienced coach like myself to stand back an criticize but something has to give especially at that age!

I honestly think its more to do with the quality of the coaches than the actual training they are given. 

Some think that doing a course or two makes you a coach all of a sudden but thats not the case at all. You need a rapport with whoever you coach. Most volunteers are lads who bring their kids down to the academy and get roped into doing it. . and a lot of them have never kicked a ball in their lives. Lads who have played for 20 odd years and would be able to offer something mostly f**k off out of the game when they finish playing and its hard to blame them at times . Its a huge commitment if you want to coach properly . I have seniors at the minute and I can honestly say coaching is taking up as much of my time as my real job is  - putting on training sessions , preparing / planning sessions , thinking of stuff to keep squad / individuals motivated , set-pieces , planning around absentees and injuries etc. . . . it 24/7 at times so its hard to blame lads with families who won't get into it because you don't or rarely get paid. 

Youths and schoolboy football is a different kettle of fish obviously but I honestly fear for the future of amateur football here. Junior clubs that have quality , dedicated coaches are not filling their teams in a lot of cases. What chance do the clubs have where the coaches are shocking ?!!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Croftman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Sep 2015 at 9:59am

The coaching end of things is huge and there was a discussion here somewhere before about it. Doing the Kickstarts/Workshops are all grand and should be compulsory for anyone coaching but for those who want to go higher the costs are crazy. €300 for the Youth Cert and higher again for the others. If they want to get more qualified coaches they're going to have to do something about the pricing structure - think on the previous discussion there were comparisons made with England/Europe and we're charging so much more.

Also the number of leagues is too many. Clubs and leagues don't want to lose their identity but for the good of the game something has to give. Making leagues stronger and more competitive can only be good. This is more important at underage. In the majority of rural leagues, and maybe even in the cities, there are 3/4 strong teams (if even that), some ok and then some savage weak. You could go from having a tough game one week to winning 10-0 the following one - that's no good for anyone. Regional elite leagues for this are definitely something that should be done, picking the top 2/3 teams from closeby leagues and making a good competitive season. Again, the issue of identity occurs but for the good of the game it has to be done.
 
There's a competition which runs between the Kildare, Midlands, Carlow, North Tipp & Kilkenny leagues called the Midlands Cup. It runs along with the leagues own competitions but picks the top 2/3 teams from each league to compete against eachother and its a great success. There's Shield & Plate competitions too for the next tier teams. There's probably other competitions throughout the country like this but having seen how this works first-hand its a great insight into how joining leagues together on a fulltime basis could work (competitive & quality wise)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote horsebox Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Sep 2015 at 10:23pm
Originally posted by Green Devil Green Devil wrote:

TBH the lack of basic coaching being given to these kids leaves a lot to be desired.

FFS I was watching the 10s/11s being coached in my local club this evening whilst I was preparing drills for my session with my Youth team and one group were doing a penalty shoot and the other group were practicing throw in's Pinch
 
The standard of coaching in this country is very poor for the most part, now while efforts are being made it simply isn't enough.
 
I know its easy for an experienced coach like myself to stand back an criticize but something has to give especially at that age!


What does coaching have to do with it?

Back in the day it was jumpers for goal posts and training involved 'laps' and a game of ball (if we had one), in the dark and most likely in long grass and we loved every minute of it.

Now it's all weight kids, who don't want to put in the effort in Madrid jersey's, pink boots, astro pitches in flood lit lightening followed by 'treats'.

When I was in primary school I went to school an hour early with all my mates to play football with a tennis ball, followed by hours of football after school.

Excuse the pun but it's a completely different ball game now.

     
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JUICEBOMB Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Sep 2015 at 11:53pm
True,coaching has nothing to do with it....it boils down to a basic love of the game and lads now have more a love for boozing,staying in bed and not playing football!!!theres some really average/poor players now more or less dictaing if teams have games at all.
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